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'[PIC]: Production programming device?'
2004\04\12@153006 by Barry Gershenfeld

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For the last few years, my ICD-1 (now ICD-2) and I
have been the "production programmer" for all the
PIC's that we use.  But the numbers are increasing
and we have a need to let the production techs
program their own stock.  I have hesitated handing
this sort of thing over because the procedures
involving the ICD-2 and MPLAB can get quite involved--
MPLAB is a development environment.   I also
suspect that an ICD-2 programming run does not exactly
yield a production-quality part.

What I'm looking for is something that will take a HEX
file--and any other necessry info and not change it
(MPLAB likes to turn Debug mode back on and other
antics) and program the device via ICSP (In-circuit
serial programming).   Ideally it would
be upgradeable as Microchip invents new parts.  Maybe
Microchip makes what we need.

It doesn't have to be zero cost, either.  It does
have to be reliable and simple.

Barry

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2004\04\12@154752 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> What I'm looking for is something that will take a HEX
> file--and any other necessry info and not change it
> (MPLAB likes to turn Debug mode back on and other
> antics) and program the device via ICSP (In-circuit
> serial programming).   Ideally it would
> be upgradeable as Microchip invents new parts.  Maybe
> Microchip makes what we need.

My Wisp628 is used for production work (a customer uses some 30 of them
on one PC), but it is a one-voltage-only programmer, hence a prototype
prograpper in Microchip speak.

Wouter van Ooijen

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2004\04\12@154753 by John N. Power

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> From:         Barry Gershenfeld[SMTP:spam_OUTbarry_gTakeThisOuTspamZMICRO.COM]
> Sent:         Monday, April 12, 2004 3:26 PM
> To:   .....PICLISTKILLspamspam@spam@MITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Subject:      [PIC]: Production programming device?

> For the last few years, my ICD-1 (now ICD-2) and I
> have been the "production programmer" for all the
> PIC's that we use.  But the numbers are increasing
> and we have a need to let the production techs
> program their own stock.  I have hesitated handing
. this sort of thing over because the procedures
{Quote hidden}

Microchip does make a programmer which does just program
and nothing else. The current model is called the Picstart Plus
and is available from most distributors who handle Microchip
parts. The specifications can be found on the Microchip web
site. The ICDs are really development tools with the debugging
function as their main feature.

There is also a large number of "do-it-yourself" programmers
out there. These mainly consist of software which runs on a
PC, accompanied by circuit diagrams for a minimal hardware
interface. Even though they are free, they may have some
limitations, such as not working with the later chip types.

John Power

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2004\04\12@160248 by Spehro Pefhany

picon face
At 12:26 PM 4/12/2004 -0700, you wrote:
{Quote hidden}

Here is Microchip's new programmer. I have not looked at it yet,
don't know about availability either.

http://www.microchip.com/1010/pline/tools/picmicro/code/pm3/index.htm

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
speffspamKILLspaminterlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com

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2004\04\12@161245 by Matt Pobursky

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I just got a blurb on this from the Microchip Consultants Group today.
I'm not sure what it costs, but I do have a ProMate II and it can do
"one keypress" standalone programming.

http://www.microchip.com/1010/pline/tools/picmicro/code/pm3/

Matt Pobursky
Maximum Performance Systems

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 12:26:14 -0700, Barry Gershenfeld wrote:
{Quote hidden}

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2004\04\12@171832 by Jim Monteith

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Barry,

I just put a prototype into use that does exactly what you are looking for.
It uses 2 16f877a's.  One for controlling the process and one for actually
programming the PICs.

It can program up to 16 pics with the press of one button.  We build our
circuit boards as panels (10 individual circuits in one panel) The
programming PIC connects to one circuit board pic at a time using test
probes ( a bed of nails) and dumps code to the chip.  I use a clamp to apply
pressure to the top of the board.  This pushes it down onto the bed of
nails.

For my purpose, all of the code that goes in the production pics wil fit in
the 16f877a's rom, so I just put it in upper memory and then read it one
byte at a time and clock it out to the production pic.  I also read it back
and verify it at the extremes, and indicate success with an led for each
circuit.

All of this fits in a box and uses a 16 to 25 volt wall wart to power
everything.  Last week I programmed over 700 circuits in 50 minutes.

In the near future it will be able to accept new code through a serial port.
Right now, whenever I need to change the production code, I pull the
programmer chip, and re-program it.

Hope this helps,

Jim Monteith

> From:         Barry Gershenfeld[SMTP:.....barry_gKILLspamspam.....ZMICRO.COM]
> Sent:         Monday, April 12, 2004 3:26 PM
> To:   EraseMEPICLISTspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTMITVMA.MIT.EDU
> Subject:      [PIC]: Production programming device?

> For the last few years, my ICD-1 (now ICD-2) and I
> have been the "production programmer" for all the
> PIC's that we use.  But the numbers are increasing
> and we have a need to let the production techs
> program their own stock.  I have hesitated handing
. this sort of thing over because the procedures
{Quote hidden}

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2004\04\12@180020 by Mike Harrison

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On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 15:48:21 -0400, you wrote:

{Quote hidden}

Picstart is not a production programmer. Microchip do a production unit called Promate, which is much more production oriented (don't know if
they still do, but at one time it even came with DOS software for batch-file usage).
It will do things like allow standalone programming from master devices or internally stored hex
files, and can be 'locked down' after loading a hex file to avoid fiddling. It will also do
serialisation.
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2004\04\12@182755 by Spehro Pefhany

picon face
At 04:12 PM 4/12/2004 -0400, I wrote:


>Here is Microchip's new programmer. I have not looked at it yet,
>don't know about availability either.
>
>http://www.microchip.com/1010/pline/tools/picmicro/code/pm3/index.htm

BTW, list price is $895. US/ CAN1214. and estimated lead time (not always
reliable) is about a month.

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
KILLspamspeffKILLspamspaminterlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com

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2004\04\13@035855 by Samuel BOUQUET

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Tag correction...

I have asked a the last Microchip seminar:
"Is the ICD2 considered as a production programming device? Is ICD2
provide a multiple voltage programming?"

They answer me that Flash device do not need to be verified at multiple
voltage...


-----Message d'origine-----
De : pic microcontroller discussion list [RemoveMEPICLISTTakeThisOuTspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU]
De la part de Wouter van Ooijen Envoyé : lundi 12 avril 2004 21:48 À :
spamBeGonePICLISTspamBeGonespamMITVMA.MIT.EDU Objet : Re: [PICLIST] [PIC]: Production
programming device?


> What I'm looking for is something that will take a HEX file--and any
> other necessry info and not change it (MPLAB likes to turn Debug mode
> back on and other
> antics) and program the device via ICSP (In-circuit
> serial programming).   Ideally it would
> be upgradeable as Microchip invents new parts.  Maybe Microchip makes
> what we need.

My Wisp628 is used for production work (a customer uses some 30 of them
on one PC), but it is a one-voltage-only programmer, hence a prototype
prograpper in Microchip speak.

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products

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2004\04\13@135708 by Carey

face picon face
>
> What I'm looking for is something that will take a HEX
> file--and any other necessry info and not change it
> (MPLAB likes to turn Debug mode back on and other
> antics) and program the device via ICSP (In-circuit
> serial programming).   Ideally it would
> be upgradeable as Microchip invents new parts.  Maybe
> Microchip makes what we need.
>
> It doesn't have to be zero cost, either.  It does
> have to be reliable and simple.
>
Our Contract Manufacturer uses a LabTool 48XP Universal Programmer
(http://www.labtool.com) for all our PICs.  It will verify at multiple voltage
levels, serialize, check IDs etc. etc. They sell gang programmers also.
Carey


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2004\04\13@171810 by Eisermann, Phil [Ridg/CO]

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pic microcontroller discussion list wrote:
> I just got a blurb on this from the Microchip Consultants Group today.
> I'm not sure what it costs, but I do have a ProMate II and it can do
> "one keypress" standalone programming.

I'll second the ProMate II if you are looking for a production programmer.
List price is $695 at DigiKey. What separates production from development
programmers is that they verify at different voltages.

There have been threads on having some types of PICs verify at one
voltage but not others; If you are talking production, and it doesn't
have to be zero cost, why take the risk of using something that
might not work? There's usually a reason for the manufacturer's
specifications...



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2004\04\14@030618 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> There's usually a reason for the manufacturer's
> specifications...

As other answers have indicated this reason might be sheer lazyness from
the side of the programming specification authors at Microchip.

BTW there are a few cheap multi-voltage DIY proggers around, my old WISP
(Wisp628 predecessor) is one. But its range of targets is severly
limited.

Wouter van Ooijen

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2004\04\14@045433 by dr. Imre Bartfai

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Hello,

look at http://www.elnec.com

I use their SmartProg, it is excellent production quality programmer. More
info/experience on request.

Regards,
Imre


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On Mon, 12 Apr 2004, Barry Gershenfeld wrote:

{Quote hidden}

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