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PICList Thread
'ROMzap'
2000\03\08@164848 by Tony Nixon

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picon face
Hi all,

Just uploaded a new ROMzap if anyones interested.

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
spam_OUTsalesTakeThisOuTspampicnpoke.com

** Free beginners experimenter pack included ***
2 X 20 LCD, 7 seg, Relay, LED, Switch,
Serial EEPROM, Trimpot, and Project Book

2000\03\08@170730 by jamesnewton

face picon face
Thanks, I've been waiting

---
James Newton .....jamesnewtonKILLspamspam@spam@geocities.com 1-619-652-0593
http://techref.massmind.org NEW! FINALLY A REAL NAME!
Members can add private/public comments/pages ($0 TANSTAAFL web hosting)


-----Original Message-----
From: pic microcontroller discussion list
[PICLISTspamKILLspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU]On Behalf Of Tony Nixon
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2000 13:48
To: .....PICLISTKILLspamspam.....MITVMA.MIT.EDU
Subject: ROMzap


Hi all,

Just uploaded a new ROMzap if anyones interested.

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
EraseMEsalesspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTpicnpoke.com

** Free beginners experimenter pack included ***
2 X 20 LCD, 7 seg, Relay, LED, Switch,
Serial EEPROM, Trimpot, and Project Book

2000\03\08@172840 by Ryan Pogge

flavicon
face
what is a "bootloader"?

> Hi all,
>
> Just uploaded a new ROMzap if anyones interested.
>
> --
> Best regards
>
> Tony
>
> http://www.picnpoke.com
> salesspamspam_OUTpicnpoke.com
>
> ** Free beginners experimenter pack included ***
> 2 X 20 LCD, 7 seg, Relay, LED, Switch,
> Serial EEPROM, Trimpot, and Project Book

2000\03\08@182509 by jamesnewton

face picon face
What's an archive?

---
James Newton (PICList Admin #3)
@spam@jamesnewtonKILLspamspampiclist.com 1-619-652-0593
PIC/PICList FAQ: http://www.piclist.com or .org

{Original Message removed}

2000\03\08@185843 by Ryan Pogge

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face
--snip--
> What's an archive?
--snip--

ANSWER:

aráchive (”rkv)
n.

A place or collection containing records, documents, or other materials of
historical interest. Often used in the plural: old land deeds in the
municipal archives.
Computer Science.
A long-term storage area, often on magnetic tape, for backup copies of files
or for files that are no longer in active use.
A file containing one or more files in compressed format for more efficient
storage and transfer.
A repository for stored memories or information: the archive of the mind.


----- Original Message -----
From: James Newton <KILLspamjamesnewtonKILLspamspampiclist.com>
To: <RemoveMEPICLISTTakeThisOuTspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2000 6:22 PM
Subject: Re: ROMzap


> What's an archive?
>
> ---
> James Newton (PICList Admin #3)
> spamBeGonejamesnewtonspamBeGonespampiclist.com 1-619-652-0593
> PIC/PICList FAQ: http://www.piclist.com or .org
>
> {Original Message removed}

2000\03\08@190507 by Quitt, Walter

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face
Isn't that something from like Startrek or Voyager? :-)

-----Original Message-----
From: Ryan Pogge [TakeThisOuTrpoggeEraseMEspamspam_OUTMICHAELANGELO.NET]
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2000 3:55 PM
To: RemoveMEPICLISTspamTakeThisOuTMITVMA.MIT.EDU
Subject: Re: ROMzap


--snip--
> What's an archive?
--snip--

ANSWER:

aráchive (”rkv)
n.

A place or collection containing records, documents, or other materials of
historical interest. Often used in the plural: old land deeds in the
municipal archives.
Computer Science.
A long-term storage area, often on magnetic tape, for backup copies of files
or for files that are no longer in active use.
A file containing one or more files in compressed format for more efficient
storage and transfer.
A repository for stored memories or information: the archive of the mind.


----- Original Message -----
From: James Newton <jamesnewtonEraseMEspam.....piclist.com>
To: <EraseMEPICLISTspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2000 6:22 PM
Subject: Re: ROMzap


{Quote hidden}

2000\03\08@230951 by Ryan Pogge

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face
a romzap? ...nah...romulan ... i think...
\


{Quote hidden}

files
> or for files that are no longer in active use.
> A file containing one or more files in compressed format for more
efficient
{Quote hidden}

> > {Original Message removed}

2000\03\09@010525 by Sean Breheny

face picon face
Isn't that some guy who stands on the docks and transfers loads of the
latest footware from the ship to trucks?

At 05:25 PM 3/8/00 -0500, you wrote:
{Quote hidden}

| Sean Breheny
| Amateur Radio Callsign: KA3YXM
| Electrical Engineering Student
\--------------=----------------
Save lives, please look at http://www.all.org
Personal page: http://www.people.cornell.edu/pages/shb7
EraseMEshb7spamEraseMEcornell.edu ICQ #: 3329174

2000\03\09@094703 by M. Adam Davis

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face
Ryan Pogge wrote:
>
> what is a "bootloader"?

A machine (controlled by a pic, of course) which automatically loads boots from
the factory to a truck for all the cowboy boots sold in the summer months.
You're hearing more about them now on the pic list because all the boot
manufacturers are gearing up for this summer's boot production.  "Wear the
official boot of the millenium!"  etc, etc.

Actually, a bootloader is a piece of code which resides on the PIC, and is the
first thing that runs when turned on.  Upon boot-up of the PIC it checks a pin
and based on whether the pin is high or low, it goes into a special programming
mode where you can program the rest of the PIC through the UART, or it runs the
program already stored.  This eliminates the need for a programmer or ICSP(in
circuit serial programming) or could be considered a form of ICSP.  No high
(+13.5) programming voltages are needed.

This has really only come up now (in the world of PICs) with the widespread use
of the flash chips 16f8xx which can write to their own program flash.

Bootloaders were (and are) widely used on other architechtures where the program
and data memory are not seperate (8051, 68k, etc).  The ROM of such a device
might have the bootloader, which loads a program from a serial port into the
memory, and then starts program operation at that point in memory.  This isn't
something new to the world, only to the PIC line of uControllers.

-Adam

2000\03\09@152253 by Ryan Pogge

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face
so the advantage is an easy way to update firmware in products, or an easy
way to develop software and reprogram without ISP....
cool...


> Actually, a bootloader is a piece of code which resides on the PIC, and is
the
> first thing that runs when turned on.  Upon boot-up of the PIC it checks a
pin
> and based on whether the pin is high or low, it goes into a special
programming
> mode where you can program the rest of the PIC through the UART, or it
runs the
> program already stored.  This eliminates the need for a programmer or
ICSP(in
> circuit serial programming) or could be considered a form of ICSP.  No
high
> (+13.5) programming voltages are needed.
>
> This has really only come up now (in the world of PICs) with the
widespread use
> of the flash chips 16f8xx which can write to their own program flash.
>
> Bootloaders were (and are) widely used on other architechtures where the
program
> and data memory are not seperate (8051, 68k, etc).  The ROM of such a
device
> might have the bootloader, which loads a program from a serial port into
the
> memory, and then starts program operation at that point in memory.  This
isn't
> something new to the world, only to the PIC line of uControllers.
>
> -Adam

2000\03\09@152844 by M. Adam Davis

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face
Yes.  An even nicer advantage is being able to update the code remotely.  Your
weather station is out in the back forty over a radio link, and you want to
record some info about this upcoming storm which will disrupt your radio
signal.  ie, you won't get the info you want.

So you reprogram it over the radio link with new code that will make it act as a
datalogger while the storm passes through.  No need to go out in the rain.

-Adam

Ryan Pogge wrote:
>
> so the advantage is an easy way to update firmware in products, or an easy
> way to develop software and reprogram without ISP....
> cool...

2000\03\09@155551 by Quitt, Walter

flavicon
face
I've done this with other RTUs (Remote Terminal Units.)
It can get a bit tricky loading and running code on units
with different configurations.  You must allow for bad
downloads and allow the old code to run again.  It can get
tricky.  Utility customers get real pissed if a substation
goes down because of a software screw up.

GL,
Walt...

{Original Message removed}

2000\03\09@162921 by M. Adam Davis

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face
Actually, I was even thinking of a more complex program which would 'save' the
flash, so to speak.

The flash is limited by how many times it can be erased/written, so if my app
only takes 2k of code, the first version goes in the first 2k.  If I revise it,
rather than overwriting the first 2k, it will assemble and write it for the
second 2k.  The only location that would need to be reprogramed every time is
the jump to user code, which can be ameliorated by a series of nops followed by
the jump.  Just overwrite closer and closer nops, and when you run out,
overwrite all the jumps with nops and start again.  This requires the program
writing to the chip to know where the old code is, and then assemble (or
reassemble?) the code just before programming it.

This would lend naturally to your bad download situation, since the original
code is not overwritten.  The last location programmed is the jump to user code,
and only after a correct verify.  Of course, if your code takes up the entire
flash, then all bets are off... ;-)

This would be important for products which write to the flash frequently, for
whatever reason.  Chances are the casual hobbyist won't run into a bad code
location even if they reprogrammed their entire flash every week.  It would
still take several years for them to wear it down.  A data-logger which uses the
internal flash for storage should follow such a scheme though.

TI uses a similar approach on their TI-89 and TI-92+ calculators with FLASH.
When a program or code is copied from flash to working memory, changed, then
copied back to flash it doesn't overwrite the old location, it finds the first
non-used location and writes it there.  The old location is marked used-but
empty.  When there aren't enough non-used locations, it performs a 'garbage
collection' which re-allocates some of the flash, and marks everything empty as
non-used.

-Adam

"Quitt, Walter" wrote:
{Quote hidden}

2000\03\09@163711 by Andrew T Kelley

picon face
On Thu, 9 Mar 2000 16:27:40 -0500 "M. Adam Davis" <spamBeGoneadavisspamKILLspamUBASICS.COM>
writes:
{Quote hidden}

Nice  concept!

{Quote hidden}

I did it to an 16f84-10/p!

{Quote hidden}

Cool!

{Quote hidden}

Andrew
________________________________________________________________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
Try it today - there's no risk!  For your FREE software, visit:
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2000\03\09@164337 by Quitt, Walter

flavicon
face
You can atually extend what you have written.
If you checksum the code to declare it good you have
a good chance of being able to execute the new code.
Use the watchdog to reexecute the old code if the new
code crashes.  Once you feel good about the new code,
then the old code space can be written over.  Just
don't write over that all important decision making
code thatis typically at the beginning.  This is
an OK schema.  Used something similiar.  It is not
intended that you do this over and over as the code
shouldn't change that often.  Data logging can always
be done to some external memory like an SPI part.
Using 64K bit 25LC640s right now.  Bank select if you
need more.  I keep a checksum of the memory around
and check it every now and then.  If you are really
concerned you can also do real time memory checking
a byte per main loop.

Back to it...-W

{Original Message removed}

2000\03\09@164548 by Severson, Rob

flavicon
face
> > second 2k.  The only location that would need to be reprogramed
> > every time is
> > the jump to user code,

Put a sequence number in your firmware. Have the base code test the banks
for the newest code to run and jump to that code. This way the base code
does not change and is less likely to get corrupted.

Reserve a number (00) for a "bad bank" indicator if the bank becomes
unusable.

-Rob
usbsimm.home.att.net

2000\03\09@164554 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
Ryan Pogge wrote:

> so the advantage is an easy way to update firmware in products, or an easy
> way to develop software and reprogram without ISP....
> cool...

It is certainly a time saver, especially when developing code for two or
more PICs that need to communicate with each other. I'm sure I've saved
days so far.

One thing struck me about this approach though.

You (I) tend to get a little bit slack with the code writing because it
is so easy to change if a mistake is made. Previously in the program -
bug - phooey - UV erase - program - bug - more phooey - UV erase etc...,
you tend to be more careful about what goes on the chip because it's a
pain to change it.



--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
TakeThisOuTsales.....spamTakeThisOuTpicnpoke.com

2000\03\09@165406 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
"M. Adam Davis" wrote:
>
> Actually, I was even thinking of a more complex program which would 'save' the
> flash, so to speak.

I fiddled around with this not long ago, and perhaps I will again.

I also had the boot code read the ROM location prior to programming and
if the new data was the same, skip it.

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
TakeThisOuTsalesKILLspamspamspampicnpoke.com

2000\03\09@165408 by Ryan Pogge

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face
wow cool!
Ryan


> Yes.  An even nicer advantage is being able to update the code remotely.
Your
> weather station is out in the back forty over a radio link, and you want
to
> record some info about this upcoming storm which will disrupt your radio
> signal.  ie, you won't get the info you want.
>
> So you reprogram it over the radio link with new code that will make it
act as a
> datalogger while the storm passes through.  No need to go out in the rain.
>
> -Adam
>
> Ryan Pogge wrote:
> >
> > so the advantage is an easy way to update firmware in products, or an
easy
> > way to develop software and reprogram without ISP....
> > cool...

2000\03\09@165614 by Quitt, Walter

flavicon
face
TRUE. Everybody hates the program - test - erase
cycle.  Glad we can use emulators with PICs.
I loved my ICEPIC.  I really love my ICE 2K.
Now I hope many people begin to use the ICD
and similiar devices.  It is pretty cheap
for what you can do with it.  I will be trying my
ICD real sone to replace a 16C65 with a 16F877.
Sorry, this almost borders on OT.

W


{Original Message removed}

2000\03\14@172818 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
Hi all,

I've just upgraded ROMzap again.

Some new features

Customise and create the boot code within ROMzap
Port Initialization editor
Load and Save ROMzap config files for different projects
Hooks into MPASM for boot code assembly
Internal help file

It can be downloaded at

http://www.picnpoke.com/demo/ROMzap.html (216K)

Many thanks to Dwayne Reid for his suggestions.

Comments welcome :-)

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
.....salesspamRemoveMEpicnpoke.com

2000\03\14@173434 by M. Adam Davis

flavicon
face
Tony Nixon wrote:
> Comments welcome :-)

This is great!  I'm surprised you are putting so much effort into this wonderful
item!  I haven't tried it yet, every time I'm about to you announce a new
version ;-).

Sounds like I need to spend some time tonight playing with it.

Thanks!

-Adam

2000\03\23@174310 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
Hi all,

ROMzap has just been upgraded again.

Features:

{Quote hidden}

I've included a schematic of the simple boot programmer which can be put
together out of a junk box parts, or depending on the powersupply
requirements, it can cost anywhere from $1 - $5.

http://www.picnpoke.com/demo/ROMzap.html  (about 290K)

Comments welcome.

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
RemoveMEsalesspamspamBeGonepicnpoke.com

2000\03\23@191103 by Arthur Brown

flavicon
face
was off to bed local time 12.07 am
but Tony I must try this first
thank you
all the best from Art

----- Original Message -----
From: Tony Nixon <spamBeGoneTony.Nixon@spam@spamspam_OUTENG.MONASH.EDU.AU>
To: <TakeThisOuTPICLISTspamspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2000 10:40 PM
Subject: ROMzap


| Hi all,
|
| ROMzap has just been upgraded again.
|
| Features:
|
| >  Support for 16F873/4/6/7
| >  Generates boot file
| >  Inbuilt boot code programmer  << Cool
| >  Fuse programming support
| >  Run user code from Windows
| >  Load and Save config files
| >  Set user code start
| >  Set boot code start
| >  Set ADCON1 register
| >  Auto insertion of CLRWDT if fuse set
| >  Add an autoboot test code line
| >  Include auto jump to boot code
| >  Set Port and Tris registers
| >  Save and view boot code
| >  Assemble boot code with Mpasmwin
| >  Auto generate user code template
| >  Set defaults
| >  Online help file
| >  FREE :-)
|
| I've included a schematic of the simple boot programmer which can be put
| together out of a junk box parts, or depending on the powersupply
| requirements, it can cost anywhere from $1 - $5.
|
| http://www.picnpoke.com/demo/ROMzap.html  (about 290K)
|
| Comments welcome.
|
| --
| Best regards
|
| Tony
|
| http://www.picnpoke.com
| salesEraseMEspampicnpoke.com
|

2000\03\24@132435 by Kevin L. Pauba

flavicon
face
Tony,

ROMzap looks really neat!  I would love to make use of it but I develop
under Linux.  Might there be any options to use it under Linux?  I'd be
happy to assist with any GUI, C, Java, C++, or Forth coding.  Perhaps a
first step would be to breadboard the ASCII Programmer from your schematic
and write the serial code to exercise it under Linux.

Thanks!

Tony Nixon wrote:

{Quote hidden}

2000\03\24@142728 by Arthur Brown

flavicon
face
Tony,
I have built the first part i.e. the bootloader install cct. still analazing
the thought of programing the first chip with this code. neat the way it
loads to the top of rom and not at the 4k page as the magenta does.

Is there any sample code i.e. flashing L.E.D to program as 1st program.
While I am in the mood I shall build the main board with the Max232 onboard,
I note you used a 16Mhz xtal any reason for this as I would like to use a
20Mhz as I have not got a 16Mhz xtal in my parts box.

Best regards Art

Arthur Brown @spam@artbRemoveMEspamEraseMEcableinet.co.uk

2000\03\24@152554 by Arthur Brown

flavicon
face
Subject: ROMzap
Tony built the bootload programmer,very nice bit of design by you.
When selecting to load the inbuilt bootloader, the file saves as a *.hex
when it sould be *.asm (if this is not the case then I have got it wrong)..

After changing it to *.asm it assembled nicely so went on to programme F877,
the Progress bar moved at a steady rate as it counted up then slowed as it
programmed the top of rom at 1F80h so it looks good. Not built the Interface
to Pc board yet but it's looking good.
Thanking you for all the effort you must have taken to complete this project
and to a fine standard.

all the best from Art
EraseMEartbspam@spam@cableinet.co.uk

2000\03\24@155438 by Byron A Jeff

face picon face
>
> Tony,
>
> ROMzap looks really neat!  I would love to make use of it but I develop
> under Linux.  Might there be any options to use it under Linux?  I'd be
> happy to assist with any GUI, C, Java, C++, or Forth coding.  Perhaps a
> first step would be to breadboard the ASCII Programmer from your schematic
> and write the serial code to exercise it under Linux.

Using ROMZap under linux is on my list of things to do. Since Tony has outlined
the protocol over the serial line in the source, it should be easy to get a command line utility going.

BAJ

2000\03\24@161417 by Andrew Kelley

picon face
On Fri, 24 Mar 2000 15:53:54 -0500 Byron A Jeff <@spam@byronspam_OUTspam.....CC.GATECH.EDU>
writes:
> >
> > Tony,
> >
> > ROMzap looks really neat!  I would love to make use of it but I
> develop
> > under Linux.  Might there be any options to use it under Linux?
> I'd be
> > happy to assist with any GUI, C, Java, C++, or Forth coding.
> Perhaps a
> > first step would be to breadboard the ASCII Programmer from your
> schematic
> > and write the serial code to exercise it under Linux.
>
> Using ROMZap under linux is on my list of things to do. Since Tony
> has outlined
> the protocol over the serial line in the source, it should be easy
> to get a command line utility going.
>
> BAJ
I will help in my 'free' time.

Andrew
________________________________________________________________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
Try it today - there's no risk!  For your FREE software, visit:
dl.http://www.juno.com/get/tagj.

2000\03\24@172201 by Morgan Olsson

picon face
This seem to be a neat little concept :)

Two big concerns however, as I am up to design a industrial control gear that must not do anything bad...

There need to be

 1) Verification of all data and commands over the serial channel (CRC or whatever and resend etc)

 2) Program verification at over and under normal operation voltage.


The 1) need to be in the bootloader, 2) in my own code, which will stop the machine and jump to bootloader if error in Flash checksum.  (this I will do anyway in my own code every time after reset, controlling the power supply while doing checksum or CRC of the program)

As my device will be pretty unreachable it would be very nice to use the existing vires, which are unshielded, but by using RC filter, schmidt-triggers, and solow RS232, that will work mostof the time, but I feel unsafe anyway without CRC or something of the data, as this is industrial, and there might be severe EMI.  I hate to have some instruction altered, may possibly injure somebody badly... (well there are manual emergency stops, and hardware autostop, but...)

See it as a suggestion
Keep up the good work
Regards
/Morgan

2000\03\24@185327 by Arthur Brown

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face
This Project is A Bootloader / RomZap, that is part of the project is to
load the romloader with as little a bit of kit as possible and the second
part is the ability to load programs without the programmer but to use a Pc.
to do this....

If you are Using any Type of microcontroller where the safety of others is
involved the method of programming the chip is the LAST thing you should be
thinking of.

from Art spamBeGoneartbEraseMEspamcableinet.co.uk

{Original Message removed}

2000\03\25@040705 by Arthur Brown

flavicon
face
hi soon lee. & the piclist
the cost of a 16Mhz xtal to get this project running is a too little price
to pay to know that the circuit work's as intended.

a few points on the RomZap

#1. I think as this is a good piclist project from Tony Nixon any Mods to
circuit values should not be made, As any problems may not be seen by
somebody looking at Tonys ciruit, if you mod the ciruit how is anybody to
know that you have done.
#2. Any mods you want do make should be done after first building as Drawing
and only when all is working then go it alone.

All the Best from Art artbspamBeGonespamcableinet.co.uk

| Sorry Guys
|
| got a question about the RomZap here.
| I kept on geting com error, i have check the 232 circuit buy read back and
| fro the data is ok and I program the boot code into the pic using a pic
| start. But i am using a 20MHz ,i have change the SPBRG value from 12 to 15
,
| what can be wrong hope you can help me
|
| regards
| soon lee
|

2000\03\25@082539 by Gene Norris

picon face
soon lee, I too am using a 20Mhz crystal.  Mine is working with a BRGH value
of 64.  I initially tried the 15 but it did not work.  Then I discovered in
the data sheets that with BRGH set to 1 (which it is) then the value should
be 64.

Hope this helps, Gene.

At 09:04 AM 3/25/00 -0000, Arthur Brown wrote:
{Quote hidden}

Gene & Sydelle Norris
RemoveMEenorris@spam@spamspamBeGonehome.com
http://members.home.net/enorris
E. Windsor, NJ USA

2000\03\26@180043 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
"Kevin L. Pauba" wrote:
>
> Tony,
>
> ROMzap looks really neat!  I would love to make use of it but I develop
> under Linux.  Might there be any options to use it under Linux?  I'd be
> happy to assist with any GUI, C, Java, C++, or Forth coding.  Perhaps a
> first step would be to breadboard the ASCII Programmer from your schematic
> and write the serial code to exercise it under Linux.
>

I don't have a patent on it ;-)

It would be nice if cross platform development was kept on an even keel,
but everyone has a right to thier own ideas.

The bottom line is a benefit to PIC users.

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
.....sales@spam@spamEraseMEpicnpoke.com

2000\03\27@025254 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
Sorry for the continued thread...

I had a bit of constructive feedback for ROMzap and here are the latest
mods.

Did some minor bug fixes.

Fuse data is now included in the *.asm file

A baud rate calculator is included and writes the baud rate instructions
for 19200 baud and according to a user specified crystal speed. I find
19200 works quite well so that is fixed.

You can add two extra code lines, one for when the boot program
activates, and one for when it exits to the user code. This can give
system feedback by controlling a LED for example.

The AutoBoot function has been expanded and gives 3 options...

1. Not used at all
2. User code line can be inserted to test a port pin
3. If ROMzap.exe is active on the PC and the hardware is turned on,
  it is automatically detected by the PC and jumps into boot mode.

I had some trouble compiling the help file because of Word 97
incompatabillity, so the files will be uploaded tomorrow hopefully.

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
.....salesRemoveMEspampicnpoke.com

2000\03\28@182931 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
The new ROMzap has been uploaded.

I think I have addressed everyones needs with it.

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
.....salesSTOPspamspam@spam@picnpoke.com

2000\03\29@073950 by Soon Lee

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face
Hi Tony

Sorry to ask but what is the different between the two circuit in the PDF
file?
RomZap is really a good picece of equipment when it come to prototyping

Thanks

regards
soon lee

----- Original Message -----
From: Tony Nixon <Tony.NixonEraseMEspam@spam@ENG.MONASH.EDU.AU>
To: <RemoveMEPICLISTspamspamBeGoneMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 7:14 AM
Subject: ROMzap


{Quote hidden}

2000\03\29@174622 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
Soon Lee wrote:
>
> Hi Tony
>
> Sorry to ask but what is the different between the two circuit in the PDF
> file?
> RomZap is really a good picece of equipment when it come to prototyping
>
> Thanks
>
> regards
> soon lee

Hi Soon Lee,

The first circuit allows ROMzap to program the boot code into the chip
without a programmer. The second is a circuit template for using the
chip in any application but you can update the user code with ROMzap.

Thanks for the kind comments.

ROMzap was uploaded again today because of some minor bugs I discovered
while using it in my own project. V300300

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
salesspam_OUTspam@spam@picnpoke.com

2000\03\31@113949 by M. Adam Davis

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face
Would you be willing to release the source code for the windows utility you've
created?

-Adam

Tony Nixon wrote:
{Quote hidden}

2000\03\31@114623 by WF

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face
This no secret about how was done the Windows software....

Miguel
----- Original Message -----
From: M. Adam Davis <RemoveMEadavisEraseMEspamKILLspamUBASICS.COM>
To: <spamBeGonePICLISTspam_OUTspamRemoveMEMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Friday, March 31, 2000 1:38 PM
Subject: Re: ROMzap


> Would you be willing to release the source code for the windows utility
you've
{Quote hidden}

2000\03\31@115405 by M. Adam Davis

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face
I understand that, and it would not be too difficult to recreate, but if it's
already done, and the author is willing then why recreate it?

-Adam

CPU time is cheaper than programmer time.

WF wrote:
>
> This no secret about how was done the Windows software....
>
> Miguel
> {Original Message removed}

2000\03\31@121858 by - KITS EDUCACIONAIS NACIONAIS

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face
M. Adam Davis wrote:
>
> I understand that, and it would not be too difficult to recreate, but if it's
> already done, and the author is willing then why recreate it?
>
> -Adam

Yes, i agree! I say you this, because i analysed the protocol created on ASM source code...

Miguel


'ROMzap'
2000\04\01@094751 by Soon Lee
flavicon
face
Hi Tony

Thanks for everything you have done
With your design of the romzap, I manage to create my own set of prototyping
tools.
I have make the loader into something similar to the SX key so what I need
to do is to create a programming header on-broad all my PCB then I can do
both programming and debugging, I have a suggestion here. why don't you have
a debug screen (like bs2) after you run the program(since the com is already
open), currently I am using comlite32 to monitor the com data. and it is
really very useful when it come to debuging

Thanks again

regards
soon lee

{Original Message removed}

2000\04\02@175301 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
"M. Adam Davis" wrote:
>
> Would you be willing to release the source code for the windows utility you've
> created?

The PIC source is all open.

I don't see the need to open the Windows source. Why would a PIC
programmer want the innards? As far as I know it does just about
everything needed, and I'm willing to add to it if suggestions are made.
It gives me something to do in times of boredome :-)


Soon Lee wrote:
> I have a suggestion here. why don't you have
> a debug screen (like bs2) after you run the program(since the com is already
> open), currently I am using comlite32 to monitor the com data. and it is
> really very useful when it come to debuging

It's in the pipeline.

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
salesspam@spam@picnpoke.com

2000\04\02@185021 by Andy Kelley

picon face
On Mon, 3 Apr 2000 07:50:37 +1000 Tony Nixon
<EraseMETony.NixonRemoveMEspamSTOPspamENG.MONASH.EDU.AU> writes:
> "M. Adam Davis" wrote:
> >
> > Would you be willing to release the source code for the windows
> utility you've
> > created?
>
> The PIC source is all open.
>
> I don't see the need to open the Windows source. Why would a PIC
> programmer want the innards? As far as I know it does just about
> everything needed, and I'm willing to add to it if suggestions are
> made.

Well what if I want to use Linux(yipee =)?

> It gives me something to do in times of boredome :-)
>
>
> --
> Best regards
>
> Tony
>
> http://www.picnpoke.com
> RemoveMEsalesKILLspamspamTakeThisOuTpicnpoke.com
Andy K.
________________________________________________________________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
Try it today - there's no risk!  For your FREE software, visit:
dl.http://www.juno.com/get/tagj.

2000\04\02@190851 by Byron A Jeff
face picon face
On Sun, Apr 02, 2000 at 07:46:18PM -0400, Andy Kelley wrote:
> On Mon, 3 Apr 2000 07:50:37 +1000 Tony Nixon
> <spamBeGoneTony.Nixonspam@spam@ENG.MONASH.EDU.AU> writes:
> > "M. Adam Davis" wrote:
> > >
> > > Would you be willing to release the source code for the windows
> > utility you've
> > > created?
> >
> > The PIC source is all open.
> >
> > I don't see the need to open the Windows source. Why would a PIC
> > programmer want the innards? As far as I know it does just about
> > everything needed, and I'm willing to add to it if suggestions are
> > made.
>
> Well what if I want to use Linux(yipee =)?

Then the Windows source isn't going to help much. Tony's done us all a
great service by releasing all the PIC code, the firmware. Since all the
specs required to talk to a ROMZapped chip are available, coding up a
downloader should be easy work.

I plan to task one of the two students I have working on a PIC based
semester project to do just that. Will let you folks know about it just
as soon as it's running.

BAJ

2000\04\02@202912 by James Michael Newton

picon face
I totally agree. The Bootloader should have an (optional) debug ability but
I think that a register monitor would be perfect.

Rather than coding space consuming debug messages, you just insert a copy of
PC into W and a call to the register display routine at appropriate places
in the code. Depending on the value of a pin, register, etc. the routine
just returns or displays all the current register values to the PC. Using
the PC value in W the debug display could even include the source with the
line of code that the call originated on highlighted. If W is important to
you, save it in a file register. That is three instructions max per debug
entry.

Now, think about how many times you would have sold your left earlobe for
that ability on a production product or remote from the customers site.

James Newton
RemoveMEjamesnewtonspam_OUTspamgeocities.com
1-619-652-0593 phone

{Original Message removed}

2000\04\02@204816 by Tony Nixon

flavicon
picon face
James Michael Newton wrote:
>
> I totally agree. The Bootloader should have an (optional) debug ability but
> I think that a register monitor would be perfect.

I'll add that fucntionality to ROMzap in the next day or so, plus a few
other ideas I've picked up on.

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
salesspamspampicnpoke.com

2000\04\03@124149 by Tom Handley

picon face
  Tony, I'd strongly recommend that you don't release your Windows source...
This would result in a `support nightmare'... Someone mentioned LINUX. Well,
they can easily look at the "open" PIC source and write a LINUX interface...

  BTW, I think we should have annual PIC conventions (ala Embedded Systems)
and the first one should be held here in Portland, OR so I can afford the
travel expenses (ie: across town ;-). That way I could present you with the
first `PIC medal of excellence'. While we are at it, we also need all those
other folks like Andy W, Scott, John P, our Russian friends, and so many
more. Heck, I'd be happy to be the `Beer/Vodka Tender' ;-)

  - Tom

At 07:50 AM 4/3/00 +1000, Tony Nixon wrote:
>"M. Adam Davis" wrote:
>>
>> Would you be willing to release the source code for the windows utility
you've
{Quote hidden}

already
>> open), currently I am using comlite32 to monitor the com data. and it is
>> really very useful when it come to debuging
>
>It's in the pipeline.
>
>--
>Best regards
>
>Tony

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom Handley
New Age Communications
Since '75 before "New Age" and no one around here is waiting for UFOs ;-)

2000\04\03@124154 by M. Adam Davis

flavicon
face
Tony Nixon wrote:
> It gives me something to do in times of boredome :-)

I wish *I* had some times of boredom!

;-)

-Adam

if (argc > 1 && strcmp(argv[1], "-advice") == 0)
{ printf("Don't Panic!\n"); exit(42); }
Arnold Robbins in the LJ of February '95, describing RCS

2000\04\04@043907 by JP.BROWN

flavicon
face
> > > >
> > > > Would you be willing to release the source code for the windows
> > > utility you've
> > > > created?
> > >
> > > The PIC source is all open.
> > >
> > > I don't see the need to open the Windows source. Why would a PIC....

> I plan to task one of the two students I have working on a PIC based
> semester project to do just that. Will let you folks know about it just
> as soon as it's running.
>
> BAJ

That would be great!. It would be nice to have a similar program to RomZap
that will work with Win 3.11 or even DOS for us people still using ancient
486 PCs.

         -----  John P. Brown

2000\04\04@115627 by w. v. ooijen / f. hanneman

picon face
> That would be great!. It would be nice to have a similar program to
RomZap
> that will work with Win 3.11 or even DOS for us people still using
ancient
> 486 PCs.
>
>           -----  John P. Brown
Did you look at WLoader?
http://www.xs4all.nl/~wf/wouter/pic/wloader


'ROMzap'
2000\05\14@200954 by Tony Nixon
flavicon
picon face
ROMzap was updated again today.

The user interface was simplified a bit, and you can now read/write to
EEPROM either from a HEX file or manually.

It's getting hard to fit all this in the upper 100H words.

http://www.picnpoke.com/demo/romzap.html

--
Best regards

Tony

http://www.picnpoke.com
spam_OUTsalesspam_OUTspamspam_OUTpicnpoke.com

2000\05\15@041901 by Arthur

flavicon
face
Tony
You could go for the top 4k on a 16F877 <grin>

if you did then you could load all sorts of routines up there and just call
lcd display, keyboard input and Serial In/Out routines the list goes on, and
you still have 4k to play with.

Regards Art

{Original Message removed}

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