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'[PIC] Microchip ICD2 versus Olmex PIC-ICD2'
2005\04\20@185217 by Chris

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Hi Group.

I have decided that it's time to by an in circuit programmer. I'm also
interested in having the in circuit debugging capability.

I am currently using a PICSTART+ for all of my projects but I am getting
ready to start working with the dsPIC series and I am also considering
moving away from DIP packages for some of my projects.

The Microchip ICD2 looks like a solid product and it does everything I think
I will need. The Olmex is $50 less and appears to be 100% compatible. The
Olmex does not come with a case or power supply but I think I can live with
this. On the Microchip side, I'm not too fond the RJxx connectors but I can
build an appropriate cable for my needs or maybe even use the Olmex chip
adaptor sockets.

My questions are:

Can anyone tell me about their experience with the Olmex product? Are there
any compatibility or support issues that I should be aware of?

I'd also like to hear about peoples experiences with the Microchip ICD2.

Are there any other brands or types of in circuit programmers/debuggers that
I should take a look at? The programmer will be used for design and testing,
prototyping and small quantity chip burning. For the quantity of product
that I build and sell I am not interested in a production programmer at this
time. I am aware that my chips are not being fully verified with a
development programmer and this is OK for now.

Thanks in advance for your time.

Chris Levin





--Chris
http://www.rocklizard.org
<myname>@rocklizard.org
myname = chris
------------------------------------
12x2 LCD displays & serial LCD
interface chips available.
Visit http://pic.rocklizard.org
------------------------------------

2005\04\20@190852 by Herbert Graf

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On Wed, 2005-04-20 at 16:52 -0600, Chris wrote:
> Can anyone tell me about their experience with the Olmex product? Are there
> any compatibility or support issues that I should be aware of?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Olimex clone serial only? The
speed of USB with the ICD2 alone would convince me. TTYL


-----------------------------
Herbert's PIC Stuff:
http://repatch.dyndns.org:8383/pic_stuff/

2005\04\20@193018 by Chris

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Olmex makes a USB version now. I don't know if this is new or if it has been
around for a while. Here is the link:
http://www.olimex.com/dev/pic-icd2.html

BTW, I enjoyed your web site. The Radar project was very neat!

-Chris



--Chris
http://www.rocklizard.org
<myname>@rocklizard.org
myname = chris
------------------------------------
12x2 LCD displays & serial LCD
interface chips available.
Visit http://pic.rocklizard.org
------------------------------------
{Original Message removed}

2005\04\20@210809 by PicDude

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On Wednesday 20 April 2005 05:52 pm, Chris scribbled:
> Hi Group.
>
> I have decided that it's time to by an in circuit programmer. I'm also
> interested in having the in circuit debugging capability.
> ...
> The Microchip ICD2 looks like a solid product and it does everything I
> think I will need. The Olmex is $50 less and appears to be 100% compatible.
> ...


With the recent programmer & ICD discussion, and my recent intermittent bug,
I've also been looking at an ICD2 as well.  My addition to this thread is
that Sparkfun.com sells the Olimex ICD2 for $99.95, which might be nicer for
you if you're in the U.S.  They do claim it to be a drop-in replacement for
Mchip's ICD2, even pointing to Mchip's site for more info.

Cheers,
-Neil.



2005\04\20@211016 by PicDude

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USB as well.... 4th product on this page...
http://www.sparkfun.com/shop/index.php?shop=1&cart=229431&cat=3&

Cheers,
-Neil.


On Wednesday 20 April 2005 06:08 pm, Herbert Graf scribbled:
{Quote hidden}

2005\04\21@033537 by Ake Hedman

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Chris,

I can tell you this. Life is different since I bought my ICD2. It works like a charm. I lost the first unit I got after just a week or two. Got stock in the busy state. But Microchip replaced it easy and painless (after the usual customer support 1008 question quiz ). Have had no problems since. The only thing I would like was the ability to set more then one breakpoint. But it is possible to live without it.

/Ake

Chris wrote:

{Quote hidden}

--  ---
Ake Hedman (YAP - Yet Another Programmer)
eurosource, Brattbergavägen 17, 820 50 LOS, Sweden
Phone: (46) 657 413430 Cellular: (46) 73 84 84 102
Company home: http://www.eurosource.se      Kryddor/Te/Kaffe: http://www.brattberg.com
Personal homepage: http://www.eurosource.se/akhe
Automated home: http://www.vscp.org

2005\04\21@085714 by Jan-Erik Soderholm

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Ake Hedman wrote :

> Life is different since I bought my
> ICD2. It works like a charm...

Hi.
May I ask, where did you buy your ICD2 ?
And, if possible, how much did you pay for it ?

Best Regards,
Jan-Erik Söderholm
(Söderköping, Sweden)


2005\04\21@091607 by Ake Hedman

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Hej Jan-Erik,

You probably also get the Monthly/bimonthly postings from Microchip distributors. The A4 sheets with specials. Last spring  they had the ICD2 together with the dsPicDem 1.1 for $149 and I got this from Farnell.  I seldom can keep myself from taking advantage of these offers and the current offer PICDEM FS-USB for EUR 35.89 will probably not be one I can resist....

/Ake

Jan-Erik Soderholm wrote:

{Quote hidden}

--  ---
Ake Hedman (YAP - Yet Another Programmer)
eurosource, Brattbergavägen 17, 820 50 LOS, Sweden
Phone: (46) 657 413430 Cellular: (46) 73 84 84 102
Company home: http://www.eurosource.se      Kryddor/Te/Kaffe: http://www.brattberg.com
Personal homepage: http://www.eurosource.se/akhe
Automated home: http://www.vscp.org

2005\04\21@115051 by Jan-Erik Soderholm

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Ake Hedman wrote :

> Last spring  they had the ICD2 together with the dsPicDem
> 1.1 for $149 and I got this from Farnell.

OK. Farnell seems pretty OK.

Now, I have to find out what the difference is between these :

3866397  DV164006 MICROCHIP "MPLAB-ICD2 DEV KIT", $356.
3956477  DV164007 UNBRANDED  "MPLAB-ICD2 DEV KIT", $197.
4156924  DV164005 MICROCHIP "KIT-ICD2 BASE MOD AND USB CABLE", $245.

(The first number is the Farnell order number)

Anyone knows what the "unbranded" model is about?
And why is it half the price ?

The picture on the Farnell web shows the same pictura for all three...

I've problems seeing the ICD2 Buy/Sample options due to
some interesting "Server Error"... :-)

Regards,
Jan-Erik.



2005\04\21@120646 by Ake Hedman

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This is the info  I get from the Microchip site.

>
>Now, I have to find out what the difference is between these :
>
>3866397  DV164006 MICROCHIP "MPLAB-ICD2 DEV KIT", $356.
>  
>
Part Number: DV164006 - MPLAB ICD 2 EVALUATION KIT (w/PICDEM 2 PLUS)
         This kit includes the MPLAB ICD 2 Evaluation Kit (DV164005), a PICDEM 2 Plus demonstration board, power supply, serial cable and USB cable.



>3956477  DV164007 UNBRANDED  "MPLAB-ICD2 DEV KIT", $197.
>  
>
This kit is the same as the DV164005, plus the RS-232 serial cable and a power supply.


>4156924  DV164005 MICROCHIP "KIT-ICD2 BASE MOD AND USB CABLE", $245.
>  
>
This kit contains the MPLAB ICD 2 module, an ICD interface cable and an USB cable.


Strange... ;-)

/Ake

--  ---
Ake Hedman (YAP - Yet Another Programmer)
eurosource, Brattbergavägen 17, 820 50 LOS, Sweden
Phone: (46) 657 413430 Cellular: (46) 73 84 84 102
Company home: http://www.eurosource.se      Kryddor/Te/Kaffe: http://www.brattberg.com
Personal homepage: http://www.eurosource.se/akhe
Automated home: http://www.vscp.org

2005\04\21@124332 by Spehro Pefhany

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At 06:06 PM 4/21/2005 +0200, you wrote:
{Quote hidden}

Prices are $229/188/159 at Mouser, which makes a bit more sense. But there's
a price of $99 for the DV164006 in the printed catalog.

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
spam_OUTspeffTakeThisOuTspaminterlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com




2005\04\22@043510 by Alan B. Pearce

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>3866397  DV164006 MICROCHIP "MPLAB-ICD2 DEV KIT", $356.

This is the "all-you-can-eat" version, and comes with serial and USB cables,
power supply and PicDem2+ dev board. Comes in a cardboard slip case.

>3956477  DV164007 UNBRANDED  "MPLAB-ICD2 DEV KIT", $197.

from memory this is the ICD2 and USB cable only in a blister pack (probably
why it is called "unbranded").

>4156924  DV164005 MICROCHIP "KIT-ICD2 BASE MOD AND USB CABLE", $245.

I think this is the -007 above with a power supply. If you already have a
Picstart+ that has the same power supply.

2005\04\22@045025 by Jan-Erik Soderholm

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Alan B. Pearce wrote :

> >3956477  DV164007 UNBRANDED  "MPLAB-ICD2 DEV KIT", $197.
>
> from memory this is the ICD2 and USB cable only in a blister
> pack (probably why it is called "unbranded").
>
> >4156924  DV164005 MICROCHIP "KIT-ICD2 BASE MOD AND USB CABLE", $245.
>
> I think this is the -007 above with a power supply. If you
> already have a Picstart+ that has the same power supply.

OK, thanks.
But, a $48 wall-wart ? Or is it some custom made power supply ?
Or in other words, if I do *not* have a picstart+, I'm I toased if
I select the -007 kit ?

I'm pretty tempted to order a -007...

Jan-Erik.



2005\04\22@050851 by Ake Hedman

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The DC input is +9V, 750mA (+ in center)  I'm sure you have one of them around or can get it at a lower cost then $48.  If you use USB and the board is selfpowerd there is even no need for it as the hole thing is powered from USB.

/Ake

Jan-Erik Soderholm wrote:

{Quote hidden}

--  ---
Ake Hedman (YAP - Yet Another Programmer)
eurosource, Brattbergavägen 17, 820 50 LOS, Sweden
Phone: (46) 657 413430 Cellular: (46) 73 84 84 102
Company home: http://www.eurosource.se      Kryddor/Te/Kaffe: http://www.brattberg.com
Personal homepage: http://www.eurosource.se/akhe
Automated home: http://www.vscp.org

2005\04\22@053754 by Alan B. Pearce

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>OK, thanks.
>But, a $48 wall-wart ? Or is it some custom made power supply ?
>Or in other words, if I do *not* have a picstart+, I'm I toased if
>I select the -007 kit ?
>
>I'm pretty tempted to order a -007...

The -007 kit has the ICD2 running off the USB power, and expects the DUT to
be self powered, unless you put a chip on a header to program it.

A 40 pin header is another item that comes in the most expensive (-006) kit.

The power supply that you get is a universal (90-250V) switching unit that
has an IEC connector on the mains side, and supplies 9V at 750mA. It is a
real useful item for powering projects.

Alan (who now has 3 of these supplies).

2005\04\22@054550 by Lee Jones

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>>> 3956477  DV164007 UNBRANDED  "MPLAB-ICD2 DEV KIT", $197.

>> from memory this is the ICD2 and USB cable only in a blister
>> pack (probably why it is called "unbranded").

This is the Microchip ICD2 hocky puck, a USB cable, a short
silver satin cable with RJ12 connectors, an RS232 cable, and
a 9V wall wart style external power supply.

I don't understand the "UNBRANDED" though.  But DV164007 is
a Microchip part number.

>>> 4156924  DV164005 MICROCHIP "KIT-ICD2 BASE MOD AND USB CABLE", $245.

This is the microchip ICD2 hocky puck, a USB cable, and a
short silver satin cable with RJ12 connectors on both ends.
It does NOT come with the RS232 cable.  It does NOT come
with the external power supply.

>> I think this is the -007 above with a power supply. If you
>> already have a Picstart+ that has the same power supply.

Other way around.  -005 is no power supply; -007 comes with it.

> But, a $48 wall-wart ?

Nope, it's a -$48 (minus $48) wall wart.  For some reason, this
vendor is choosing to sell the basic version (164005) for _more_
money than the kit that comes with both RS232 and USB (-007).

At buy.microchip.com -- DV164005 is US$159; DV164007 is US$188.

                                               Lee Jones

2005\04\22@055522 by Michael Rigby-Jones

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{Quote hidden}

Will you be licenced to kill (PICs) then?

The PSU is just a 9v 0.75Amp switcher, and uses a stndard DC power plug.
I suspect the ICD dosen't need anything like that much current to
operate, but getting hold of a simmilarly rated wallwart shouldn't be
too difficult.  You can pick up 9v 1Amp regulated PSU's for a few UKP's
in the larger stores over here.

Regards

Mike

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2005\04\22@073635 by Jan-Erik Soderholm

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Lee Jones wrote :

> Other way around.  -005 is no power supply; -007 comes with it.
> Nope, it's a -$48 (minus $48) wall wart.  For some reason, this
> vendor is choosing to sell the basic version (164005) for _more_
> money than the kit that comes with both RS232 and USB (-007).
>
> At buy.microchip.com -- DV164005 is US$159; DV164007 is US$188.

I just called Farnell up to confirm their prices.

They are now DV164005 : $244, DV164007 : $195.
(recalculated from Swedish crowns from the Swedish Farnell web site)

So the -007 kit seems more and more as the "right" one...

I guess that they just don't want to sell the -005 kit, or that they
have much larger volumes on the -007 kit, which might very well
be the most common reason...

Thanks everyone !
Jan-Erik.



2005\04\22@083859 by Dave Lag

picon face

> Nope, it's a -$48 (minus $48) wall wart.  For some reason, this
> vendor is choosing to sell the basic version (164005) for _more_
> money than the kit that comes with both RS232 and USB (-007).
>
> At buy.microchip.com -- DV164005 is US$159; DV164007 is US$188.
>
>                                                Lee Jones

I suppose one can attend this years "beginners" session at the microchip
dog-and-pony show and get a 50% off coupon for these tools?
D

2005\04\22@085502 by Jan-Erik Soderholm

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Jan-Erik Soderholm wrote :

> I just called Farnell up to confirm their prices.
>
> They are now DV164005 : $244, DV164007 : $195.
> (recalculated from Swedish crowns from the Swedish Farnell web site)

(Sorry for yet another post on this thread...)

Called Farnell again...

The -005 price was just plain wrong. Currently they offer it for $174,
which is more reasonable compared to the -007, since it lacks the
serial cable and the PSU. If I'm right, I don't need them if I run the
IDC2 USB-only, right ?

Jan-Erik.



2005\04\22@091812 by Ake Hedman

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Jan-Erik Soderholm wrote:

>  
>
>
>Called Farnell again...
>
>The -005 price was just plain wrong. Currently they offer it for $174,
>which is more reasonable compared to the -007, since it lacks the
>serial cable and the PSU. If I'm right, I don't need them if I run the
>IDC2 USB-only, right ?
>
>Jan-Erik.
>  
>
Right!

/Ake

--  ---
Ake Hedman (YAP - Yet Another Programmer)
eurosource, Brattbergavägen 17, 820 50 LOS, Sweden
Phone: (46) 657 413430 Cellular: (46) 73 84 84 102
Company home: http://www.eurosource.se      Kryddor/Te/Kaffe: http://www.brattberg.com
Personal homepage: http://www.eurosource.se/akhe
Automated home: http://www.vscp.org

2005\04\22@100117 by Herbert Graf

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On Fri, 2005-04-22 at 10:50 +0200, Jan-Erik Soderholm wrote:
> Alan B. Pearce wrote :
>
> > >3956477  DV164007 UNBRANDED  "MPLAB-ICD2 DEV KIT", $197.
> >
> > from memory this is the ICD2 and USB cable only in a blister
> > pack (probably why it is called "unbranded").
> >
> > >4156924  DV164005 MICROCHIP "KIT-ICD2 BASE MOD AND USB CABLE", $245.
> >
> > I think this is the -007 above with a power supply. If you
> > already have a Picstart+ that has the same power supply.
>
> OK, thanks.
> But, a $48 wall-wart ? Or is it some custom made power supply ?
> Or in other words, if I do *not* have a picstart+, I'm I toased if
> I select the -007 kit ?
>
> I'm pretty tempted to order a -007...

If you're using USB, and your target is powered, you don't even need a
power supply.

My power supply was taken out of it's package once to test if it worked,
and then was put back into it's box.

For the record it's just a switcher, 9V IIRC, nothing fancy, you very
likely have a similar power supply lying around somewhere, if you do end
up needing one.

TTYL


-----------------------------
Herbert's PIC Stuff:
http://repatch.dyndns.org:8383/pic_stuff/

2005\04\22@112616 by olin_piclist

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Jan-Erik Soderholm wrote:
> If I'm right, I don't need them if I run the
> IDC2 USB-only, right ?

Right.  I've used the ICD2 powered only from USB with a self-powered target
board many times.


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Embed Inc, embedded system specialists in Littleton Massachusetts
(978) 742-9014, http://www.embedinc.com

2005\04\27@075646 by Howard Winter

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Jan-Erik,

Sorry I'm late to the party, as usual...

On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 14:55:02 +0200 (MEST), Jan-Erik Soderholm wrote:

>...<
> The -005 price was just plain wrong. Currently they offer it for $174,
> which is more reasonable compared to the -007, since it lacks the
> serial cable and the PSU. If I'm right, I don't need them if I run the
> IDC2 USB-only, right ?

Have a look at their "poster" for the ICD2:  http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/51265g.pdf

You'll see in section 3 that if you're using USB to connect to a *powered* target board, the ICD2 doesn't need
a PSU, but if you want to power the target from the ICD2 or if you are going to use the "Universal Programming
Module" (a ZIF socket which is plug-confuigured for the chip you are using) or use an unpowered target then
you need power fed to the ICD2: 9V as others have said.  It's decent quality power supply, and for the
difference in price I'd say get it!

Cheers,


Howard Winter
St.Albans, England


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