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'[PIC] Ordering from Microchip'
2006\09\04@113344 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
Hi,

Have anybody has an experience of ordering something from Microchip
directly? I've selected some chips because they show me a very good price,
then when I gave all of my details, and just before the confirmation button
they put an extra fee onto the bill saying that is the postage+packaging and
taxation fee. The whole price practically doubled! I canceled it strait away
as it might be better to purchase in a larger quantity? Or it does not
matter, the price will be doubled anyway?

Tamas



--
unPIC -- The PIC Disassembler
http://unpic.sourceforge.net

2006\09\04@114253 by Jan-Erik Soderholm

face picon face
It's not clear...

Was any of the added "postage+packaging and
taxation fee" *wrong* in any way ?

Jan-Erik.



{Original Message removed}

2006\09\04@115622 by Alan B. Pearce

face picon face
>they put an extra fee onto the bill saying that is the
>postage+packaging and taxation fee. The whole price
>practically doubled! I canceled it strait away as it
>might be better to purchase in a larger quantity? Or it
>does not matter, the price will be doubled anyway?

What value of chips are you ordering?

Will it allow you to order anyway as you are using a gmail address (though
that problem may only apply to samples)

What is your destination country, will they need to include hefty VAT as
they need in most European countries?

2006\09\04@120327 by Howard Winter

face
flavicon
picon face
Tamas,

On Mon, 4 Sep 2006 16:33:43 +0100, Tamas Rudnai wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Have anybody has an experience of ordering something from Microchip
> directly? I've selected some chips because they show me a very good price,
> then when I gave all of my details, and just before the confirmation button
> they put an extra fee onto the bill saying that is the postage+packaging and
> taxation fee. The whole price practically doubled! I canceled it strait away
> as it might be better to purchase in a larger quantity? Or it does not
> matter, the price will be doubled anyway?

If it's a small order, their P&P charges are relatively huge - I think it's a fixed charge regardless of order size (not sure about the "taxation fee" - I
don't remember that one!)

I seem to remember that the last time I ordered the total charge was UK£12, so if you're only buying a few chips it is a lot, but if you're buying an
ICD2 and a handful of adaptors, the shipping charge isn't a large proportion.

If you're just buying chips you may want to consider Wouter (http://www.voti.nl/e_index.html) or Glitchbuster (http://www.glitchbuster.com/) - both
have much more reasonable shipping charges than Microchip!

Cheers,


Howard Winter
St.Albans, England


2006\09\04@120732 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
Well, was not wrong, but was unclear that they put that much fee onto my
order. I would expect to see all the fees in my Cart before I decide to do
the purchase (see Voti's website :-) So if I would like to order for 40
euros, I would not like to see a 90 euro bill... 28 euro postal fee, 5
packaging and 15 VAT or something like that. And I was just wondering if I
order for 400 would it be still around the same additional fees or have to
calculate by 280 euro postage, 50 euro packaging and 150 VAT? (Also not
clear which country I pay the VAT, in china or in Ireland, and not clear how
much VAT I pay for the stuff I purchased and for the additional fees, like
for the 28 euro postage?

So, for the clarification:

Is anybody know roughly how much would it be if I make a bigger order?

Thanks
Tamas



On 04/09/06, Jan-Erik Soderholm <spam_OUTjan-erik.soderholmTakeThisOuTspamtelia.com> wrote:
>
> It's not clear...
>
> Was any of the added "postage+packaging and
> taxation fee" *wrong* in any way ?
>
> Jan-Erik.
>
>
>
> {Original Message removed}

2006\09\04@121118 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
Gmail address disallows me to get a free sample, but I they accept my credit
card.

Destination is Ireland. Is USA VAT free? So you do not have to pay anything
when you order from Microchip? Not even customs tax or something like that?

Tamas


On 04/09/06, Alan B. Pearce <.....A.B.PearceKILLspamspam@spam@rl.ac.uk> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\09\04@121431 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
Thanks, yes, I know Voti's site, that's a quite a good one, and will check
out the other one as well.

Tamas


On 04/09/06, Howard Winter <HDRWspamKILLspamh2org.demon.co.uk> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

>

2006\09\04@123607 by Jan-Erik Soderholm

face picon face
If you're in a EU coutry yourself and you are buying them privately,
you pay the Irish (UK ?) VAT (aprox 17%, right ?).

If you're in a EU coutry yourself and you are running a VAT registred
company in your own (EU-) country, you can ask Microchip *not*
to add VAT.

If you're in a non-EU country, any company within EU should *not*
add VAT.

> Is anybody know roughly how much would it be if I make a bigger
order?

Why ask ?
Do as you did before, just enter a bigger order and back out when you
have got the total...

Jan-Erik.



2006\09\04@125235 by peter green

flavicon
face
> taxation fee. The whole price practically doubled! I canceled it
> strait away
> as it might be better to purchase in a larger quantity? Or it does not
> matter, the price will be doubled anyway?
what value were you ordering? at least here in the uk thier delivery charge
seems to be a fixed fee (though of course you pay VAT on top of the listed
prices as with virtually any buisness orientated supplier)

i've never bought chips from them myself though someone i know has when the
regular supplier was out of stock, but they seem the only place to get many
of the microchip dev boards.

2006\09\04@134427 by John Chung

picon face
The shipping would cost the same when the weight is
the same. The variable that increase would be the
taxation. Shipping is not cheap but only worth it when
ordering plenty of stuff.

John

--- Tamas Rudnai <.....tamas.rudnaiKILLspamspam.....gmail.com> wrote:

{Quote hidden}

> > {Original Message removed}

2006\09\04@134536 by John Chung

picon face
If it is Ireland than it would cost you plenty. I did
remember my sister say that Ireland is pretty
expensive when comes to postage.....  

John

--- Tamas Rudnai <tamas.rudnaispamspam_OUTgmail.com> wrote:

{Quote hidden}

2006\09\04@135642 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
Well, Ireland is quite expensive in every way. For example here you still
have to pay customs for importing a car from the EC, however, now it's
called 'registration fee'.

Tamas


On 04/09/06, John Chung <KILLspamkravnusKILLspamspamyahoo.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

>

2006\09\04@152457 by Herbert Graf

flavicon
face
On Mon, 2006-09-04 at 17:11 +0100, Tamas Rudnai wrote:
> Gmail address disallows me to get a free sample, but I they accept my credit
> card.
>
> Destination is Ireland.

That's going to cost you. The additional shipping and VAT will make a
small order very expensive.

> Is USA VAT free?

Yes, with a dab of no. The US has it's own sales taxes that work
somewhat differently from the VAT system. The "catch" is there is no
"federal" sales tax in the US, only state level. So, if you are in the
states and you order something from anywhere else in the states other
then your own state, you pay no sales tax. I've heard you are SUPPOSED
to declare these out of state purchases come tax time and pay the tax,
but barely anyone does.

> So you do not have to pay anything
> when you order from Microchip? Not even customs tax or something like that?

Generally how most online stores in the states do things is as follows:

- postage - dependant on your location, for something like ICs, $8 in
the states, $16 to elsewhere in north america, $25+ outside of North
America are good ballpark figures. Postage depends largely on the weight
of the package, and to some extent the size. With things like ICs you
can order many hundreds before postage starts to go up from the base
rate much.

- handling - some stores charge you a little extra if your order is "too
small". Digikey is a good example. If your total comes to less then
$32.50 CND they tack on an $8 handling charge. Don't know if MChip does
something similar.

- taxes - this depends on where YOU are. In the states, zero, unless the
store is in the same state as you, in which case your states' sales tax.
For Canada it's GST/6% (and add a small brokerage charge dependent on
which carrier you choose. USPS/Canada Post is $5. Fedex charges $7. UPS
charges $30+, and yes, that's NOT a typo. Guess what carrier I NEVER
use). For Europe it's VAT, I'm not aware if you Europeans get charged a
brokerage fee.

So, the crux of it is don't bother with small orders. The
charges/taxes/fees can easily double the cost of your order. For orders
to the states I usually set a minimum of about $75, if it isn't $75 I
don't order it. For elsewhere in the world my limit is higher, at least
$100 before I place an order.

TTYL

2006\09\04@162816 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
The VAT system is quite ok for a company, as has a tax number so that you do
not have to pay a VAT for those that you use as 'materia' or virtually
anything that is for producing something. But currently I am doing it half
way as a hobby, I am my own, no company. I thought that I can try something
out, if I could slowly become a professional, so that try to make a little
amount and then see how is that going on. If I were have money enough I
would invest in it, so would make a small company and would pay other taxes
than VAT :-)

Anyway, thanks everybody for the help, I have ordered from Wouter - ordered
more than originally wanted to, and pay much less :-)  I hope that you will
not increase your prices too much in the near future, Wouter :-) Maybe if I
order thousands of the same chip I will consider to do it from Microchip
directly.

Tamas


On 04/09/06, Herbert Graf <TakeThisOuTmailinglist3EraseMEspamspam_OUTfarcite.net > wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\09\04@163920 by Mark Rages

face picon face
On 9/4/06, Tamas Rudnai <RemoveMEtamas.rudnaispamTakeThisOuTgmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Have anybody has an experience of ordering something from Microchip
> directly? I've selected some chips because they show me a very good price,
> then when I gave all of my details, and just before the confirmation button
> they put an extra fee onto the bill saying that is the postage+packaging and
> taxation fee. The whole price practically doubled! I canceled it strait away
> as it might be better to purchase in a larger quantity? Or it does not
> matter, the price will be doubled anyway?
>
> Tamas
>

I just ordered a bunch of chips from them.  Shipping charges seemd a
bit high, but they ship the parts from the factory in Thailand,
two-day FedEx.  Still, the prices were better than Digi-Key in the
quantities I ordered.

Regards,
Mark
markrages@gmail
--
You think that it is a secret, but it never has been one.
 - fortune cookie

2006\09\04@164314 by Jan-Erik Soderholm

face picon face
Wouter might be lower on the in S&H, but when talking about *VAT*,
there is no difference between Wouter and Microchip, as far as I know.

Wouters business case (and mine, I sell a few hobbyist-friendly
PICs localy in Sweden), is to have lower S&H on smaller orders
then (e.g.) Microchip... :-)

Jan-Erik.



{Original Message removed}

2006\09\04@170103 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> Have anybody has an experience of ordering something from Microchip
> directly?

yes

> they put an extra fee onto the bill saying that is the
> postage+packaging and taxation fee.

inside EC? 19% is stanard, to be expected.

> The whole price practically doubled! I canceled
> it strait away
> as it might be better to purchase in a larger quantity? Or it does not
> matter, the price will be doubled anyway?

IIRC the shipping/handling fee is fixed. I never order les than $1000,
so it does not realy matter to me.

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2006\09\04@170103 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> If you're in a EU coutry yourself and you are running a VAT registred
> company in your own (EU-) country, you can ask Microchip *not*
> to add VAT.

I don't think so JE, they effectively sell from your own country, so
they must charge VAT. But if you run a company that VAT is of course
deductible.

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2006\09\04@170103 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> I would expect to see all the fees in my Cart before I
> decide to do the purchase (see Voti's website :-)

thanx, refer them to my website for an example of how they should
organise theirs :)

> (Also not
> clear which country I pay the VAT, in china or in Ireland,

I pay Dutch VAT.

> and not clear how
> much VAT I pay for the stuff I purchased and for the
> additional fees, like
> for the 28 euro postage?

I think you pay VAT on the total value, incl. fees.

> Is anybody know roughly how much would it be if I make a bigger order?

My guess would be the same fees, + 19% VAT. But why not try and back out
the last moment if you don't like it?

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2006\09\04@170105 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> For Europe it's VAT, I'm not aware if you Europeans get
> charged a brokerage fee.

name and amount depends on your carrier. to add to the confusion, the
carrier you select when for instance ordering on a USA website has a
fuzzy relation with the carrier that will deliver it at your doorstep.

> So, the crux of it is don't bother with small orders.

that's an adquate management summary. it of couse leaves the value of
'small' to be defined (my value is more in the order of $1000).

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2006\09\04@170542 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> The VAT system is quite ok for a company, as has a tax number

It is OK for individuals too, but you must in your mind add the VAT to
all ex-VAT prices you see (which includes outside-EC prices and prices
on B-t-B price lists).

> I thought that I can
> try something
> out, if I could slowly become a professional

nothing wrong with that, 6 years ago I ordered my first batch of PICs
(from PHAanderson) and started selling them in the Netherlands (at half
the price of the shops-around-the-corner, but still with some profit).

> I hope that you will not increase your prices too much
> in the near future, Wouter :-)

I might be forced to raise the S/H fee a little. My margins are OK as
they are now. If fact you can figure out my margins on PICs as I order
them mostly for uChip :)

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2006\09\04@172801 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
> thanx, refer them to my website for an example of how they should
> organise theirs :)

Your site will be the standard :-) But seriously, I can set up my things,
how would I pay, where to ship etc, and all the prices shown as it is,
recalculated with everything. No hidden fees etc. In the shopping cart I
could see the P&P as a non-removable item etc, so clear, so easy to
understand for a dumb like myself :-) And you do not even have a customer
database like Microchip... just thinking... did not even gave my address...
hopefully PayPal will take care of everything or lost my pub money :-)

Tamas




On 04/09/06, Wouter van Ooijen <wouterEraseMEspam.....voti.nl> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\09\04@173045 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
> I might be forced to raise the S/H fee a little. My margins are OK as
> they are now. If fact you can figure out my margins on PICs as I order
> them mostly for uChip :)

Nooo, just forget what dod I say, your site is the most expensive one :-)))
I have just ordered from your site because I like Gouda cheese and tulips
:-)))


On 04/09/06, Wouter van Ooijen <EraseMEwouterspamvoti.nl> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\09\04@180727 by William Chops Westfield

face picon face

On Sep 4, 2006, at 9:07 AM, Tamas Rudnai wrote:

> I would expect to see all the fees in my Cart before I decide
> to do the purchase (see Voti's website :-)

Alas, that isn't as common as it ought to be.  In the consumer
retail market, we've become sensitive to 'excessive  and/or
unexpected shipping and handling fees', and some vendors have
become very up-front about what they're going to charge.

"professional" distributers are less candid; your order is supposed
to be big enough that even relatively large charges aren't relevant.
I think it was a recent order I placed at Mouser (ramtron development
board; neat stuff) where even the "confirmation email" after the
order was complete had "TBD" in the shipping charge field.

I've ordered from Microchip twice; once during their "free shipping"
offer, and once recently to buy cheap poison chips (with LEAD!) and
a picKit1 firmware upgrade.    The recent order totaled $117, with
$11 shipping, no handling, no tax. I consider that reasonable (it
was two boxes, one from the US and one from Thailand.)

BillW

2006\09\04@223337 by John Chung

picon face
You can try futurlec. Shipping time can be quite long
since they have to look for the parts first before
shipping.

John


--- Tamas Rudnai <RemoveMEtamas.rudnaiEraseMEspamEraseMEgmail.com> wrote:

{Quote hidden}

> > --

2006\09\05@042557 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
Thanks everybody, at the moment I am happy, but I know I have to learn lot
of things on this, how to and where from order in different circumstances. I
still could not believe for example that a microcontroller has quite the
similar price as a 3 way 2.5mm connector but if that's true I should not try
to save money on the PIC itself.

Thanks again for the lots of adivse!

Tamas


On 05/09/06, John Chung <RemoveMEkravnusTakeThisOuTspamspamyahoo.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

>

2006\09\05@050614 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> I
> still could not believe for example that a microcontroller
> has quite the
> similar price as a 3 way 2.5mm connector

Things are must worse/strange than that. For some cables I can get a 5 m
cable with two connectors cheaper than 1 connector. Laser modules cost
much much more than laser-gadgets that contain the same modules. Small
graphical LCDs are very difficult to buy, but appear in all kinds of
toys. etc.

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2006\09\05@062158 by Howard Winter

face
flavicon
picon face
Wouter,

On Tue, 5 Sep 2006 11:06:08 +0200, Wouter van Ooijen wrote:

> > I
> > still could not believe for example that a microcontroller
> > has quite the
> > similar price as a 3 way 2.5mm connector
>
> Things are must worse/strange than that. For some cables I can get a 5 m
> cable with two connectors cheaper than 1 connector.

Ah, you don't shop at PC World in England (obviously! :-)  They had a basket full of 1.8m USB A-B cables, with a sign above saying something like
"We keep prices down" and the price of the cables: UK£14.95 (US$28.40, 22.13 Euros) !  If that's keeping them down, I'd hate to see them letting them
rise!  :-)  They weren't even gold-plated...

> Laser modules cost
> much much more than laser-gadgets that contain the same modules.

Yes, I wanted to add a laser-line device to a mitre saw I have so I can see where the cut is going to happen before lowering the blade (later ones
have them fitted - I bought mine too early).  I looked at buying a laser module, but the cost was ridiculous.  In the end I bought a small "Laser Level"
which had a line-generating prism, and removed the laser and threw the level away.  Cost was about 1/8 of what I'd have had to pay for the module
- which didn't have the line-generating prism!

Cheers,


Howard Winter
St.Albans, England


2006\09\05@064522 by Mike Harrison

flavicon
face
On Tue, 05 Sep 2006 11:21:53 +0100 (BST), you wrote:

>Wouter,
>
>On Tue, 5 Sep 2006 11:06:08 +0200, Wouter van Ooijen wrote:
>
>> > I
>> > still could not believe for example that a microcontroller
>> > has quite the
>> > similar price as a 3 way 2.5mm connector
>>
>> Things are must worse/strange than that. For some cables I can get a 5 m
>> cable with two connectors cheaper than 1 connector.
>
>Ah, you don't shop at PC World in England (obviously! :-)  They had a basket full of 1.8m USB A-B cables, with a sign above saying something like
>"We keep prices down" and the price of the cables: UK£14.95 (US$28.40, 22.13 Euros) !  If that's keeping them down, I'd hate to see them letting them
>rise!  :-)  They weren't even gold-plated...

It's part of their strategy of low prices on big items & rip-off on accessories, helped by big
'cable not included' labels on the boxes.  I nearly got thrown out once when a guy in front of me in
the queue was told by the checkout girl that he needed a £15 USB cable for his £35 printer & I
pointed out that he could get it from Asda for 3 quid..!

2006\09\05@074214 by Tamas Rudnai

face picon face
> I nearly got thrown out once when a guy in front of me in
> the queue was told by the checkout girl that he needed a £15 USB cable for
his £35 printer & I
> pointed out that he could get it from Asda for 3 quid..!

Some retailer says that if you use other type of cable then you loose the
warranty. I do not like tricks like that. Like in Maplin there are two LCD
o'scopes, one of them is 10MHz, the other one is 40MHz, but it turns out
that 10MHz means 10MHz sampling so you can measure 2MHz only. That was the
first shock, the other one was that the price of the 10MHz was quite ok, but
they do not provide couple of things (probes, case, rs232 etc) with the
device as with the 40MHz one (well, 12MHz :-) ) so that if you buy all the
stuff the price is pretty much the same... Why they doing this? I'd rather
buy something more expensive but been told the exact price before my
decision than having the feeling that I've been set up again.

Tamas


On 05/09/06, Mike Harrison <mikeSTOPspamspamspam_OUTwhitewing.co.uk> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

>

2006\09\05@094129 by Dave Lag

picon face
Howard Winter wrote:

>>Laser modules cost much much more than laser-gadgets that contain the same modules.

> In the end I bought a small "Laser Level" which had a line-generating prism,
>and removed the laser and threw the level away.  Cost was about 1/8 of
what I'd have
>had to pay for the module  - which didn't have the line-generating prism!

Pictures?

2006\09\05@111527 by Gerhard Fiedler

picon face
Tamas Rudnai wrote:

> The VAT system is quite ok for a company, as has a tax number so that you
> do not have to pay a VAT for those that you use as 'materia' or
> virtually anything that is for producing something. But currently I am
> doing it half way as a hobby, I am my own, no company. I thought that I
> can try something out, if I could slowly become a professional, so that
> try to make a little amount and then see how is that going on. If I were
> have money enough I would invest in it, so would make a small company
> and would pay other taxes than VAT :-)

I don't know how it is in Ireland, but when I started in Germany, I didn't
have to do anything special to get the "company VAT handling". I just
registered myself as a self-employed with the local tax authorities (free),
and started to submit my quarterly VAT balances. When I had a negative
balance, I got it back from the government. No other taxes, because the
only one there was was income tax, and as long as there is no income,
there's no income tax :)  

This of course doesn't work forever, but as long as the purchased items are
reasonable business expenses and investments and you don't take longer than
a year or so to have some influx, they accepted that without questioning.
You are not required to start out making money; they know that this may
take a bit. You have to make sure that it doesn't /look/ like a hobby,
though. Just show a professional attitude, have something of a plan and
give a bit about appearance (not your personal appearance, I mean the
business -- professional looking letterhead, doing your homework before
talking to the tax authorities etc).

FWIW, I have bought quantities around 20 or 50 from Microchip because they
were the best (cheapest, fastest) source. So it doesn't have to be
thousands. (That was for a destination in the USA.)

Gerhard

2006\09\05@112101 by Gerhard Fiedler

picon face
Wouter van Ooijen wrote:

>> I still could not believe for example that a microcontroller has quite
>> the similar price as a 3 way 2.5mm connector
>
> Things are must worse/strange than that. For some cables I can get a 5 m
> cable with two connectors cheaper than 1 connector.

Now you try and fit your custom cable to a connector cut off that cable,
and you know why you're paying the premium for the single connector. (Just
kidding, of course. Things /are/ strange. Just like international
airfares.)

Gerhard

2006\09\05@115701 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> Now you try and fit your custom cable to a connector cut off
> that cable,
> and you know why you're paying the premium for the single
> connector.

In most cases I like the pre-made cables better. For instance
http://www.voti.nl/shop/p/CABLE-J35-MM.html , an audio jack cable.
Reasonable quality, the connectors are fused with the cable. Compare
with http://www.voti.nl/shop/p/CON-JACK-3M5.html : a single connector,
not easy to solder, and lousy cable connection. But it is the commonly
available connector. No way you are gona make a cable with that which is
as reliably as the pre-made cable. (Note: in this case two connectors
are way cheaper than the cable).

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
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2006\09\05@120034 by Howard Winter

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Dave,

On Tue, 05 Sep 2006 09:41:41 -0400, Dave Lag wrote:

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No it doesn't take pictures, just projects a red line!  :-)

You've caught me out - I said I'd removed the laser from the level, I didn't say I'd fitted it to the saw yet!  It's way down my To Do list...

Cheers,


Howard Winter
St.Albans, England


2006\09\05@120733 by Aaron

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Herbert Graf wrote:

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Some out-of-state retailers have started collecting sales tax for goods
shipped to other states.  Digikey just started doing this to me.
(As far as I know DigiKey doesn't have a physical presence in Ohio...??)

Aaron

2006\09\05@122914 by Tamas Rudnai

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Same here, however, in my case the pre-assembled cable 3 times more
expensive than if I make it. For that one I had to order a special crimping
tool and a good quality cable stripper, but still I will be able to make it
cheaper. Which I still worry is that if it is a good idea of having the 2x3
pin PCB header solder into the PCB in side way. I mean normally you make 6
holes and put it through, but I would like to make a hole less solder places
on the edge of the board and slide the connector that both rows are in the
opposite side of the PCB. If I can't make it then I have to buy a bigger 90
degree connector or a cable one which is more expensive of course...

Tamas


On 05/09/06, Wouter van Ooijen <spamBeGonewouterSTOPspamspamEraseMEvoti.nl> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\09\05@131015 by Mark Rages

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On 9/5/06, Tamas Rudnai <KILLspamtamas.rudnaispamBeGonespamgmail.com> wrote:
> Same here, however, in my case the pre-assembled cable 3 times more
> expensive than if I make it. For that one I had to order a special crimping
> tool and a good quality cable stripper, but still I will be able to make it
> cheaper. Which I still worry is that if it is a good idea of having the 2x3
> pin PCB header solder into the PCB in side way. I mean normally you make 6
> holes and put it through, but I would like to make a hole less solder places
> on the edge of the board and slide the connector that both rows are in the
> opposite side of the PCB. If I can't make it then I have to buy a bigger 90
> degree connector or a cable one which is more expensive of course...
>

What you are describing works fine.  In fact, it is suprisingly sturdy.

Regards,
Mark
markrages@gmail
--
You think that it is a secret, but it never has been one.
 - fortune cookie

2006\09\05@132042 by Herbert Graf

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On Tue, 2006-09-05 at 12:07 -0400, Aaron wrote:
>
> Herbert Graf wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Yes, with a dab of no. The US has it's own sales taxes that work
> >somewhat differently from the VAT system. The "catch" is there is no
> >"federal" sales tax in the US, only state level. So, if you are in the
> >states and you order something from anywhere else in the states other
> >then your own state, you pay no sales tax. I've heard you are SUPPOSED
> >to declare these out of state purchases come tax time and pay the tax,
> >but barely anyone does.
> >
>
> Some out-of-state retailers have started collecting sales tax for goods
> shipped to other states.  Digikey just started doing this to me.
> (As far as I know DigiKey doesn't have a physical presence in Ohio...??)

Really? I hadn't heard that. Are there any other retailers collecting
out of state taxes?

TTYL

2006\09\05@133937 by Tamas Rudnai

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> What you are describing works fine.  In fact, it is suprisingly sturdy.

Good to hear that. Less and less unanswered questions :-)

Tamas

2006\09\05@134000 by Bob Axtell

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Herbert Graf wrote:
{Quote hidden}

Yes, not all online retailers are complying, but it is a fact. Digikey
will gladly exempt someone who
plans to put it into a product for resale, however.

--Bob

2006\09\05@134621 by peter green

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> No way you are gona make a cable with that which is
> as reliably as the pre-made cable. (Note: in this case two connectors
> are way cheaper than the cable).
i've found if you use thick enough cable so it grips well in the metal grip
and you use a metal bodied plug then they don't seem to fail much, certainly
less than the cheap end of premade cables.

imo the cable selection is more important than the connector selection in
making reliable audio cables.

2006\09\05@150102 by Wouter van Ooijen

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for information: I just made a new MicrochipDirect order. E ~1900 goods,
E 44 shipping, E 365 VAT, E ~2300 total. That's 2.3% shipping cost (for
shipping from two locations, but that's their problem - or do they
charge less when I order stuff from only one location? worth a try next
time). When I order stuff from China (OK, those items are much heavier)
I somtimes have 100% shipping cost....

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2006\09\05@211833 by Tad Anhalt

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Howard Winter wrote:
> Yes, I wanted to add a laser-line device to a mitre saw I have so I
> can see where the cut is going to happen before lowering the blade
> (later ones have them fitted - I bought mine too early).  I looked at
> buying a laser module, but the cost was ridiculous.  In the end I
> bought a small "Laser Level" which had a line-generating prism, and
> removed the laser and threw the level away.  Cost was about 1/8 of
> what I'd have had to pay for the module - which didn't have the
> line-generating prism!

  Just in case you don't already know about these:

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?Offerings_ID=16841

HTH,
Tad

2006\09\05@212947 by Aaron

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Herbert Graf wrote:

>> Some out-of-state retailers have started collecting sales tax for
>> goods shipped to other states.  Digikey just started doing this to me.
>> (As far as I know DigiKey doesn't have a physical presence in Ohio...??)
>>  
>
>
> Really? I hadn't heard that. Are there any other retailers collecting
> out of state taxes?
>  
>


Although they are in the minority, others do it too.

As Bob said, if you provide the proper paperwork showing you are a
business and resaling the items in a product, you can get an exemption.

Aaron

2006\09\05@223533 by John Chung

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Most of the time is you get what you paid for. It is
rare to find test equipment at such a bargain. I
remember using a Sanwa multimeter which has it's fuse
blown when the probes were short when testing
resistance............  Talk about poor design and
functionality. Save up hard to own that dream piece of
equipment :D

John

--- Tamas Rudnai <EraseMEtamas.rudnaispamEraseMEgmail.com> wrote:

{Quote hidden}

> > --

2006\09\06@083509 by Gerhard Fiedler

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Aaron wrote:

> As Bob said, if you provide the proper paperwork showing you are a
> business and resaling the items in a product, you can get an exemption.

That's the beauty of VAT: one system, (almost) everything works the same,
almost no paper work. No artificial difference between reselling and
producing, between product and service.

Gerhard

2006\09\06@115226 by Howard Winter

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Tama,

On Tue, 5 Sep 2006 12:42:13 +0100, Tamas Rudnai wrote:

{Quote hidden}

I think you're talking about the Vellemann "pocket" oscilloscopes (you have to wear the special trousers! :-)

I'm pretty sure you do get a probe with the 10MHz version, and it doesn't have an RS232 interface, so there's not much point in supplying a cable (or
was that what you meant - the lack of the interface?)  You get a soft case I believe.  As a matter of interest, do you know what the 40MHz version's
RS232 interface does?  Maplin's information barely mentions it, so I wonder how much use it is.

Cheers,


Howard Winter
St.Albans, England


2006\09\06@115451 by Howard Winter

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Tad,

On Tue, 05 Sep 2006 18:18:56 -0500, Tad Anhalt wrote:

{Quote hidden}

Ah yes, I did see those in the 'States (Sears, I think) but they didn't have them with the right bore for my saw (!) and I'm not sure the blade-guard
would have enough clearance to fit the extra width.  They're a good idea if they'd fit!  :-)

Cheers,


Howard Winter
St.Albans, England


2006\09\06@123207 by Tamas Rudnai

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> I think you're talking about the Vellemann "pocket" oscilloscopes (you
have to wear the special trousers! :-)

yep -- so those are not worth the money -- are they scopes at all or just
toys? :-)

> I'm pretty sure you do get a probe with the 10MHz version, and it doesn't
have an RS232 interface, so there's not much point in
> supplying a cable (or was that what you meant - the lack of the
interface?)

both, I meant it does not do the same as the 'proper' 40MHz one, as a
digital scope espected to be able to extract the data it captured -- maybe I
am just too optimistic :-)

> You get a soft case I believe.  As a matter of interest, do you know what
the 40MHz version's RS232 interface does?  Maplin's
> information barely mentions it, so I wonder how much use it is.

I thought you can use your PC as a store, so you can analyze the signals
(and the logic) in a 'long tape' format. Currently I am using my sound card
as a 2ch analog input for 'scope' (record the signal to WAV and see it using
a WAV editor -- quite handy actually, but limitad bandwidth). Anyway, what
is that RS232 interface for?

BTW: I was just thinking on this (but has to time to build or lot of money
to buy)
http://www.bitscope.com/design/

Tamas



On 06/09/06, Howard Winter <spamBeGoneHDRWspamKILLspamh2org.demon.co.uk> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\09\06@130300 by John Chung

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Tamas,

  If you do intend to buy a scope do consider TDS
10xx B series from Tektronix. I am saving up to get
one. The bitscope sampling is a bit low. The TDS 10xx
B has 1G samples per second. You may want to read more
on the construct of a scope to determine which would
suit you best. From my survey the new TDS provides
free software Openview and another one which I can't
remember. Plus the SDK for interfacing the scope which
is very useful.

John

--- Tamas Rudnai <.....tamas.rudnaispam_OUTspamgmail.com> wrote:

{Quote hidden}

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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2006\09\06@131020 by Dominic Stratten

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I've got one of the HPS10 Vellemann scopes and for the money you wont beat
it.

True it has a limited bandwidth (dont even bother going above 1Mhz) but for
general workshop use and troubleshooting stuff on the car its ideal.

If you do buy one get a set of rechargable batteries and a mains adapter to
charge them with - it will save you a fortune in the long run.

Dom
{Original Message removed}

2006\09\06@135531 by Charles Craft

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OpenView is a suite of software products from HP for network and systems management.
(http://www.openview.hp.com/)

The Tektronix software is OpenChoice.

http://www.tek.com/Measurement/scopes/connectivity/index.html

OpenChoiceâ„¢ Software

OpenChoice™ is a collection of software libraries, utilities, samples, industry-standard protocols and interfaces offered with many of Tektronix’ oscilloscopes and logic analyzers.

{Original Message removed}

2006\09\06@224232 by John Chung

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Oops........ Thanks for the correction

John

--- Charles Craft <TakeThisOuTchucksea.....spamTakeThisOuTmindspring.com> wrote:

> OpenView is a suite of software products from HP for
> network and systems management.
> (http://www.openview.hp.com/)
>
> The Tektronix software is OpenChoice.
>
>
www.tek.com/Measurement/scopes/connectivity/index.html
>
> OpenChoiceâ„¢ Software
>
> OpenChoiceâ„¢ is a collection of software libraries,
> utilities, samples, industry-standard protocols and
> interfaces offered with many of Tektronix’
> oscilloscopes and logic analyzers.
>
> {Original Message removed}

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