Searching \ for 'AVR, PIC or ...' in subject line. ()
Make payments with PayPal - it's fast, free and secure! Help us get a faster server
FAQ page: www.piclist.com/techref/microchip/devices.htm?key=pic
Search entire site for: 'AVR, PIC or ...'.

Truncated match.
PICList Thread
'AVR, PIC or ...'
2004\02\25@163850 by Stef Mientki

flavicon
face
I just received the engeneering review from Maxim.
If I only take a look at the pictures,
we should immediatly stop using PICs and AVRs and go for Maxim.
Judge yourself:
 http://pdfserv.maxim-ic.com/en/ej/MER_3.pdf

Stef Mientki

--
http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList
spam_OUTpiclist-unsubscribe-requestTakeThisOuTspammitvma.mit.edu

2004\02\25@165548 by Ken Pergola

flavicon
face
Stef Mientki wrote:

> I just received the engineering review from Maxim.
> If I only take a look at the pictures,
> we should immediately stop using PICs and AVRs and go for Maxim.
> Judge yourself:
>   http://pdfserv.maxim-ic.com/en/ej/MER_3.pdf


Hi Stef,

Will make interesting reading.

The PIC18 architecture has been out since 1999 -- I wish Maxim used it for
comparison instead of the midrange PICs.

Regards,

Ken Pergola

--
http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList
.....piclist-unsubscribe-requestKILLspamspam@spam@mitvma.mit.edu

2004\02\25@181135 by Matt Pobursky

flavicon
face
On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:55:14 -0500, Ken Pergola wrote:
> Stef Mientki wrote:
>
> > I just received the engineering review from Maxim.
> > If I only take a look at the pictures,
> > we should immediately stop using PICs and AVRs and go for Maxim.
> > Judge yourself:
> >  http://pdfserv.maxim-ic.com/en/ej/MER_3.pdf
>
> Hi Stef,
>
> Will make interesting reading.
>
> The PIC18 architecture has been out since 1999 -- I wish Maxim used it for
> comparison instead of the midrange PICs.

I'm glad they included the MSP430 family also, I've been using a lot of
them lately.

After reading quickly through the article, it's obvious some sales geek
wrote it. Lots of real world considerations not accounted for in the
comparisons and benchmarking (like the fact their power consumption
benchmarks were from *simulations*). We'll see how the chips really
perform when real silicon arrives on the scene.

Oh, and by the way -- I can actually *BUY* PICs, AVRs and MSP430's.
Even if these new Maxim chips were real, I think most PIClisters know
how realiable Maxim is for having stock available. I won't even get
into pricing issues...

And another thing, they only list Keil as the preferred tool source.
Anyone familiar with Keil knows their tools are excellent, but we are
looking at >$2500 for a C compiler/Assembler/Debugger suite. Ouch. So
much for hobbyists or projects on a budget.

Call me a skeptic, I'll be surprised if these chips are anything but
moderately successful. They don't do anything that much better than the
PIC, AVR or MSP430 family -- and those chip families all have a solid
infrastructure complete with low-cost 3rd party tools available.

Matt Pobursky
Maximum Performance Systems

--
http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList
piclist-unsubscribe-requestspamKILLspammitvma.mit.edu

2004\02\25@182212 by Bruce

flavicon
face
> Oh, and by the way -- I can actually *BUY* PICs, AVRs and MSP430's.

Good point.......;o]


Regards,

-Bruce
.....techKILLspamspam.....rentron.com
http://www.rentron.com

--
http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList
EraseMEpiclist-unsubscribe-requestspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTmitvma.mit.edu

2004\02\25@183629 by Omega Software

flavicon
face
>Call me a skeptic, I'll be surprised if these chips are anything but
>moderately successful. They don't do anything that much better than the
>PIC, AVR or MSP430 family -- and those chip families all have a solid
>infrastructure complete with low-cost 3rd party tools available.

I'm generally in favour of SIC (Single Instruction Computer) architectures,
I designed one myself, together with several AMUs (Arithmetic Movement
Units).

But, about the MAXQ, they didn't make any mention to the MHz they think
they'll reach (but they claim to have made accurate simulations of power
consumption, thus they could have provided some MHz figure as well).

Moreover, using the PIC16 as comparation is unfair, to say the least.
The MAXQ is probably superior even to the PIC18, but making such an
unfair comparison abusing the PIC16 doesn't tell me many good things
about the "honesty" of the whole presentation, and thus I tend to become
skeptical also about the rest.

For what we know, the chips may have such a complex logic that, not being
pipelined, the max clock speed may very well be low, vanishing every
advantages in terms of cycles/instruction.

It's like in the times of Z80 vs 6502.. many 6502 supporters (I was
among them) said that the 6502 was superior because of the lower average
cycle count per instruction. But the Z80 was available at more MHz than
the 6502..
I didn't understand, at that time, that by using the same fabrication
process two designs may have different clock speeds. Evidently the Z80
gained back somewhere else (not really pipelined, but..) what it lost
in the cycle count.
Cycles per instruction say nothing, if one doesn't say also the max
clock speed. I can make a CPU that calculates a logarithm function in
just one clock cycle.. wow, but with a max clock speed of 100 KHz. So
that should not be "wow", but "bad design". Having as little logic as
possible between each clock cycle is what makes a good design (that's
how I like to say it in my mind).

You said it right.. that presentation has been written by some marketing
guy.. those are truly skilled when it comes to convince us not to buy
something.

Anyway, let's wait and see something more concrete.

--
http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList
piclist-unsubscribe-requestspamspam_OUTmitvma.mit.edu

2004\02\25@183632 by Stef Mientki

flavicon
face
>Matt Pobursky
>Maximum Performance Systems
>
>
Maxim .... ;-)


--
http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList
@spam@piclist-unsubscribe-requestKILLspamspammitvma.mit.edu

2004\02\26@024713 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> I just received the engeneering review from Maxim.
> If I only take a look at the pictures,
> we should immediatly stop using PICs and AVRs and go for Maxim.
> Judge yourself:
>   http://pdfserv.maxim-ic.com/en/ej/MER_3.pdf

Two key issues seem to be missing: price and availability!

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products

--
http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic:
[PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

2004\02\26@044352 by hael Rigby-Jones

picon face
{Quote hidden}

Absolutely agree. The MAXQ20 at least seems to be a direct competitor to the
18F.

The benchmarks are also mighty suspect to say the least.  For starters no
source code is shown for most of them, and the cycle count for the PIC's is
frankly ludicrous e.g.

Shift a 16 bit value right two bits, allegedly the PIC takes 40 cycles!

clrc                    ;1
rrf  val+1,f    ;1
rrf  val,f              ;1
clrc                    ;1
rrf  val+1,f    ;1
rrf  val,f              ;1

I make that 6 cycles + a couple for initial bank setting if we are being
fussy.

How about sending an 8 bit value out on two pins, SPI style?  They reckon
the PIC takes 296 cycles to do this!  I can only imagaine the guy who wrote
the code must be a bit slack, because they'd never make up those numbers now
would they?

Regards

Mike




=======================================================================
This e-mail is intended for the person it is addressed to only. The
information contained in it may be confidential and/or protected by
law. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, you must
not make any use of this information, or copy or show it to any
person. Please contact us immediately to tell us that you have
received this e-mail, and return the original to us. Any use,
forwarding, printing or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.
No part of this message can be considered a request for goods or
services.
=======================================================================
Any questions about Bookham's E-Mail service should be directed to
spamBeGonepostmasterspamBeGonespambookham.com.

--
http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic:
[PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

2004\02\26@094300 by Spehro Pefhany

picon face
At 09:42 AM 2/26/2004 +0000, you wrote:

>The benchmarks are also mighty suspect to say the least.  For starters no
>source code is shown for most of them, and the cycle count for the PIC's is
>frankly ludicrous e.g.
>
>Shift a 16 bit value right two bits, allegedly the PIC takes 40 cycles!
>
>clrc                    ;1
>rrf  val+1,f    ;1
>rrf  val,f              ;1
>clrc                    ;1
>rrf  val+1,f    ;1
>rrf  val,f              ;1
>
>I make that 6 cycles + a couple for initial bank setting if we are being
>fussy.

I think they are multiplying machine cycles by 4 to get Fosc cycles in
PIC parlance. Make more sense?

>How about sending an 8 bit value out on two pins, SPI style?  They reckon
>the PIC takes 296 cycles to do this!  I can only imagaine the guy who wrote
>the code must be a bit slack, because they'd never make up those numbers now
>would they?


Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
TakeThisOuTspeffEraseMEspamspam_OUTinterlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com

--
http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic:
[PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

More... (looser matching)
- Last day of these posts
- In 2004 , 2005 only
- Today
- New search...