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'[PIC] Pickit2 debugging with Linux'
2010\05\11@203822 by Matt Callow

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Hi All,

Are there any solutions for debugging using the pickit2 under Linux?
All of the Linux tools I have found either a) only allow programming
(no debug) or b) only support pickit2 v1.x firmware

I've been looking at the pickit2 protocol and scripts and it looks
like it would be possible to get the debug facilities working, but I'd
like to know what existing tools are available.

Matt

2010\05\11@211917 by Xiaofan Chen

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On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 8:38 AM, Matt Callow <spam_OUTmc-listsTakeThisOuTspamtesco.net> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> Are there any solutions for debugging using the pickit2 under Linux?
> All of the Linux tools I have found either a) only allow programming
> (no debug) or b) only support pickit2 v1.x firmware
>
> I've been looking at the pickit2 protocol and scripts and it looks
> like it would be possible to get the debug facilities working, but I'd
> like to know what existing tools are available.

No. There are no current support of PICkit 2 debugging under Linux.
Probably there will never ever be official support of PICkit 2 debugging
under Linux from Microchip. Eeven when they start to support Linux
and Mac OS X with future version of MPLAB, I will tend to think
PICKit 2 and ICD 2 support will be dropped. But I am just guessing
here.

The protocol scripts are only a small part for supporting the debugging.
The majority of the job is done on the host MPLAB side.



--
Xiaofan http://mcuee.blogspot.com

2010\05\12@020113 by Tamas Rudnai

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Hi Matt,

I use VirtualBox and Windows XP as a guest OS + MPLAB of course to do that.
Works quite reliable for me. I gave up struggling with anything else than
MPLAB, found no better alternatives + debugging works well.

Tamas


On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 1:38 AM, Matt Callow <.....mc-listsKILLspamspam@spam@tesco.net> wrote:

{Quote hidden}

> -

2010\05\12@043444 by Matt Callow

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Hi Tamas,

i was considering using vmware to do the same thing. I've just been
put off by the MPLAB interface and the requirement to share files
between linux and the vmware image. But I think I'll pursue this
further.

Matt


On 12 May 2010 16:01, Tamas Rudnai <tamas.rudnaispamKILLspamgmail.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

>> --

2010\05\12@071109 by Tamas Rudnai

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HI Matt,

I am storing everything in shared folders, so virtually every data file is
stored natively on linux where I can use all linux tools including CVS. Then
from time to time I revert to snapshot to get rid of crapware, crimeware and
malware... So that it does not affect (hopefully) my data files but the
program files and win settings -- I can start from a clean stage whenever I
want. Usually btw I do not even let Win box to access to the net so it is
pretty safe from online crime even not using AV products.

Tamas


On Wed, May 12, 2010 at 9:34 AM, Matt Callow <EraseMEmc-listsspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTtesco.net> wrote:

{Quote hidden}

2010\05\16@222505 by Matt Callow

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Hi Tamas,

Thanks for the advice. I tried using MPLAB in a winXP VM, but it's too
slow. I can run MPLAB via wine at reasonably speed, but I think my
host machine is just not up to running XP in a VM.
I think a new PC may be on the cards!

Matt


On 12 May 2010 21:11, Tamas Rudnai <KILLspamtamas.rudnaiKILLspamspamgmail.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

>

2010\05\16@225024 by Xiaofan Chen

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On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:25 AM, Matt Callow <RemoveMEmc-listsspamTakeThisOuTtesco.net> wrote:
> Hi Tamas,
>
> Thanks for the advice. I tried using MPLAB in a winXP VM, but it's too
> slow. I can run MPLAB via wine at reasonably speed, but I think my
> host machine is just not up to running XP in a VM.
> I think a new PC may be on the cards!

A new PC is of course nice. But you can also use dual boot.

--
Xiaofan http://mcuee.blogspot.com

2010\05\16@230223 by Matt Callow

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On 17 May 2010 12:50, Xiaofan Chen <xiaofancEraseMEspam.....gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:25 AM, Matt Callow <EraseMEmc-listsspamtesco.net> wrote:
>> Hi Tamas,
>>
>> Thanks for the advice. I tried using MPLAB in a winXP VM, but it's too
>> slow. I can run MPLAB via wine at reasonably speed, but I think my
>> host machine is just not up to running XP in a VM.
>> I think a new PC may be on the cards!
>
> A new PC is of course nice. But you can also use dual boot.

I could, but I gave up dual booting machines a long time ago. I was
always wanting something that was only available when I booted to the
other OS. This is probably less of an issue now that NTFS write is
supported in linux, but I'd still rather not go there.
I'd also like to be able to use my Linux desktop whilst using MPLAB.
VMware unity mode should allow me to do this...

Matt

2010\05\17@000138 by Bruno L. Albrecht [GMAIL]

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Matt,
why don't you try virtualbox? seems much better than vmware to me...

  Bruno L. Albrecht
  Eng. da Computação/06
  Falker Automação Agrícola Ltda.
  http://www.falker.com.br


Em 17/05/2010 00:02, Matt Callow escreveu:
{Quote hidden}

>

2010\05\17@005640 by Matt Callow

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On 17 May 2010 14:01, Bruno L. Albrecht [GMAIL] <RemoveMEbrunolalbTakeThisOuTspamspamgmail.com> wrote:
> Matt,
> why don't you try virtualbox? seems much better than vmware to me...
>

I have tried virutalbox in the past. I didn't see any benefit over
vmware, so switched back to vmware. (I'm more familiar with vmware).
In what ways do you find virtualbox better than vmware (performance,
ease of use?)
I'd be willing to try it again if there were performance gains to be
hadm and its offers something similar to vmware 'unity' mode

Matt

2010\05\17@021737 by Tamas Rudnai

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On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:56 AM, Matt Callow <EraseMEmc-listsspamspamspamBeGonetesco.net> wrote:

> I have tried virutalbox in the past. I didn't see any benefit over
> vmware, so switched back to vmware. (I'm more familiar with vmware).
> In what ways do you find virtualbox better than vmware (performance,
> ease of use?)
> I'd be willing to try it again if there were performance gains to be
> hadm and its offers something similar to vmware 'unity' mode
>

I agree with Bruno, VirtualBox is faster than VmWare. VmWare has many nice
features like mounting the guest hard drive on the host machine, cloning and
hierarchical snapshots, but those are more important for windows driver
development in my opinion. For running MPLAB or other Windows software is
more important how fast is that. Using 2.2GHz dual core CPU with 3G RAM
virtually I have no issue with speed on it. MPLAB and AVR Studio runs
effortless -- and for everythng else I use Linux software.

One thing with VirtualBox though: The OSE version (Open Source Edition) does
not support USB, therefore you need to go with the non-OSE one, which is
also free for personal use.

BTW: MLPAB in Wine is ok, but it would not work with PicKit2 as there is no
USB support.

Tamas



>
> Matt
> -

2010\05\18@011602 by Xiaofan Chen

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On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 2:17 PM, Tamas Rudnai <RemoveMEtamas.rudnaiKILLspamspamgmail.com> wrote:

> I agree with Bruno, VirtualBox is faster than VmWare. VmWare has many nice
> features like mounting the guest hard drive on the host machine, cloning and
> hierarchical snapshots, but those are more important for windows driver
> development in my opinion. For running MPLAB or other Windows software is
> more important how fast is that. Using 2.2GHz dual core CPU with 3G RAM
> virtually I have no issue with speed on it. MPLAB and AVR Studio runs
> effortless -- and for everythng else I use Linux software.

I thought MPLAB is necessary. But I hear that AVR Studio is not that necessary
if you use AVR-GCC. I myself do not use AVR. What is the main reason you use
AVR Studio?

> One thing with VirtualBox though: The OSE version (Open Source Edition) does
> not support USB, therefore you need to go with the non-OSE one, which is
> also free for personal use.
> BTW: MLPAB in Wine is ok, but it would not work with PicKit2 as there is no
> USB support.
>
Once upon a time there is a patch for Wine to support USB, but it never
got merged.
http://wiki.winehq.org/USB



--
Xiaofan http://mcuee.blogspot.com

2010\05\18@024736 by Tamas Rudnai

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On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 6:16 AM, Xiaofan Chen <xiaofancSTOPspamspamspam_OUTgmail.com> wrote:

> I thought MPLAB is necessary. But I hear that AVR Studio is not that
> necessary
> if you use AVR-GCC. I myself do not use AVR. What is the main reason you
> use
> AVR Studio?
>

I think AVR Studio is a nice environment and I found the simulator and
debugger in it much easier to use than the gdb style simulavr or
avrice. BTW, you can use gputils/gpsim and sdcc for PIC as well with or
without piklab -- so MPLAB does not necessary either :-)


> Once upon a time there is a patch for Wine to support USB, but it never
> got merged.
> http://wiki.winehq.org/USB


Nice! Do you know the reason why did not they merge into the main line?

Tamas



>
>
>
>
> --
> Xiaofan http://mcuee.blogspot.com
> -

2010\05\18@024800 by William \Chops\ Westfield

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> I hear that AVR Studio is not that necessary if you use AVR-GCC. I  
> myself do not use AVR. What is the main reason you use AVR Studio?

Simulation and debugging?  I mean, I can use a PIC C compiler under  
WINE and the native PICKit-1 utility on my Mac to program PICs without  
MPLab too.  (I think I've done that.)  The state of AVR simulation  
without AVR Studio is sort-of sad; lots of partially complete projects  
that cover a small subset of chips.  I'm less certain about debugging;  
in theory gdb (the debugger that is part of gcc) will let you do stuff  
with rather random proxy agents between it and the actual chip, but  
i"m not sure that there is any non-windows support for any such proxy  
agents (ie jtag or debugwire...)


>  I think my host machine is just not up to running XP in a VM.


Probably likely.  I've been pretty impressed with virtual box speed in  
general, but I have a late-model system with lots of memory.  If you  
can't "dedicate" typical resources for an XP system (1G ram, 1 core,  
virtualization extensions) to your VM, it would probably be pretty  
painful.
I couldn't get any of the VMs to run W98 for me, though.  And I don't  
have a collection of spare XP licenses lying around :-(

BillW

2010\05\18@031305 by Xiaofan Chen

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On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 2:47 PM, William "Chops" Westfield
<spamBeGonewestfwSTOPspamspamEraseMEmac.com> wrote:

> I couldn't get any of the VMs to run W98 for me, though.  And I don't
> have a collection of spare XP licenses lying around :-(
>

Hmm, last time I tried to use Virtual PC and Virtual Box and
Win98SE worked fine under the VM. But Win98SE was just too
old to be worth trying, for me anyway. At home, I am using
the Vista Desktop and Win 7 x64 laptop. I feel they are
both better than XP (using XP at work).

--
Xiaofan http://mcuee.blogspot.com

2010\05\18@031818 by Xiaofan Chen
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On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 2:47 PM, Tamas Rudnai <KILLspamtamas.rudnaispamBeGonespamgmail.com> wrote:
> I think AVR Studio is a nice environment and I found the simulator and
> debugger in it much easier to use than the gdb style simulavr or
> avrice. BTW, you can use gputils/gpsim and sdcc for PIC as well with or
> without piklab -- so MPLAB does not necessary either :-)

I see. I still prefer to use MPLAB and Windows after trying the alternatives
for quite a while. In then end, Windows is still the best OS for my spare-time
MCU firmware development/testing. On the host side, I mainly play with
libusb, which is cross-platform, often I test the host programs under Linux
first (more matured) and then test them under Windows. But for firmware
side, I use Windows.

>> Once upon a time there is a patch for Wine to support USB, but it never
>> got merged.
>> http://wiki.winehq.org/USB
>
> Nice! Do you know the reason why did not they merge into the main line?
>

No idea. Maybe it is not working well. I do not use Wine.

--
Xiaofan http://mcuee.blogspot.com

2010\05\18@052154 by Tamas Rudnai

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On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 8:18 AM, Xiaofan Chen <EraseMExiaofancspamEraseMEgmail.com> wrote:

> I see. I still prefer to use MPLAB and Windows after trying the
> alternatives
> for quite a while. In then end, Windows is still the best OS for my
> spare-time
> MCU firmware development/testing. On the host side, I mainly play with
> libusb, which is cross-platform, often I test the host programs under Linux
> first (more matured) and then test them under Windows. But for firmware
> side, I use Windows.
>

Same here, prefer MPLAB and also now you guys planted a bug in my mind about
.NET and Mono I have tried both development on MonoDev and VisualStudio and
this latter one seems to be much better and elegant -- also the GUI works on
both Windows and Linux as opposed if you do that on MonoDev...

So yes, developing on Windows seems to be a better choice to me. However,
the OS is not as stable, hence I put it on VirtualBox so if anything goes
wrong I could just revert to a snapshot...

Tamas



{Quote hidden}

> -

2010\05\18@062340 by Xiaofan Chen

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On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 5:21 PM, Tamas Rudnai <@spam@tamas.rudnai@spam@spamspam_OUTgmail.com> wrote:

> Same here, prefer MPLAB and also now you guys planted a bug in my mind about
> .NET and Mono I have tried both development on MonoDev and VisualStudio and
> this latter one seems to be much better and elegant -- also the GUI works on
> both Windows and Linux as opposed if you do that on MonoDev...

I did not know that Mono had progressed so far until I played with Travis
Robinson's libusbdotnet.
http://sourceforge.net/projects/libusbdotnet/

It is really nice that same solution file (works under VS, SharpDevelop,
MonoDevelop) and the same exe file work under Linux and Windows.

There are philosophical objections to Mono from some Linux users.
But it seems to me many agree that C# is a nice language and
.Net to be quite a nice environment to work with.


--
Xiaofan http://mcuee.blogspot.com

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