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'Ignition timing, 2nd iteration.... [OT]'
2000\05\02@222459 by Andrew Warren

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   This is REALLY off-topic now, but I'm gonna send my reply to the
   list anyway, since the thread seems to be pretty popular.  Note
   that I've added [OT] to the subject line.

John Pearson <spam_OUTPICLISTTakeThisOuTspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU> wrote:

{Quote hidden}

   John:

   What you're seeing is the effect of the FIRST thing I mentioned,
   not the third.

   While it's true that pneumatic rubber tires on asphalt reach
   peak traction when they're slipping a little, you're unlikely to
   see that effect (since your car has relatively-modest power)
   except for a brief moment right after launch or under hard
   braking/cornering (which isn't real applicable to drag racing).

> The thing I wanted to say though, is that I am using street radials.
> The reason they are so poor with acceleration is that they don't
> deform. They are like accelerating with wooden wheels.

   They don't "wind up" like drag slicks (your car wouldn't wind
   drag slicks anyway), and they don't "squish" as much as a drag
   slick would, but they DO squish enough that any wheelspeed-based
   traction-control system would have to account for the change.

   It sounds as though you're relatively new to the whole racing
   thing.  It's great to see that you're so enthusiastic about doing
   your own engine modifications -- that's rare these days, when so
   many people just want to buy mail-order "performance" parts --
   but at this early stage of the game, the most cost-effective way
   to improve your times is probably through improving your own
   driving.  Take a class if one's available at your local strip,
   talk to experienced racers, practice practice practice... That
   sort of thing.

   Computer-controlled spark timing is one of those things that adds
   just a TINY bit of performance to a car that's already running
   near-optimally; you're likely to see MUCH more dramatic gains by
   working on your technique.  If it helps, ask yourself before
   buying any parts, "If John Force were driving my car as-is, could
   he get substantially better times than me?"  As long as the
   answer's yes, you don't need those parts.

   Just a bit of unsolicited advice; feel free to ignore it.

   -Andy (whose last run in his dead-stock daily driver, on street
    tires, was 13.5xx at 108 MPH)


=== Andrew Warren - .....fastfwdKILLspamspam@spam@ix.netcom.com
=== Fast Forward Engineering - San Diego, California
=== http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/2499

2000\05\02@231210 by Dale Botkin

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On Tue, 2 May 2000, Andrew Warren wrote:

>     -Andy (whose last run in his dead-stock daily driver, on street
>      tires, was 13.5xx at 108 MPH)

Andy, what do you drive?  John Force (heck, John Paul II) couldn't pull a
13.5 in my car...  8-)

Dale
('98 Mustang 3.8l, SCCA G Stock, never BEEN to a drag strip - but busily
working on PIC-based convenience and cosmetic mods for my car...)
---
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds new
discoveries, is not "Eureka!" (I found it!) but "That's funny ..."
               -- Isaac Asimov

2000\05\02@232224 by John Pearson

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Andy!

NO WAY! 13.5!!

Just kidding. There is a guy at my track that does this pretty consistantly
in his near bone stock '93 Mustang. I have always wanted to get him into my
car. I know he could knock another .2 secs off my best. I have many more
gray hairs than his dad. Lot of those new Cameros have been hinting at the
high 12s too.

The problem I have is track conditions. Since I rarely race when the bigger
cars are present to lay down some rubber, and I usually race at night when
temps can go from 90* to 60* in a matter of two hours, with fog, and
everyone starts throwing water out their tailpipes and track workers stand
on the starting line with mops.... well, I think you get the  my drift.

What happens is every once and a while I apply just 1 hp to much to the
rear wheels and away they go. A lost race if I am not lucky enough to
feather the gas and recover perfectly. I am not trying to gain lower short
times, just trying to get more consistant times and avoid the occasional
spin.

Thanks Andy.

John
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{Quote hidden}

2000\05\03@003124 by Andrew Warren

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Dale Botkin <@spam@PICLISTKILLspamspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU> wrote:

> >     -Andy (whose last run in his dead-stock daily driver, on street
> >      tires, was 13.5xx at 108 MPH)
>
> Andy, what do you drive?  John Force (heck, John Paul II) couldn't
> pull a 13.5 in my car...  8-)

   My daily driver's a '94 NSX.

> Dale ('98 Mustang 3.8l, SCCA G Stock, never BEEN to a drag strip -
> but busily working on PIC-based convenience and cosmetic mods for
> my car...)

   Which SCCA region?  If it's somewhere around here (San Diego/Cal
   Club), maybe I'll see you race sometime.

   -Andy


=== Andrew Warren - KILLspamfastfwdKILLspamspamix.netcom.com
=== Fast Forward Engineering - San Diego, California
=== http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/2499

2000\05\03@115623 by Dale Botkin

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On Tue, 2 May 2000, Andrew Warren wrote:

> Dale Botkin <RemoveMEPICLISTTakeThisOuTspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU> wrote:
>
> > >     -Andy (whose last run in his dead-stock daily driver, on street
> > >      tires, was 13.5xx at 108 MPH)
> >
> > Andy, what do you drive?  John Force (heck, John Paul II) couldn't
> > pull a 13.5 in my car...  8-)
>
>     My daily driver's a '94 NSX.

Well, then, I suppose that would pretty much explain it.

> > Dale ('98 Mustang 3.8l, SCCA G Stock, never BEEN to a drag strip -
> > but busily working on PIC-based convenience and cosmetic mods for
> > my car...)
>
>     Which SCCA region?  If it's somewhere around here (San Diego/Cal
>     Club), maybe I'll see you race sometime.

Nebraska region.  And I'm taking this year off.  I'm trying to decide
whether to stay stock and have a few wins, or move to ESP and do what I
want with the car, but never see another trophy as long as I live.  Or I
may just not race at all until I can get an F500 to play with.  I do plan
to get out to SD this summer for a class, though, but probably won't be
around for the weekend.

Dale
---
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds new
discoveries, is not "Eureka!" (I found it!) but "That's funny ..."
               -- Isaac Asimov

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