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PICList Thread
'Hey! I know these jerks. (Was Tiffany's Pictures o'
1997\04\26@172729 by Martin McCormick

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       I thought something looked familiar about the answerme.com domain
which showed up in that last Spam which went "SPLAT" in to our list.  I did

whois answerme.com and got the following:

Cyber Promotions (ANSWERME4-DOM)
  8001 Castor Avenue, Suite #127
  Philadelphia, PA 19152
  USA

  Domain Name: ANSWERME.COM

  Administrative Contact, Technical Contact, Zone Contact:
     Wallace, Sanford  (SW1708)  spam_OUTdomregTakeThisOuTspamCYBERPROMO.COM
     215-628-9780
  Billing Contact:
     Wallace, Sanford  (SW1708)  .....domregKILLspamspam@spam@CYBERPROMO.COM
     215-628-9780

  Record last updated on 23-Apr-97.
  Record created on 23-Apr-97.
  Database last updated on 26-Apr-97 06:40:45 EDT.

       This guy is known in the network abuse news groups as
Wallace Spamford.  This is probably the fellow who is in one way or other
responsible for all the Spam we have been getting on this list recently.

       There is a toll-free number for Cyber Promotions (800-650-9110)
and they used to have VoiceMail, but they probably got tired of all the
angry people like me who lost their heads and called every extension in
their little Mafia and told them what it meant to be Spammed.  Now, you get
a recording stating that the number has been disconnected.  It hasn't.
That recording is a fake and if you hit 1, you get a prompt for a mailbox
number.  The * afterwards prompts for a password.  You then get in to an
infinite loop of mailbox, password, etc as long as you want to keep hitting
*.

       I wonder if anybody has used a pay phone or a big PBX, somewhere in
North America and done such a childish thing to this businessman?

       I am sending a copy of the Spam to agis.net, Spamford's network
provider.  The word on the street is that it does absolutely no good at all,
but one can't say we didn't try.

       I am sorry to add another non-technical message to the list, but
if you hate getting this junk, this is one of the best leads in snuffing it
out we have seen in a long time.

Martin McCormick

1997\04\26@191230 by Andrew Warren

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Martin McCormick <PICLISTspamKILLspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU> wrote:

> I am sending a copy of the Spam to agis.net, Spamford's network
> provider.  The word on the street is that it does absolutely no
> good at all, but one can't say we didn't try.

Martin:

AGIS has no interest in responding to complaints about spam; unlike
most other ISPs, they do not have policies that restrict their
customers from sending unsolicited bulk e-mail.  Because of this
liberal policy, they've become a haven for companies like Cyber
Promotions.

A number of ISPs are currently considering wholesale blocking of all
incoming e-mail from AGIS domains; if they decide to go ahead and
do it, that blocking will probably start to happen sometime in the
next month or so.

-Andy

=== Andrew Warren - .....fastfwdKILLspamspam.....ix.netcom.com
=== Fast Forward Engineering, Vista, California
=== http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/2499

1997\04\27@054245 by Martin McCormick

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In message <EraseME199704262310.SAA13309spam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTdfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com>, Andrew Warren writes
:
>A number of ISPs are currently considering wholesale blocking of all
>incoming e-mail from AGIS domains; if they decide to go ahead and
>do it, that blocking will probably start to happen sometime in the
>next month or so.

       Some sites are already blocking packets from spamnets at the router
level, but that isn't a good idea if there is any possibility of anybody
other than con artists using the blocked nets.

Martin

1997\04\27@065702 by Andrew Warren

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Martin McCormick <PICLISTspamspam_OUTMITVMA.MIT.EDU> wrote:

> > A number of ISPs are currently considering wholesale blocking of
> > all incoming e-mail from AGIS domains; if they decide to go ahead
> > and do it, that blocking will probably start to happen sometime
> > in the next month or so.
>
> Some sites are already blocking packets from spamnets at the router
> level, but that isn't a good idea if there is any possibility of
> anybody other than con artists using the blocked nets.

Martin:

If AGIS is outlawed, only outlaws will use AGIS.

-Andy

P.S.  Cyber Promotions and other spammers are starting to add
     "Confirm Receipt" and "Confirm Reading" headers to the mail
     they send to internet mailing lists.  Some mailing lists (like
     the PICLIST, as far as I know) strip off the "Confirm Receipt"
     requests, but some don't... And nearly all of them pass the
     "Confirm Reading" requests straight through to their
     subscribers.

     If your mail-client responds to those headers, it will
     automatically send your e-mail address to Cyber Promotions
     every time you open one of their messages... So you may want
     to disable your mail-client's confirmation feature.

=== Andrew Warren - @spam@fastfwdKILLspamspamix.netcom.com
=== Fast Forward Engineering, Vista, California
=== http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/2499

1997\04\28@132841 by .EDU>

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>         There is a toll-free number for Cyber Promotions (800-650-9110)
> and they used to have VoiceMail, but they probably got tired of all the
> angry people like me who lost their heads and called every extension in
> their little Mafia and told them what it meant to be Spammed.  Now, you get
> a recording stating that the number has been disconnected.  It hasn't.
>
> That recording is a fake and if you hit 1, you get a prompt for a mailbox
> number.  The * afterwards prompts for a password.  You then get in to an
> infinite loop of mailbox, password, etc as long as you want to keep hitting
> *.

It seems like a *good idea* to me, to dial that 800 number and hear all the
options you possibly can, yup, just keep listening and listening, uh-huh,
maybe keep searching through their ``help'' options, idunno, maybe after
some many minutes on their 800 number, you might get a message through to
them, after all!  I might want to hit * for hours, even.

Peter F. Klammer                                       KILLspamPKlammerKILLspamspamACM.Org
w:(303)773-7411 h:(303)233-9485   EEPROM: mere bridge techology to FRAM
3200 Routt Street           Learn about League for Programming Freedom!
Wheat Ridge, Colorado 80033       by sending email to: RemoveMElpfTakeThisOuTspamuunet.uu.net

1997\04\28@142757 by Raak, Cory

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Sounds like a good pic project DTMF encoder!!!!!!!!!!
I wonder if that is legal, you could have speaker hooked up to monitor
it, call it a spam retaliator!!!!!!!
{Quote hidden}

1997\04\28@150724 by Christopher Zguris

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At 02:16 PM 4/28/97 -0400, Raak, Cory wrote:
>Sounds like a good pic project DTMF encoder!!!!!!!!!!
>I wonder if that is legal, you could have speaker hooked up to monitor
>it, call it a spam retaliator!!!!!!!

Or use a pc with a modem.

It is illegal, the 800# owner will also have a record of the number you dial
from so he could harrass you back and/or file charges.

Another _really_good_ solution would be to close this list to
non-subscribers -- is the owner listening? Does he care?

Chris

   ======================================================================
                 Christopher Zguris  -  RemoveMEczgurisspam_OUTspamKILLspaminterport.net

                               HSTA, HRCA, AMA

                   If you don't learn from your mistakes,
                   there's really no sense in making them.

   ======================================================================

1997\04\29@011842 by John Payson

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>>
It seems like a *good idea* to me, to dial that 800 number and hear all the
options you possibly can, yup, just keep listening and listening, uh-huh,
maybe keep searching through their ``help'' options, idunno, maybe after
some many minutes on their 800 number, you might get a message through to
them, after all!  I might want to hit * for hours, even.
<<

Well, retaliating in this fashion would be easy and given the number of
such promotions that include 800#'s a PIC-based auto-retaliator would
almost be useful except for one thing:

 Deliberately harassing the onwer of any number, deliberate overloading
 of voice-mail systems, etc. are all *illegal*.  Many companies with 800#'s
 have, or can get, a complete list of who called them; caller-ID blocking
 won't stop that.  If they see that they've spent $20 on calls from a cer-
 tain number (yours) and haven't made any sales contact with you, odds are
 pretty good you'll get billed for that $20 plus collection costs.  Bad
 idea.

On the other hand, a PIC-based device which could take over the phone when
some salesdroid calls and make suitable mildly-interested noises so as to
keep the guy busy might be a nice thing to have.  Maybe not as effective as
bill-bombing 800#'s, but far less dangerous.

[nb: there is nothing illegal about calling an 800# for a company whose pro-
duct you're 99% sure you're not interested in.  Calling back repeatedly is
illegal, and deliberate conspiracy to have lots of people call a number for
the purpose of bill-bombing is illegal, but if everyone who received such a
spam "just happened" to call the 800#, that might help.  On the other hand,
I'd be concerned that they'd add my phone number (obtained via ANI) to their
solicitation list.

Attachment converted: wonderland:WINMAIL.DAT 1 (????/----) (0000ECC4)

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