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'[PICLIST] Strange errors with max232 chip'
2001\12\28@093913 by Kathy Quinlan

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Hi all :o)

Now before anyone says this is not possible, I am off the morphine, I slept
last night, I had regular breaks from the computer, and I can not drink
alcohol after having my gall bladder removed, but this happened and I saw
it, and if someone wants I can post the MAX 232 chip to them so they can
vouch for this fault ;o) (if I do not turn it in to a pet first ;o)


Ok I have an AVR 8515 (but any Uc will do this) I connected it up as per the
destruction manual (correctly as a new chip fixed the fault) my program is
set to receive a byte, and then dump one out back to the PC. nothing
happened under hyperterm, but using term95 (from my beloved Norton's
commander) in hex mode I found that with every byte I sent, the result was
above normal 7 bit hex (infact shifted one bit to the left (^2)) and a byte
of 00h followed it.

Now correct me if I am wrong the MAX 232 only level shifts and inverts (plus
generates the + - 10V) so how can it do this ??

Yes I did remove the AVR and short the TX and RX ttl lines and same problem
so it has to be the MAX 232 (it is built on strip board but the tracks and
jumpers are less than 2")

Any ideas ???

Also anyone know a good hex terminal for win 2k as hyperterm is giving me
the S$%TS

Regards,

Kat.

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2001\12\28@102900 by David VanHorn

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>
>Now correct me if I am wrong the MAX 232 only level shifts and inverts (plus
>generates the + - 10V) so how can it do this ??

The max232 is ONLY a level shifter, but this assumes that it is a properly
working MAX232.

You should be able to pop a square wave into it, and scope the output, and
they should be the same, with just a tiny time delay. If not, it's time for
Widlar Optimization.

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2001\12\28@104450 by Thomas C. Sefranek

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I'd Guess you have the charge pump clock clocking the "data".

If it doesn't offend you I suggest checking the wiring to look for
missing ground or an EXTRA ground to a charge cap that is NOT supposed
to be there.

Kathy Quinlan wrote:

{Quote hidden}

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2001\12\28@105406 by David VanHorn

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Any chance you're whanging the data out pin in the routine that feeds bytes
to the uart?
That might account for the glitch. It seems suspiciously consistant.
That is a lot of time though, a bit-time, at any baud, is a long time to a
micro.

Do you set up the port once and leave it, or are you re-configuring the DDR ?

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2001\12\28@110345 by Kathy Quinlan

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----- Original Message -----
From: "David VanHorn" <.....dvanhornKILLspamspam@spam@CEDAR.NET>

> Any chance you're whanging the data out pin in the routine that feeds
bytes
> to the uart?
> That might account for the glitch. It seems suspiciously consistant.
> That is a lot of time though, a bit-time, at any baud, is a long time to a
> micro.
>
> Do you set up the port once and leave it, or are you re-configuring the
DDR ?

Set it up once and leave it :o)

----- Original Message -----
From: "Thomas C. Sefranek" <tcsspamKILLspamCMCORP.COM>

> I'd Guess you have the charge pump clock clocking the "data".
>
> If it doesn't offend you I suggest checking the wiring to look for
> missing ground or an EXTRA ground to a charge cap that is NOT supposed
> to be there.

checked that first hon, spent 2 days on this fault :o(

but the new chip fixed the fault, so I am guessing it is the old chip :o)

Regards,

Kat.


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----- Original Message -----
From: "David VanHorn" <.....dvanhornKILLspamspam.....CEDAR.NET>
To: <EraseMEPICLISTspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Friday, December 28, 2001 11:55 PM
Subject: Re: Strange errors with max232 chip


> Any chance you're whanging the data out pin in the routine that feeds
bytes
> to the uart?
> That might account for the glitch. It seems suspiciously consistant.
> That is a lot of time though, a bit-time, at any baud, is a long time to a
> micro.
>
> Do you set up the port once and leave it, or are you re-configuring the
DDR ?
>
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>

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2001\12\28@110819 by uter van ooijen & floortje hanneman

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did you try to loopback without the max?

Wouter van Ooijen

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2001\12\28@111025 by uter van ooijen & floortje hanneman

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> The max232 is ONLY a level shifter, but this assumes that it is a properly
> working MAX232.

PLUS inverter

Wouter van Ooijen

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2001\12\28@111234 by David VanHorn
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>
>checked that first hon, spent 2 days on this fault :o(
>
>but the new chip fixed the fault, so I am guessing it is the old chip :o)

I had a PIO chip (essentially, the same I/O ports as an AVR, but for a 6502
system) that had reversed bit ordering after a lightning hit.  This PIO had
two ports used as digit strobes for a display, so the display spelled out
everything backwards.

Bit 0 came out on bit 7's pin, bit 1 on bit 6's pin, and so on, for both
ports.

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2001\12\28@111609 by David VanHorn

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At 12:04 PM 12/28/01 +0100, wouter van ooijen & floortje hanneman wrote:
> > The max232 is ONLY a level shifter, but this assumes that it is a properly
> > working MAX232.
>
>PLUS inverter

+5 to --12 is a level shift...
:)

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2001\12\28@112310 by uter van ooijen & floortje hanneman

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> +5 to --12 is a level shift...
> :)

Yeah, but it does not shift 0v to -17v :(

Wouter van Ooijen

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2001\12\28@112725 by uter van ooijen & floortje hanneman

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better keep the thread on the list...

I assume you are taling about the caps on the max232? any value from 1 to 22
uF will do.

But I have the idea that you are trying to do somehing that
might be a little beyond your grasp.

Wouter van Ooijen

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{Original Message removed}

2001\12\28@113246 by Herbert Graf

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Actually it isn't really an "inverter", since a 1 in RS232 is a negative
voltage and a one in TTL/CMOS is a positive voltage, and that is what the
MAX232 does, you can't really call it an inverter. TTYL


> {Original Message removed}

2001\12\28@124028 by Thomas C. Sefranek

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Hon?

Hon?

Young lady I appreciate the honor you do me!

About the fix, Hurrah and a Tiger for you!
Happy New Year!


Kathy Quinlan wrote:

>
>
>{Original Message removed}

2001\12\28@143138 by myke predko

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Hi Kathy,

Looking through what you're seeing I think you have left the default Flow
Control to "Hardware".

"Disconnect" Hyperterminal (it comes up as "Connect" as a matter of course),
click on "Properties" and then select the "Connect To" tab and click on
"Configure".  In the new dialog box that comes up, select "None" for "Flow
Control".

I think you'll find that by default, "Flow Control" is set to "Hardware".

One trick that I always use when setting up RS-232 connections is to short
"DSR" to "DTR" and "RTS" to "CTS".  This will "fool" the hardware flow
control into recognizing that the other device is fat, dumb and ready to
communicate.

Good luck!

myke
{Original Message removed}

2001\12\28@200135 by Kathy Quinlan

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----- Original Message -----
From: "myke predko" <mykespamspam_OUTPASSPORT.CA>

> Hi Kathy,
>
> Looking through what you're seeing I think you have left the default Flow
> Control to "Hardware".

Nope

> One trick that I always use when setting up RS-232 connections is to short
> "DSR" to "DTR" and "RTS" to "CTS".  This will "fool" the hardware flow
> control into recognizing that the other device is fat, dumb and ready to
> communicate.

done in the breakout box.

> Good luck!

It works as I said with a new chip, I am wondering why I get the errors with
the old chip.  as it does not seem possible that this chip could produce
these errors.

Regards,

Kat.


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2001\12\29@092418 by SM Ling

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> It works as I said with a new chip, I am wondering why I get the errors
with
> the old chip.  as it does not seem possible that this chip could produce
> these errors.

Mostly that the capacitance are under-value.  What the values now?  and are
the two Max232 having the same suffixes?

Cheers, Ling SM

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2001\12\30@012359 by Alexandre Domingos F. Souza

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>Hi all :o)

       Hi =(^.^)= (meow!)

>Now before anyone says this is not possible, I am off the morphine, I slept
>last night, I had regular breaks from the computer, and I can not drink
>alcohol after having my gall bladder removed, but this happened and I saw

       Hmmm, are you crazy?

>it, and if someone wants I can post the MAX 232 chip to them so they can
>vouch for this fault ;o) (if I do not turn it in to a pet first ;o)

       Hmmm, post a chip? in the net? how do you do that? ;o) Maybe transmogrifying the chip? ;oD

>Ok I have an AVR 8515 (but any Uc will do this) I connected it up as per the
>destruction manual (correctly as a new chip fixed the fault) my program is

       HUauhauhauhauh

>Now correct me if I am wrong the MAX 232 only level shifts and inverts
>(plus
>generates the + - 10V) so how can it do this ??

       Yep! But if the MAX 232 has some error like different voltages generated on rs232 line due fo fauty capacitors (yep, it happened!) or some internal craziness. Have you changed it for another MAX232 (yep, stupid question, but just asking ;o)) or MAX232A (I had some problems with the old MAX232 version, corrected when I used the A version

>Also anyone know a good hex terminal for win 2k as hyperterm is giving me
>the S$%TS

       Why use windows 2000? For experimenting on the lab table, I have

       - an old IBM Thinkpad 350C (anyone has a battery - even broken - for it, pleeeaaaaaaaasseeeeee)
       - a nice old 386 DX 40 with CGA monitor
       - the nicest of all - HP 200 LX running Telix, only for comm tests

       These are so cheap that is better than use your w2k mamooth for lab testing ;o)


---8<---Corte aqui---8<----

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2001\12\30@012409 by Alexandre Domingos F. Souza

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>they should be the same, with just a tiny time delay. If not, it's time for
>Widlar Optimization.

       ¿


---8<---Corte aqui---8<----

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2001\12\30@024030 by Kathy Quinlan

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Alexandre Domingos F. Souza" <RemoveMEtaitoTakeThisOuTspamTERRA.COM.BR>

Why use windows 2000? For experimenting on the lab table, I have

       - an old IBM Thinkpad 350C (anyone has a battery - even broken - for
it, pleeeaaaaaaaasseeeeee)
       - a nice old 386 DX 40 with CGA monitor
       - the nicest of all - HP 200 LX running Telix, only for comm tests

       These are so cheap that is better than use your w2k mamooth for lab
testing ;o)

Because I run other software like protel 99SE ;o) (win95 and 98 gave major
memory problems with Protel 99SE and winamp running )

Regards,

Kat.

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2001\12\30@033459 by Alexandre Domingos F. Souza

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       =(^.^)=,

>Because I run other software like protel 99SE ;o) (win95 and 98 gave major
>memory problems with Protel 99SE and winamp running )

       Interesting, had protel 99 around here, and never saw these errors... ;o)


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2001\12\30@093500 by Gerhard Fiedler

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At 22:40 12/28/2001 +0800, Kathy Quinlan wrote:
>Also anyone know a good hex terminal for win 2k as hyperterm is giving me
>the S$%TS

I just stumbled over this one
<http://www.endymion.com/portfolio/software/comlite32.htm>. Never tried it,
but it's free and looks like something to try, at least.

ge

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2001\12\30@100604 by bob

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Good program but could not download it from that site, but found it here
http://www.rtcard.com/comlab32.html

Bob

{Original Message removed}

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