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'Maxim'
1999\02\16@214317 by Stuart O'Reilly

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I don't know if anyone has looked at the maxim  lately but they now do small
orders over the net. You download the price list which is about 1 meg, look
up the part and it gives you the price in US$ for qty 0-24, 25-99,   >100 you
can then order straight from there site. This is great for people who's local
distributers only stock a small range or want orders of 10000 or more.

Stu

1999\02\16@215907 by ryan pogge

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Um, or you can just get the stuff for free if you only need 2 of a part.


>I don't know if anyone has looked at the maxim  lately but they now do
small
>orders over the net. You download the price list which is about 1 meg, look
>up the part and it gives you the price in US$ for qty 0-24, 25-99,   >100
you
>can then order straight from there site. This is great for people who's
local
>distributers only stock a small range or want orders of 10000 or more.
>
>Stu

1999\02\16@233508 by Wagner Lipnharski

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I have being bying directly from Maxim from more than 3 years, but their price i
ncreased somehow lately after the addition of the web sales.

Dallas also offer this low quantity sales for long time.

Right now Hewlett Packard started to seel small quantities via their distributor
Newark Electronics, even a single piece, good leds, infra-red devices and contr
ollers.

I really don't understand why ALL chip producers don't follow this steps, since
all the heavy production starts in single prototypes...

              "Long live to the pioneers"


Wagner Lipnharski.
http://ustr.net

Stuart O'Reilly wrote:
>
> I don't know if anyone has looked at the maxim  lately but they now do small
> orders over the net. You download the price list which is about 1 meg, look
> up the part and it gives you the price in US$ for qty 0-24, 25-99,   >100 you
> can then order straight from there site. This is great for people who's local
> distributers only stock a small range or want orders of 10000 or more.
>
> Stu

1999\02\17@004446 by Jim Robertson

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At 21:45 16/02/99 -0500, you wrote:
>Um, or you can just get the stuff for free if you only need 2 of a part.

Yes, great service! I had a part sent free to Australia within 7 working days.
Well done maxim!

(Just a pity their prices are to high to consider using any of their parts.)
:-(



Jim

{Quote hidden}

________________________________________
Jim Robertson
Email: spam_OUTnewfoundTakeThisOuTspampipeline.com.au
http://www.pipeline.com.au/users/newfound
MPLAB compatible PIC programmers and firmware
upgrades for many programmers.
________________________________________

1999\02\17@090026 by wwl

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On Wed, 17 Feb 1999 16:40:00 +1100, you wrote:

>At 21:45 16/02/99 -0500, you wrote:
>>Um, or you can just get the stuff for free if you only need 2 of a part.
>
>Yes, great service! I had a part sent free to Australia within 7 working days.
>Well done maxim!
>
>(Just a pity their prices are to high to consider using any of their parts.)
>:-(
...and they usually quote silly leadtimes for production quantities...

1999\02\17@110824 by Ravi Pailoor

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Thats because they are short sighted .......

Pailoor

Wagner Lipnharski wrote:

>  
> I really don't understand why ALL chip producers don't follow this steps, since all the heavy production starts in single prototypes...
>
>                "Long live to the pioneers"
>  

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Email  : .....chiptechKILLspamspam@spam@vsnl.com,
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1999\02\17@121235 by Wagner Lipnharski

picon face
"Short sight" means to be able to see something, at short distance.

"Blind" means to be able to walk slowly with extreme caution.

"Stupid" means a nice blue sky day light, 20/20 vision, brand new black asphalt
road, brand new red Mustang engine running at 6000rpm ... but nobody behind the
wheel.


          "Long Live to the visionary!!!"

Wagner


Ravi Pailoor wrote:
> Thats because they are short sighted .......
> Pailoor

> Wagner Lipnharski wrote:
> >
> > I really don't understand why ALL chip producers don't follow this
> > steps, since all the heavy production starts in single prototypes
> > and needs small quantities in an easy way.

1999\02\18@070628 by Caisson

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> Van: Ravi Pailoor <chiptechspamKILLspamVSNL.COM>
> Aan: .....PICLISTKILLspamspam.....MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Onderwerp: Re: Maxim
> Datum: woensdag 17 februari 1999 16:57
>
> Thats because they are short sighted .......
>
> Pailoor
>
> Wagner Lipnharski wrote:
> >  
> > I really don't understand why ALL chip producers don't follow this
steps,
> > since all the heavy production starts in single prototypes...

Or maybe they do realize that there are a number of hobbyists that only
need one or two of their chips.  Giving those people the chips for free
would not benifit Maxim.  And with that the problem arises how to differ
between "one only" and those who are potential "thousands" customers.  So
they don't.

By the way : The cost of maintaining the above service is quite high too
..

Greetz,
 Rudy Wieser

1999\02\18@103746 by ryan pogge

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> Giving those people the chips for free
>would not benifit Maxim.

of course it does.
it costs them a few cents to do it and then if one of us
makes something that we wish to selll we use their chips.....


 And with that the problem arises how to differ
>between "one only" and those who are potential "thousands" customers.  So
>they don't.

They DO!  what are you talking about.... they even have a web form to fill
out for free samples.

>By the way : The cost of maintaining the above service is quite high too

maybee it is.

>Greetz,
>  Rudy Wieser

1999\02\18@115612 by Wagner Lipnharski

picon face
Do you guys have any idea how much cost a full color page adv
at the any electronic news magazine?  something around $3k,
per issue!!! and some companies like Texas, Maxim, ST, and
others do it every single issue, not in only one magazine,
all year around.
They are trying to show their products to people that even
don't need it, they call it "semi-directed spreading ad".

When you subscribe to some of those companies, like Maxim,
Texas and others, they keep sending you monthly news brochures
about technical news and notices in a special paper, color printed,
and full of details.  Do you know how much cost it? how
much cost the mail to send it to approximately 50 or perhaps
more than 200 thousand guys? who knows?

Are you saying, that to keep one person working full time job
just packing a couple of free chips, sticking address labels
printed from an automated service is too expensive?
Compared to the strong marketing it can do, touching the right
persons directly, charging for it or sending it for free just
don't change *nothing* in their budget.  How many chips do you
really think maxim mail for free per year? 100 thousand? it
will cost them less than just *one* engineer year salary,
doesn't make sense to use that kind of marketing?

Do you know how much cost to print those heavy 800 pages chip
tech spec catalogs?  Internet web sites saved them at least
300 thousand / year, or much more, can you guess? (using pdf).

Come on, just wake up, companies like that have advertisement
budget bigger than a couple million dollars per year, and they
need to apply that where it is more important.

I CAN NOT RECOMMEND ANY CHIP IF I DON'T KNOW HOW IT WORKS!!!

Simple as that!

I have a small company, I do lots of researches, and sometimes
we produce thousand of devices, but this quantity is not important
for those companies?  No company just born producing billions of
devices from one day to another, and even if they do, they use
engineers that (and please bold that words) THEY DO KNOW those
components from somewhere else, sometimes from their own hobby
small bench installed in a corner of their kitchen, playing with
those components from midnight to 2 or 3 in the morning...

Please, tell me that I am wrong, all engineer people never used
at their company projects what they did learn alone during the
cold nights at home?  I am wrong?  I can't be.


Just a question:
Suppose it was impossible to get parts in quantity less than a
reel with a 5 hundred pieces, that would happens to distribution?

Just an answer:
Would collapse selling old AC126 transistors, 7400 TTL gates,
4000 series Cmos, and 8004 cpus!!!

It is that simple.
People buy bananas because they know the taste, and they would not
buy 5 hundred bananas just for the fun to try it, right?
Not even in a big company like IBM, I already worked there!!!

Here it goes, posted and stamped.

-------------------------------------
Wagner Lipnharski - UST Research Inc.
Orlando, Florida  - http://ustr.net
-------------------------------------





ryan pogge wrote:
{Quote hidden}

1999\02\18@121849 by dave vanhorn

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>Please, tell me that I am wrong, all engineer people never used
>at their company projects what they did learn alone during the
>cold nights at home?  I am wrong?  I can't be.

That's how I do it..
Spec sheets often leave out critical little details that can ONLY be caught
in proto.
Also, some companies work in a range where 100 systems in a year is bgi time.
Mr Distributor dosen't like to handle these, so if you can't do it with
DigiKey, you're often SOL.
Companies that support small users can gro along with their users. Witness
Verifone, my old alma mater. They went from 5 guys in an office smaller
than my bedroom, to a $1+B company with somewhere btwn 1k and 2k employees.
One key factor in getting them out the door was small customers that got
the shaft from the competition, (which now holds something like a 10%
market share)

1999\02\18@134625 by wwl

picon face
On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 10:34:23 +0100, you wrote:

>> Van: Ravi Pailoor <EraseMEchiptechspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTVSNL.COM>
>> Aan: PICLISTspamspam_OUTMITVMA.MIT.EDU
>> Onderwerp: Re: Maxim
>> Datum: woensdag 17 februari 1999 16:57
>>
>> Thats because they are short sighted .......
>>
>> Pailoor
>>
>> Wagner Lipnharski wrote:
>> > Ê
>> > I really don't understand why ALL chip producers don't follow this
>steps,
>> > since all the heavy production starts in single prototypes...
>
>Or maybe they do realize that there are a number of hobbyists that only
>need one or two of their chips.  Giving those people the chips for free
>would not benifit Maxim.  And with that the problem arises how to differ
>between "one only" and those who are potential "thousands" customers.  So
>they don't.
Yes, but today's hobbyist may well become tomorrow's professional
designer.

1999\02\18@140736 by Dan Larson

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On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:54:23 -0500, Wagner Lipnharski wrote:

[SNIP]

>
>Are you saying, that to keep one person working full time job
>just packing a couple of free chips, sticking address labels
>printed from an automated service is too expensive?

Only if you consider samples to not have marketing value, could you
come to this conclusion, IMHO.

[SNIP]

>
>I CAN NOT RECOMMEND ANY CHIP IF I DON'T KNOW HOW IT WORKS!!!
>
>Simple as that!
>

I agree. Data sheets are seldom clear , totally accurate, nor sufficient to judg
e
suitability of a device with.

[SNIP]

>
>Please, tell me that I am wrong, all engineer people never used
>at their company projects what they did learn alone during the
>cold nights at home?  I am wrong?  I can't be.
>

[SNIP]

I, for one, sure have been "talking up" PIC's at my company.  Even though I
am a software engineer and not one of the EE's there, I *do* spend a lot of
time working with the EEs and PICs & my projects get mentioned by me a *lot*.

There is even one engineer looking for an embedded controller to be used
in an upcoming project.  Now he is aware if PICs! <G>

I sure don't see how it hurts them at all to give away samples! For every thousa
nd
samples they send out, I wonder how many result in mid to large orders?

I have never heard from my local MicroChip distributor after one year since
requesting the CD on MicroChip's web site. Only after some persistence did I get
a MicroChip
person to personally mail me one. Too Bad.  If our engineer ever requests sample
s
or literature it may be too late for him to consider MicroChip by the time he ge
ts his
samples.  They need to improve that situation.  Great support directly from Micr
oChip
but they don't always choose distributors well.

I can't say that I will ever use or recommend that *distributor* for any thing e
lse in
the future either....

All for the lack of a lousy CD and a few samples.....

Just a hobbyist's $.02

Dan

1999\02\18@152112 by William Chops Westfield

face picon face
   >Are you saying, that to keep one person working full time job
   >just packing a couple of free chips, sticking address labels
   >printed from an automated service is too expensive?

A much better use of money than having some suit pour through D&B
trying to figure out which "companies" have a good enough credit
rating to "deserve" samples.

Most companies could probably save money by having a "hobbyist"
catagory on their sample cards so they know not to do the followup
phone calls and such...

BillW

1999\02\18@152459 by Harrison Cooper

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Guess I am just spoiled....they keep coming to ME and asking if I want
anything.  Got this Atmel starter kit that has been sitting here for about a
month now...

1999\02\19@072548 by Caisson

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> Van: ryan pogge <@spam@poggeKILLspamspamSHORE.INTERCOM.NET>
> Aan: KILLspamPICLISTKILLspamspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Onderwerp: Re: Maxim
> Datum: donderdag 18 februari 1999 16:23
>
> > Giving those people the chips for free
> >would not benifit Maxim.
>
> of course it does.
> it costs them a few cents to do it and then if one of us
> makes something that we wish to selll we use their chips.....

Giving away chips to people who do not need more than the quantities
supplied by the "sample" system (in other words : One-off customers) will
not benifit Maxim.

>   And with that the problem arises how to differ
> >between "one only" and those who are potential "thousands" customers.
So
> >they don't.
>
> They DO!  what are you talking about.... they even have a web form to
fill
> out for free samples.

My impression from the message I reacted to was that they did not.  I'ts a
cost against profit situation (as allways :-).  If a too high a cost is
made for the gain it _will_ be cancelled.

> >By the way : The cost of maintaining the above service is quite high
too.
>
> maybe it is.

It is.  Believe me.  Not the parts themselves, but the people who have to
get, pack & send the stuff make up the largest cost. (Think about it : Why
can you get a device for the price you can only get _one part_ of the same
device for ...)

Greetz,
 Rudy Wieser

1999\02\19@083533 by ryan pogge

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>> > Giving those people the chips for free
>> >would not benifit Maxim.
>>
>> of course it does.
>> it costs them a few cents to do it and then if one of us
>> makes something that we wish to selll we use their
chips.....

>Giving away chips to people who do not need more than the
quantities
>supplied by the "sample" system (in other words : One-off
customers) will
>not benifit Maxim.

it does. read next section

>>   And with that the problem arises how to differ
>> >between "one only" and those who are potential
"thousands" customers.
>So
>> >they don't.
>>
>> They DO!  what are you talking about.... they even have a
web form to
>fill
>> out for free samples.
>
>My impression from the message I reacted to was that they
did not.  I'ts a
>cost against profit situation (as allways :-).  If a too
high a cost is
>made for the gain it _will_ be cancelled.

ok, we are forgeting something.
you must be qualified to get the free samples. I never said
ANYONE could
just get them,(although anyone could if they wanted to...),
obviously you must
an engineer or a student. most companies are MORE than happy
to help students.
DALLAS is a notable one- I e-mailed them and said I was a
student
and wondered if I could get a few 1307, and 1620 samples.
they said sure.
4 days latter, the chips arived , plus some that i didnt ask
for that they though might
be usefull to me, AND a Demo Board!

Moterola is also very helpfull to students.


>> >By the way : The cost of maintaining the above service
is quite high
>too.
>>
>> maybe it is.
>
>It is.  Believe me.  Not the parts themselves, but the
people who have to
>get, pack & send the stuff make up the largest cost. (Think
about it : Why
>can you get a device for the price you can only get _one
part_ of the same
>device for ...)

you think people pack them?
hahahah
try automated packing/lableing/shipping.
for example I ordered 6 tiny ICs from maxim the other day
and
each chip came in its own envelope 4 days latter, 6
gigantic bubble
envelopes stuffed in my mail box.
Woulden't it be more cost efective to put them all in one
package?
obviously automated packing.  (I also read it somewhere, but
thats how i
*figured it out* so to speak).

National semi does the same exact thing..... as do others I
have ordered samples from.

1999\02\19@090102 by Piotr Buciak

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Hello

The other fact is that I requested for chips to MAXIM and I got one of
them twice: one MAX232 from french office of the company and the other one
from local distributor. A friend got 2 CD-ROM catalogues this way !!!.

Piotr Buciak

On Thu, 18 Feb 1999, Caisson wrote:

{Quote hidden}

1999\02\19@111545 by Wagner Lipnharski

picon face
This is nonsense in several aspects, give samples for free or
charge for it is a company top management decision about what
and how they will do with their advertisement budget.

The discussion here, started about the AVAILABILITY to get 2
or 3 single pieces.

As I already said and several other people, we DON'T CARE
if we need to pay the regular market price fot it, but why
in the hell do I need to feel the ugly face of the large
distributor lady on the phone when she noticed that I will
NOT BUY a thousand pieces...???

This is the issue, if the manufacturer don't have a deal with
retail companies like DigiKey or other, they CAN NOT use to
say that their actual distributors will serve the technical
community with a happy and cordial face, because they don't.

Some of those large distributors use to say that there is a
minimum purchase value involved, and THEY ARE RIGHT!!! they
are not a "non profit" organization... they were built to
create profit and make money for the share holders... but
they profit is spreaded over the thousand units purchased
by the customers, not a single tiny bitty SOIC 24c256 unit.

In those cases, the manufacturer MUST OPEN THEIR EYES, and
see that their are doing a big mistake thinking that their
"large distributors" are doing the job to supply single
pieces to the community.  It is a common mistake to say;
"call your local distributor, they will supply sample units
for you"... I don't want sample units, I want to buy 2 units
and be well received as if I was purchasing 2 thousand, and
if the lady wants to be mad, please, be mad with somebody else.

This is a big mistake done by top management that when go to
talk to their distributors, they all use black tie and are
cordial, they smile, fresh water, coffee, and perfum in the
air, but when YOU call those distributors, and talk about
single quantity, you can feel the heat.

Look, this is not a large distribution fault, if I was in their
top management team I would rule the same.

This is a manufacturer's fault, with exception of those already
said, like Maxim, Dallas, HP and few others that found a way
to solve the problem, with free samples or charging for it.

applause for those few ones.

Wagner.

1999\02\19@115611 by Bob Drzyzgula

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On Fri, Feb 19, 1999 at 11:14:39AM -0500, Wagner Lipnharski wrote:
> Look, this is not a large distribution fault, if I was in their
> top management team I would rule the same.
>
> This is a manufacturer's fault, with exception of those already
> said, like Maxim, Dallas, HP and few others that found a way
> to solve the problem, with free samples or charging for it.

Yes and no, perhaps. Distribution agreements are a big
deal, and most are, I believe, carefully negotiated. If
a manufacturer says "contact a distributer for samples",
then it may well be that the terms of their distribution
agreements specify that the distributer will handle
sample distribution as well. In this case, the blame for
a distributer's failure to offer samples will probably be
unequally shared among all parties: The manufacturer for
not enforcing the agreement, the distributer for not living
up to the terms, and the customer for not complaining to
the manufacturer. Still, it is the manufacturer, probably,
who has the most to lose in this situation, and thus it
is the manufacturer who needs to do something about it.

> applause for those few ones.

Yes, indeed.

--
============================================================
Bob Drzyzgula                             It's not a problem
TakeThisOuTbobEraseMEspamspam_OUTdrzyzgula.org                until something bad happens
============================================================

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