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PICList Thread
'Advertisements on the PICLIST'
1995\02\04@234153 by jory bell

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Andrew Warren sent me email asking:

>Was I out of line sending that message about Lance Walley's "Surplus.txt
>as promised" message?  Please clarify the list's policy regarding this
>type of "SALE!!  THIS MONTH ONLY!!!" advertising.

I responded as follows:

{Quote hidden}

1995\02\05@005442 by Brian Lane

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On Sat, 4 Feb 1995, jory bell wrote:

> Andrew Warren sent me email asking:
>
> >Was I out of line sending that message about Lance Walley's "Surplus.txt
> >as promised" message?  Please clarify the list's policy regarding this
> >type of "SALE!!  THIS MONTH ONLY!!!" advertising.
>

  [chop... chop....]

 Well I guess I'll wade in here. First an introduction. I am currently
employed as a microprocessor programmer for a consultant in Washington
State, up near Mt. Rainier. We mostly do controllers for Ship to Shore HF
radios, and handheld VHF radios using Motorola 68HCxx parts. I use PICs
in my home projects(built a distinctive ring switcher). I am also working
on a B.S. EET degree at the local community college, and preparing to set
up a limited Internet Provider/BBS with my Linux box.

OK, as to commercialism on the list I think it has a place when it is
in response to someone's question. BUT just posting announcements of
commercial products 'Really Bugs Me' I personally don't use any of
Parallax's products, and am not interested in them. I see their ads in
CCI and I believe that's all the exposure I want.

If Lance got requests for information from list subscribers, he should
be emailing them directly instead of thru the list. In my opinion the
list should be for the discussion of the technical aspects of using the
PIC processors, not as a target for marketing types(not that I am
accusing Lance of 'targeting' the list).

    Brian

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1995\02\05@090701 by tom

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Brian Lane <spam_OUTblaneTakeThisOuTspamnyx10.cs.du.edu> Wrote:
> On Sat, 4 Feb 1995, jory bell wrote:
> > Andrew Warren sent me email asking:
> >
> > >Was I out of line sending that message about Lance Walley's "Surplus.txt
> > >as promised" message?  Please clarify the list's policy regarding this
> > >type of "SALE!!  THIS MONTH ONLY!!!" advertising.
> >
>
>    [chop... chop....]
>
>Hack<

>  If Lance got requests for information from list subscribers, he should
> be emailing them directly instead of thru the list.

I hold no brief for Lance, but in fairness it looked like a cock-up to me.:)

The list-address was left in by accident ?

> In my opinion the list should be for the discussion of the technical aspects
> of using the PIC processors, not as a target for marketing types(not that I
> am accusing Lance of 'targeting' the list).
Fine dividing line to tread here IMO.

I'll wait to see Lance's grovelling apology :) :) :)
__
  TAK

1995\02\05@094507 by Timothy McDonough DIAL UP1

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FWIW, I think the message in question from Lance should have been to the
effect that they had decided to have a sale on the discontinued tools and
people should ftp the file from Parallax if interested.

Posting it only once would have been good too, although I suspect the
multiple posts were a technical glitch and not intentional.

Tim McDonough -- .....timmedKILLspamspam@spam@cencom.net

On Sat, 4 Feb 1995, jory bell wrote:

> Andrew Warren sent me email asking:
>
> >Was I out of line sending that message about Lance Walley's "Surplus.txt
> >as promised" message?  Please clarify the list's policy regarding this
> >type of "SALE!!  THIS MONTH ONLY!!!" advertising.
>
[snip]

> >
> >Were you around when Lance first came on the list a couple months ago? He
> >posted some (in my opinion) spam, and I called him on it in an exchange
> >posted to the list (which I would be happy to forward to you). He promptly
> >apologized for his possible misdeeds, but many members of the list were
> >fairly supportive of his posting and a relatively high degree of general
> >commercialism (much to my chagrin).

1995\02\06@082809 by Ran Talbott

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>FWIW, I think the message in question from Lance should have been to the
>effect that they had decided to have a sale on the discontinued tools and
>people should ftp the file from Parallax if interested.

I agree.  Tim's comments are along the lines of the ones I made a while back
on sci.electronics when someone from National Semi was asking how vendors
should use the net.  The philosophy I suggested then was to broadcast only
"invitations to contact" (e.g.,  announcements of WWW or ftp site openings),
not the information itself.

In addition to Tim's recommendation,  I'd suggest three other criteria for
"commercial" postings to the list:

  1. That they be *directly* PIC-related.  I.e.,  it's okay to annouce a new
     PIC cross-assembler,  but not a "hot deal" on hard disks on the grounds
     that "PIC developers use machines with hard disks for compiling".
  2. That the info not be readily-available in the press.  E.g.,  Parallax
     announcing a sale on surplus equipment would be okay,  but not
     using the list to advertise their "hobbyist special" programmer,
     because that's part of their regular advertising.
  3. The information has to be "incomplete":  no snail mail addresses,
     no phone numbers,  no exact prices.  That would tend to (though not
     always,  of course) require email contact to make any sales,  which
     would discourage people from trying to use the list as an ad medium.

I think this makes a fairly good compromise that benefits all concerned,
while minimizing annoyance and noise.

Ran

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