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'Standalone WAV Player ?'
1999\05\28@030918 by Seyler Jean-Yves

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               hello all big PICers,

My apologizes if this sounds too much [OT] ...

       Does any of you has big ideas about a stand alone ".WAV files"
player ?

I thought of a pic scrolling through addresses of a (big !) EPROM, the
outputs feeding a DAC (single resistors ?) followed by a filter and a
"power" amp.
The other PIC's inputs will allow me to choose between several messages ...

But, maybe, the audio quality would be rather nasty and I'd better switch to
an "ISD design" with sounds recorded directly from the audio output of my PC
?

Any comments will be welcome :-))

Jean-Yves

1999\05\28@032828 by Michael Rigby-Jones

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There was a project to do exactly this in a fairly recent edition of
Elector.  It used IIRC an AVR and an Atmel flash memory.  I have it at home
somewhere, if no-one else knows I'll email which issue it was tommorow.

Regards

Mike Rigby-Jones

> {Original Message removed}

1999\05\28@035145 by Seyler Jean-Yves

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               Thanks Michael,

       I have the paper but this project have a drawback : it can only play
one (big) message and I'd like to be able to play several ones !!!

Thanks for any other idea :-)

Jean-Yves

{Quote hidden}

> > {Original Message removed}

1999\05\28@040636 by Michael Rigby-Jones

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I wouldn't have though it would be very hard to modify it.  You could use
the first X number of bytes of the Flash RAM to store an index table of the
WAVs.  The PIC or AVR would check some pins to see what number WAV is
required, look up the start and end address in the index table and then play
it.  What kind of quality were you after? 8/16 bit 11/22/44 KHz ?

You could use the EPROM method, you would either have to have several
external latches for the addres bus or an external counter.  The
disadvantage of a simple binary counter is that to move to a specific
location in the memory, you would have to count up through all the previous
loactions.  Or you could use a counter on the lower order bits and control
the high order bits of the EPROM directly from the PIC and divide the EPROM
into several equal sized partitions.

Regards

Mike Rigby-Jones

> {Original Message removed}

1999\05\28@043823 by Seyler Jean-Yves
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       Hello again,


> I wouldn't have though it would be very hard to modify it.
>
It may not if you have the source and knows the AVR language !

>   Or you could use a counter on the lower order bits and control
> the high order bits of the EPROM directly from the PIC and divide the
> EPROM
> into several equal sized partitions.
>
May be its is the simpler solution or a more simpler one : only counters to
the EPROM address and choice of the messages number by MSB address nbr (no
need for a PIC). The drawback : every message have a fixed size but could be
smaller if one detect an EOF byte ($FF ?) at the output of the EPROM that
will reset the counter ...

       By the way, do you think a sound from a simple R2R ladder will be
clear enough for my end purpose that are: messages (whistle, Tchoo-tchoos
...) for my railraod system ?

       Thanks again

       Jean-Yves

> Regards
>
> Mike Rigby-Jones
>
> > {Original Message removed}

1999\05\28@075630 by Harrison Cooper

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This is exactly what I did....but I fed the audio direct into the 'mic'
input via a audio transformer. This way I could tweak the length of files,
keep a master copy, etc of the stuff recorded into the ISD part.


But, maybe, the audio quality would be rather nasty and I'd better switch to
an "ISD design" with sounds recorded directly from the audio output of my PC
?

1999\05\28@080843 by Seyler Jean-Yves

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               Hello Harry,

       I think this is the easier way for me !
And so, this message becomes [OT] ;-)
If you wan't to answer me, do it directly, it will not annoy the pure PICers
here ...

My only last question was about the sound quality from the ISD since I
didn't try it yet ...

Thanks

Jean-Yves

{Quote hidden}

1999\05\28@100542 by paulb

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Michael Rigby-Jones wrote:

> You could use the EPROM method, you would either have to have several
> external latches for the addres bus or an external counter.  The
> disadvantage of a simple binary counter is that to move to a specific
> location in the memory, you would have to count up through all the
> previous locations.

 OTOH, if the PIC has nothing else of import to do, that's great!  This
application is obviously not speed-critical, or not particularly so.
For an application where serial access is the primary objective, you
*should* use counters rather than shift registers.

>  Or you could use a counter on the lower order bits and control the
> high order bits of the EPROM directly from the PIC and divide the
> EPROM into several equal sized partitions.

 That approach is appropriate to the elimination of a PIC.  If however
you want to *use* a PIC, use two (or more) counters such as (74HC)4040
with common reset and separate clocks.  That's three lines to control up
to 24 address bits.

 Maximum random access time at about 50 ms (by clocking both counters
at
once; 4095 counts at conservatively, 10 instructions per loop plus a
little) is trivial in this application (you might have to mute the
"tick" from the output).

 This could be relegated to a 12C508 with the ToC (Table of Contents)
vectors stored in the PIC rather than the PROM (note I said PROM to
match an OTP), or there are various ways to read the parallel data into
the PIC.

 Sounds like a nice cheap approach to me, but you certainly do have to
compare it to an ISD chip with *all* the functionality integrated.
--
 Cheers,
       Paul B.

1999\05\28@115256 by n/a

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Seyler Jean-Yves wrote:
{Quote hidden}

see my product

http://www.furb.rct-sc.br/~mw/isd_i.html

Miguel

1999\05\29@073304 by ranguelo

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Seyler Jean-Yves wrote:
...
>
>         Does any of you has big ideas about a stand alone ".WAV files"
> player ?
>

Take a look at the ADPCM compression algorithm. The math is prety simple
and should fit into a PIC.

At ftp://ftp.pct.edu/pub/shared/mpx/DAC.pdf  i have found a paper about
compressing audio data, iirc there is also an AppNote from Microchip
about ADPCM.

> But, maybe, the audio quality would be rather nasty and I'd better switch to
> an "ISD design" with sounds recorded directly from the audio output of my PC
> ?
Good question !

Just my 2 cents ...

St.


'Standalone WAV Player ?'
1999\06\03@004133 by Harold M Hallikainen
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       I was hired to design a product to teach Braille.  I was originally
looking at using a big EPROM driving a D/A, LPF, PA.  Based on
suggestions from this list, I used an ISD chip that handles 4 minutes of
audio at 8,000 samples per second (can be increased to 8 minutes at 4,000
samples per second).  It has an SPI interface.  Works real well!  I used
the speech development software from Quadravox to combine speech from
their libraries and some custom speech from wav files.  I then emailed
the project files to Quadravox and they sent me two programmed ISD chips
for $52.
       Use of the ISD with SPI interface reduced the pin count I needed on the
PIC (compared with driving an EPROM), so I went from a 16c74 down to a
16c61 (or 16c621 or whatever's cheapest at the moment).  The design runs
off 3 AA cells.  I used a TI bridged output power amp, a Maxim micropower
regulator (to get 3V for the ISD and PIC).  So, it's a three chip system.
When idling, current draw is something like 20mA.  After being idle for
a minute, the PA shuts down and the processor goes to sleep.  Current is
less than 50uA.
       The ISD chip is very nice!  Sounds great!  They have some WAV files of
chip outputs available at their web site so you can evaluate the chip's
capabilities.  The little song about calling 911 is pretty cute...

Harold



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1999\06\03@093334 by Andy Kunz

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>chip outputs available at their web site so you can evaluate the chip's

The URL please?

>capabilities.  The little song about calling 911 is pretty cute...
>

I have a good WAV file on my site, too.

http://www.montanadesign.com

Andy
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1999\06\03@101839 by Harold M Hallikainen

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On Thu, 3 Jun 1999 09:30:21 -0400 Andy Kunz <@spam@supportKILLspamspamMONTANADESIGN.COM>
writes:
>>chip outputs available at their web site so you can evaluate the
>chip's
>
>The URL please?
>

       http://www.isd.com

Harold

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