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'O.T. Pulse dialing'
1998\03\11@092236 by : Cassie Carstens

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Hi !

Does anybody have some specs or pointers to Telephone Pulse Dialing
protoc. Pulse timing, interdigit times and so on. I have tried a lot
of sites and only got DTMF stuff.

Please............ : )

TIA
Cassie

1998\03\11@093233 by Don McKenzie

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: Cassie Carstens wrote:
>
> Hi !
>
> Does anybody have some specs or pointers to Telephone Pulse Dialing
> protoc. Pulse timing, interdigit times and so on. I have tried a lot
> of sites and only got DTMF stuff.
>
> Please............ : )
>
> TIA
> Cassie

Mark is 33.3ms, space is 66.6 ms
You will find it fairly international.
Time between pulses was a mechanical govenor, about 330ms is suitable.
Some users were able to exceed these specs with a mechanical lever
called a pencil.

Don McKenzie  spam_OUTdonTakeThisOuTspamdontronics.com   http://www.dontronics.com

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1998\03\11@104654 by Keith Howell

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Don McKenzie wrote:
>
> Cassie Carstens wrote:
> >
> > Does anybody have some specs or pointers to Telephone Pulse Dialing
> > protoc. Pulse timing, interdigit times and so on.
>
> Mark is 33.3ms, space is 66.6 ms
> You will find it fairly international.

I concur. I recall it was originally 50/50 m/s ratio,
but relays took longer to open than close, hence the
change in ratios.

I have a paper app note demonstrating the 8052 BASIC
chip by driving a relay to produce pulse dialling.

1998\03\11@181955 by Morgan Olsson

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At 15:21 1998-03-11 +0000, you wrote:
>Don McKenzie wrote:
>>
>> Cassie Carstens wrote:
>> >
>> > Does anybody have some specs or pointers to Telephone Pulse Dialing
>> > protoc. Pulse timing, interdigit times and so on.
>>
>> Mark is 33.3ms, space is 66.6 ms
>> You will find it fairly international.
>
>I concur. I recall it was originally 50/50 m/s ratio,
>but relays took longer to open than close, hence the
>change in ratios.
>

I recall it is different in USA versus rest of the world?  (as usual...)
What also differs between several countries are the voltage and current
thresholds/limits, but that is merele a line interface problem, but
essential if you derive supply current from the line.
/Morgan
/  Morgan Olsson, MORGANS REGLERTEKNIK, SE-277 35 KIVIK, Sweden \
\  EraseMEmrtspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTiname.com, ph: +46 (0)414 70741; fax +46 (0)414 70331    /

1998\03\18@052010 by peter

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>  Does anybody have some specs or pointers to Telephone Pulse Dialing
> protoc. Pulse timing, interdigit times and so on.
>
>> Mark is 33.3ms, space is 66.6 ms
>> You will find it fairly international.
>>

Anyone have the min. interdigit time

Peter Cousens
email: peterspamspam_OUTcousens.her.forthnet.gr  phone: + 3081 324450, 380534
snailmail:  Folia, Agia Fotini, Karteros, Heraklion  Crete, Greece.

1998\03\18@054921 by : Cassie Carstens

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> >  Does anybody have some specs or pointers to Telephone Pulse Dialing
> > protoc. Pulse timing, interdigit times and so on.
> >
> >> Mark is 33.3ms, space is 66.6 ms
> >> You will find it fairly international.
> >>
>
> Anyone have the min. interdigit time
>
> Peter Cousens

After posting the original question, I looked for more info and is
also interested in the min/max digit pulse and of course the
interdigit times. It is very simple to get a pic to do pulse dialing
and most of the newer exchanges can handle pulse dialing. I read that
the modern PABX/ exchange can also handle a much higher pulse rate
(bit rate ?) so that the waiting to get connected is about the same
as tone dialing. Where is the specs ???

Kind regards
Cassie

1998\03\18@063318 by Don McKenzie

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Peter Cousens wrote:
>
> >  Does anybody have some specs or pointers to Telephone Pulse Dialing
> > protoc. Pulse timing, interdigit times and so on.
> >
> >> Mark is 33.3ms, space is 66.6 ms
> >> You will find it fairly international.
> >>
>
> Anyone have the min. interdigit time

I really think you may need about 330ms for reliable operation on an old
relay type exchange, if that's what you are chasing Peter.

I recall the 33/66 ms timing was done with a set of brass wings in a
small cup that acted as a govenor. You adjusted it so a zero produced an
even 1 second timing. The time between digits was the time taken to get
your finger into say number 1, the closest to the stop, and set it ready
to dial. If you forced it with a pencil, you could beat the mechanical
steppers, and end up with an incorrect number.

If you are driving a digital exchange, then I dare say, you could
shorten all timings considerably.

And different countries I'm sure will have different standards.

Don McKenzie  @spam@donKILLspamspamdontronics.com   http://www.dontronics.com

Don's Download Dungeon http://www.dontronics.com/download.html
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1998\03\18@064113 by peter

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: Cassie Carstens wrote:
{Quote hidden}

I'm making a pulse reader so the min. interdigit time is important to me
(anyone done this before or know of any sites)
I assume it would be around 500ms for a modern push button phone
but what's the minimum I can expect ?
--
Peter Cousens
email: TakeThisOuTpeterEraseMEspamspam_OUTcousens.her.forthnet.gr  phone: + 3081 324450, 380534
snailmail:  Folia, Agia Fotini, Karteros, Heraklion  Crete, Greece.

1998\03\18@084319 by Chris Savage

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Peter Cousens wrote:
{Quote hidden}

Yes. We do pulse dial detection, unfortunately on z8s (unfortunate in
more ways than one) and not at line level which makes life very tough.

Every push button phone we have here gives 33:66 timing. So to detect
pulse dialled digits we start a timer on each make/break event, record
pulses if the timer doesn't time out before the next event and record a
digit if the timer goes on for 100ms or so. I can't recall the exact
inter digit times but it doesn't really matter. Just have a timeout
significantly longer than the 66ms. I've got some Excel sheets somewhere
with lots of pulse dialled numbers on them but I can't lay my hands on
them right now. Let me know if you want a look and I'll dig them out.
I'm sure they're not that confidential to our business.

Rotary dial phones would have to have an inter digit time at least equal
to a dialled '1' unless the dial is forced back to the stop. And if some
silly beggar is playing that game they can't expect their numbers to be
dialled properly

We've played about with lots of tolerances on the timings with little
conclusion. I think we use +/- 7ms or so on the make/break times.

I'm sure Mitel do a chip for pulse dial detection, I'll try to find the
data sheet.

       - Chris

1998\03\18@084738 by rnc

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I HAVE A TESTER THAT TEST PULSE DIALING  TELEPHONES
IN THE MANUAL THEY MENTION CERTAIN STANDARDS FOR DIFFERENT COUNTRIES

INTER -DIGIT PAUSE SEEMS TO VARY FROM ONE COUNTRY TO ANOTHER
THE MINIMUM IS 448 msec THE MAX  IS 798 msec
OTHER VALUES ARE 498  599  AND 618   msec

PULSE SPEEDS VARY FROM ONE STANDARD TO ANOTHER
A LIST OF DIFFERENT  VALUES GIVEN BELOW

MIN 8.8 MAX 11.2 PULSES PER SECOND
MIN 9   MAX 11.2

MIN 9.1 MAX 10.9
MIN 9.4 MAX 10.6
MIN 8.9 MAX 11.1

BREAK TIME ALSO VARIES FOR DIFFERENT STANDARDS

MIN 33 MAX 52    msec
MIN 58MAX  74
MIN 54 MAX 70
MIN 52 MAX 64
MIN 53 MAX 67
MIN 54 MAX 82
MIN 56 MAX 64
MIN 63 MAX 71

MAKE TIME ALSO VARIES FOR DIFFERENT STANDARDS IN THE SAME ORDER AS ABOVE

MIN 15 MAX 28    msec
MIN 28MAX  38
MIN 33 MAX 46
MIN 34 MAX 46
MIN 35 MAX 45
MIN 25 MAX 43
MIN 36 MAX 44
MIN 29 MAX 37


SHARIF NABULSI
AMMAN - JORDAN
EMAIL : rncEraseMEspam.....go.com.jo

1998\03\18@122131 by Mike Keitz

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On Wed, 18 Mar 1998 13:07:07 +0000 Chris Savage
<EraseMEchrisspamCTI-VISION.DEMON.CO.UK> writes:

>> I'm making a pulse reader so the min. interdigit time is important
>to me
>> (anyone done this before or know of any sites)
>> I assume it would be around 500ms for a modern push button phone
>> but what's the minimum I can expect ?

The minimum you should expect is somewhat longer than the maximum "mark"
time (33 or 40 ms in most cases).  If the circuit stays closed longer
than that then it is the end of a digit.  So a reader could be set up to
work reliably on less than 100 ms anyway.


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1998\03\23@031506 by paulb

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Don McKenzie wrote:

> I recall the 33/66 ms timing was done with a set of brass wings in a
> small cup that acted as a govenor. You adjusted it so a zero produced
> an even 1 second timing.

 Actually, you adjusted it with the meter, which I have somewhere in
my collection (Boy, I hope I took the batteries out some time in the
last 10 years!).  It goes without saying that the mark-space ratio was
indicated on a normal meter movement, adjusted to FSD on mark (which is
of course what you have already with the dial at rest).

 The pulse rate however is read from a frequency meter of the reed-comb
variety, about seven reeds.  We have a couple of these of various types,
including the one to show mains frequency, a bigger version (much) of
those you see on up-market petrol alternators.  We used this to
demonstrate the generation of sidebands from (amplitude) modulation
using a mechanical rotary sinewave modulator (curious Heath-Robinson
construction using rotary switch and hand-made wirewound resistors).

 It works!

 Cheers,
       Paul B.

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