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PICList Thread
'car window project - [OT] safety'
1999\07\16@100420 by eplus1

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<BLOCKQUOTE AUTHOR="Wagner Lipnharski">
Much more dangerous that a crazy window is when you just close the car's
door violently with your 3 years old kid's fingers at the hinge...
ouchhhh!

Who never saw or experienced this terrible situation?
</BLOCKQUOTE>

I think only anal-retentive people with kids can fully appreciate the fear
that can build once you realize how many opportunities there are for your 1
to 3 or so year old child to get his/her fingers caught in the door jam when
you are closing a door or when the door has been left open and the child
pushes it closed or falls against it when playing "peak-a-boo" through the
crack.

It hasn't happened to my kids yet, but I was at the emergency room with my
wife (rose thorn in the eye while pruning) and we saw a little boy come in
with a hand that will never be useful again. Parenting is hell.

I also knew a lady that stopped driving because she started thinking about
how, on a long straight two lane road, all the approaching driver has to do
is move the wheel about a half inch towards you, and you are a windshield
bug...

Its good to be able to stop thinking sometimes. Intelligence is not a
survival trait.

James Newton, webmaster http://get.to/techref
spam_OUTjamesnewtonTakeThisOuTspamgeocities.com <.....jamesnewtonKILLspamspam@spam@geocities.com>
1-619-652-0593 phone

1999\07\16@101425 by Andy Kunz

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>that can build once you realize how many opportunities there are for your 1
>to 3 or so year old child to get his/her fingers caught in the door jam when

Experienced parenting trick (we have 7):

When loading/unloading/opening/closing car doors, we have a real simple
check that has (so far) kept all our kids from getting smashed fingers in
car doors.

"OK - HAND CHECK" at which all hands (except mine on the handle) either are
clasped together and set on laps (when getting in car) or into pockets
(when exiting car).

The only violator was my wife - her fingernail is almost back to normal now.

>with a hand that will never be useful again. Parenting is hell.

Isn't it, though, but I wouldn't trade it for anything (except CHEAP PICS,
eh Tjaart? <G>)

Andy

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Andy Kunz               Life is what we do to prepare for Eternity
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1999\07\16@104256 by eplus1

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<BLOCKQUOTE AUTHOR="Andy Kunz">
When loading/unloading/opening/closing car doors, we have a real simple
check that has (so far) kept all our kids from getting smashed fingers in
car doors.

"OK - HAND CHECK" at which all hands (except mine on the handle) either are
clasped together and set on laps (when getting in car) or into pockets (when
exiting car).
</BLOCKQUOTE>

Its a good idea and I do something like it with my three teenagers and 4.5
year old daughter but the 2 year old son just will not listen (no matter how
clear or loud I speak <GRIN>) so we moved the car seats to the other side of
the van from the door.

I was referring more to inside doors however, and I have rules about that
which I hope will prevent any damage:
1. never leave an inside door open (beat teenagers regularly to enforce this
rule <G>)
2. always keep child proof (yah right) covers on door knobs.
3. hold child when closing doors

Number 1 is a pain, but I haven't installed "locked open" devices on the
inside doors yet (new house) and I don't like any of the commercially
available versions I have seen. Any ideas for home made would be welcome.

I also took my eldest daughter to the kart track (and the stadium parking
lot for extreme driving lessons) and although she is a "wild child" and
regularly in 12 other kinds of trouble, she has yet to do any damage or even
stupid-stuff with a car.

I wish we could find better than our current automotive transportation
system anyway, did you know that we kill more people on the freeways every
year than died in 'nam? It's true. Also, more people have been killed on the
roads than have died in all the wars we ever fought (including both sides of
the civil war). Don't give you kids guns, but a nice car is ok.

Good luck with yours.

James Newton, webmaster http://get.to/techref
EraseMEjamesnewtonspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTgeocities.com <jamesnewtonspamspam_OUTgeocities.com>
1-619-652-0593 phone

1999\07\16@115850 by Andy Kunz

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>I wish we could find better than our current automotive transportation
>system anyway, did you know that we kill more people on the freeways every
>year than died in 'nam? It's true. Also, more people have been killed on the
>roads than have died in all the wars we ever fought (including both sides of
>the civil war). Don't give you kids guns, but a nice car is ok.

Remember, alcohol is the common factor in MOST fatal accidents, too.

Oh, and the drunk isn't usually the one killed.

Cigarettes are a waste of money, a waste of health, and takes the lives
(primarily) of the user.  Alcohol is a waste of money, a waste of health, a
waste of mind, and takes of live (primarily) of non-users.

I think the gov't went after the wrong target.

Andy

==================================================================
Andy Kunz               Life is what we do to prepare for Eternity
------------------------------------------------------------------
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==================================================================

1999\07\16@153347 by Eric Oliver

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My oldest just learned not to put her finger between the gate and support
post while opening.  No others involved. She put her finger between the
gate and hinge post and swung it open ( or closed ) and today her finger is
black and blue and she'll lose the nail. If that's the worst that ever
happens, I'll count my blessings.

Where's Tjaart been anyway ?

Eric

On Friday, July 16, 1999 9:13 AM, Andy Kunz
[SMTP:RemoveMEsupportTakeThisOuTspamMONTANADESIGN.COM] wrote:
> >that can build once you realize how many opportunities there are for
your 1
> >to 3 or so year old child to get his/her fingers caught in the door jam
when
>
> Experienced parenting trick (we have 7):
>
> When loading/unloading/opening/closing car doors, we have a real simple
> check that has (so far) kept all our kids from getting smashed fingers in
> car doors.
>
> "OK - HAND CHECK" at which all hands (except mine on the handle) either
are
> clasped together and set on laps (when getting in car) or into pockets
> (when exiting car).
>
> The only violator was my wife - her fingernail is almost back to normal
now.
>
> >with a hand that will never be useful again. Parenting is hell.
>
> Isn't it, though, but I wouldn't trade it for anything (except CHEAP
PICS,
{Quote hidden}

1999\07\16@203903 by Tracey DeChambeau

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In a message dated 7/16/99 11:59:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
RemoveMEsupportspamTakeThisOuTMONTANADESIGN.COM writes:

<<
Remember, alcohol is the common factor in MOST fatal accidents, too.

Oh, and the drunk isn't usually the one killed.

Cigarettes are a waste of money, a waste of health, and takes the lives
(primarily) of the user.  Alcohol is a waste of money, a waste of health, a
waste of mind, and takes of live (primarily) of non-users.

I think the gov't went after the wrong target.

Andy
 >>
Hurrah For Andy...Yes I am a smoker, I pay increased ins. premiums because of
it. Do the drinkers out there pay more for car insurance? Don't think so.
Tracey

1999\07\17@164724 by Tom Handley

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  I've been giving this whole issue of car window safety a great deal of
thought and I came up with an idea. What if you had the window mounted to a
vertical channel with teeth that interfaced with a rotary gear. Instead of
the standard methods using motors and sensing, suppose you added a crank
with a knob. I know this sounds radical but bear with me for a moment.
Basically, you apply a clockwise rotary (cranking) motion to move the window
up and a counterclockwise motion to move the window down. If you
accidentally stuck your hand in the window while cranking it up, you would
notice the pain and stop cranking. I know what you're thinking; "what if
someone else had their hand stuck in the window?". Well, you would probably
hear a scream or a loud, pounding, noise on the window. Anyway, I just
thought I would share my years of expertise on this problem ;-)

  - Tom

1999\07\18@203545 by Russell McMahon

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Tom,

Your idea is manifestly useless and clearly totally impractical - I'm
amazed that you would even consider raising it on such a high tech
discussion list.
To assist you in presenting more useful and appropriate ideas in
future I 've provided the following guidelines although these should
have been obvious to you immediately -

- No way to incorporate a PIC.
- No way to even incorporate some other inferior processor.
- Too cheap.
- Uses parts which can be made from low tech materials using
non-state-of-the-art fabrication equipment.
- Runs the risk of providing jobs for lesser skilled workers AND in
higher quantities than the alternatives AND (paradoxically) also
allowing a greater degree of craftsmanship in the final design. This
sets a dangerous and retro-gressive precedent for other designs.
- More liable to be maintained and repaired (AND at lower cost) by
end users than existing solution.
- Not subject to EMC compliance considerations so no prospect for
skim off by test houses, equipment manufacturers, regulatory
authorities, directive writers, and downstream consultants.
- Ease of infinitely variable rate of deployment and positioning not
consistent with features of system it is replacing.
- When 2 or more parties are involved in deployment and obstruction
there is no means of ensuring that latter party(s) are ISO9000 (or
equivalent) certified or adequately trained - while this may have
minimal effect on the outcomes experienced it will make guaranteed
traceability of the sources of the outcome a nightmare.
- You have specified a clockwise rotary motion to move the window up
which is liable to lead to a 50% failure rate to achieve a
satisfactory initial outcome for inexperienced users - while this is
liable to prove a boon to persons in the legal profession due to the
subsequent experience of confusion, dissatisfaction and reduction of
enjoyment of life experienced by their son to be clients it would
lead to a reduction of the availability of such persons in other
areas of useful litigation such as pain and injury caused by pouring
hot coffee into one's own lap while at a restaurant (I'm not making
this up!).
- Similar arguments apply to that above for the proposed
counter-clockwise rotary motion and subsequent action.
-As all digits on a clock manifestly change to their subsequent
states by appearing or disappearing essentially instantaneously  how
is it possible that there can be any relevant motion implied?
- Reliance on pounding on windows is liable to lead to otherwise
unnecessary breakage, damage and more pain, injury and litigious
actions (see above).
- Terms such as "crank" and "gear" are clearly inappropriate for use
in a PICLIST posting without at minimum prefacing the subject line
with [OT][Luddite] - please comply in future.




RM


From: Tom Handley <thandleyEraseMEspam.....TELEPORT.COM>

>   I've been giving this whole issue of car window safety a great
deal of
>thought and I came up with an idea. What if you had the window
mounted to a
>vertical channel with teeth that interfaced with a rotary gear.
Instead of
>the standard methods using motors and sensing, suppose you added a
crank
>with a knob. I know this sounds radical but bear with me for a
moment.
>Basically, you apply a clockwise rotary (cranking) motion to move
the window
>up and a counterclockwise motion to move the window down. If you
>accidentally stuck your hand in the window while cranking it up, you
would
>notice the pain and stop cranking. I know what you're thinking;
"what if
>someone else had their hand stuck in the window?". Well, you would
probably
>hear a scream or a loud, pounding, noise on the window. Anyway, I
just
>thought I would share my years of expertise on this problem ;-)

1999\07\18@232834 by Wagner Lipnharski

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> Your idea is manifestly useless...
[snip]
> >Basically, you apply a clockwise rotary (cranking) motion [snip]

Hey Tom, it was only me to recognize you were joking?
this is why whenever you joke you need to post the smilling face :)

Wagner.

1999\07\19@015550 by Dennis Plunkett

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At 23:28 18/07/99 -0400, you wrote:
>> Your idea is manifestly useless...
>[snip]
>> >Basically, you apply a clockwise rotary (cranking) motion [snip]
>
>Hey Tom, it was only me to recognize you were joking?
>this is why whenever you joke you need to post the smilling face :)
>
>Wagner.
>
>

Hey,
I think that the winding direction is wrong! Well in Europe it is the other
way

Dennis

1999\07\19@112126 by Andy Kunz

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>Hurrah For Andy...Yes I am a smoker, I pay increased ins. premiums because of
>it. Do the drinkers out there pay more for car insurance? Don't think so.

Not until they get caught a few times.

I do neither, but my insurance rates are outlandish because I live in New
Jersey.

Have you heard the new state motto?

It used to be "New Jersey and You - Perfect Together."  Now it's "New
Jersey - Leading the Fight Against Freedom."

Andy

==================================================================
Andy Kunz               Life is what we do to prepare for Eternity
------------------------------------------------------------------
EraseMEandyspamrc-hydros.com      http://www.rc-hydros.com     - Race Boats
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==================================================================

1999\07\21@080134 by Tom Handley

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At 04:00 PM 7/19/99 +1000, Dennis Plunkett wrote:
I wrote:
>>> >Basically, you apply a clockwise rotary (cranking) motion [snip]
>
>Hey,
>I think that the winding direction is wrong! Well in Europe it is the other
>way
>
>Dennis

  Dennis, you're right! My excuses are that I live in Oregon where it rains a
lot so I don't roll down the window often, I'm right-handed and I have to
crank
with my left hand, and left/right brain issues ;-)

  - Tom

1999\07\21@080137 by Tom Handley

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  Wagner, this is just a joke ;-)

  Russ' reply was excellent but it also touched on several issues that do
apply in the real world. What makes his reply absolutley `hilarious' to me
is that you have to of been `down that road' to appreciate it and I have ;-)

  - Tom

At 11:28 PM 7/18/99 -0400, Wagner Lipnharski wrote:
>> Your idea is manifestly useless...
>[snip]
>> >Basically, you apply a clockwise rotary (cranking) motion [snip]
>
>Hey Tom, it was only me to recognize you were joking?
>this is why whenever you joke you need to post the smilling face :)
>
>Wagner.

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