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'[PIC]: PLCC PICS'
2000\08\25@111609 by Paul Reilly

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Hi all,

I have a PICSTART Plus programmer and was wondering if/how I could program
a PLCC or QFP packaged PIC 16F877. The smaller size of these devices
would allow me to squeez the device/project in to a smaller enclosure.

Are there any 40pin DIL --> PLCC socket adapters and if I had one of these
or hard wired something up, would it work?

Paul

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2000\08\25@112639 by David Kott

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> Hi all,
>
> I have a PICSTART Plus programmer and was wondering if/how I could program
> a PLCC or QFP packaged PIC 16F877. The smaller size of these devices
> would allow me to squeez the device/project in to a smaller enclosure.
>
> Are there any 40pin DIL --> PLCC socket adapters and if I had one of these
> or hard wired something up, would it work?
>

Emulation Technology

http://www.emulationtechnology.com

Ironwood Electronics

http://www.ironwoodelectronics.com

These companies manufacture precisely what you have described;  40 DIL to
PLCC Programming Adapters.  In all likelihood, they have a part that is
designed specifically to program the '877.  If not, the programmers
connections are well documented online, or you can call them.  I have had
very good luck with their factory reps.  Ask them about a part, and they
will identify the programming adapter.

Be prepared to fork out between $80 and $120US for these adapters.

-d

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2000\08\25@113310 by rchock, Steve

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Paul,

I recently bought an adapter from Digikey that is used to
program PLCC packages. It is a 40 pin DIP to PLCC package
adapter. I used it in the PSP and it worked great!
Digikey's part number is 309-1039-ND It cost $115.00.

Programs the PIC16C64A, 65A(B), 67, 74A(B), 774, 77, F874,
and F877 in the PLCC packages!!!

Best regards,
Steve

Steven Kosmerchock
Radio Frequency Systems
Phoenix,  Arizona  USA
(WORK) http://www.rfsamericas.com

http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/lab/6584

"Great spirits have always encountered violent
oppposition from mediocre minds."--A.Einstein

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2000\08\25@114128 by Paul Reilly

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Thanks Steve  & David,

I thought something like this might exist :-)

Are they hardwired or can you change the pin mappings? I note that a
few pins on the PLCC 16F877 are NC's. So if it was hardwired then it must
only work with certain types of PLCC's - though maybe they all have the
same pins as NC's ?!

Thanks!

Paul

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2000\08\25@114753 by rchock, Steve

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Paul,

MICROCHIP has a 'migratable memory' approach to their
products. So more than likely they will have the same NC
pins on the 44pin PLCC packages. The adapter sold by Digikey is
hardwired.

Steve


Steven Kosmerchock
Radio Frequency Systems
Phoenix,  Arizona  USA
(WORK) http://www.rfsamericas.com

http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/lab/6584

"Great spirits have always encountered violent
oppposition from mediocre minds."--A.Einstein

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2000\08\25@115542 by Paul Reilly

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> pins on the 44pin PLCC packages. The adapter sold by Digikey is
> hardwired.
>

Thanks guys.

I just checked out some of those devices! Woah they are not cheap!
$170 for the emulation one! Why so expensive? Would it not be possible
to get a DIL socket and PLCC socket and build a small PCB to link them up
as required? That should only cost a 1/10th of those devices. I mean
there's nothing special in these devices is there, they're just
connectors, right?

Paul

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2000\08\25@115959 by rchock, Steve

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Basically anybody could make one.
Just wire it like the dip package.
RA0 on DIP to RA0 on PLCC package. Shouldn't
be too difficult. Just leave the NC pins alone,
and make a small PCB that has PLCC to DIP wiring.

Steve

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2000\08\25@120419 by Dipperstein, Michael

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The emulation products are basically built from stackable socket modules.  They
probably cost so much, because they can charge that much for them, not because
they have to in order to pay for their cost.

-Mike

{Original Message removed}

2000\08\25@123546 by Andrew Kunz

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They are very proud of the fact that all the future devices they were showing
use compatible pinouts to old parts.  In my book this is more important than
keeping things internally the same, because it allows me to keep the PCB the
same even when upgrading to a new family chip (ie, 18C from 16C).  With an
upward-compatible C compiler like HiTech's, it becomes a secretarial-type task
to make sure all the registers are used identically rather than requiring
thinking about banking.

Andy









"Kosmerchock, Steve" <KILLspamSteve.KosmerchockKILLspamspamRFSAMERICAS.COM> on 08/25/2000 11:45:26
AM

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cc:      (bcc: Andrew Kunz/TDI_NOTES)



Subject: Re: [PIC]: PLCC PICS








Paul,

MICROCHIP has a 'migratable memory' approach to their
products. So more than likely they will have the same NC
pins on the 44pin PLCC packages. The adapter sold by Digikey is
hardwired.

Steve


Steven Kosmerchock
Radio Frequency Systems
Phoenix,  Arizona  USA
(WORK) http://www.rfsamericas.com

http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/lab/6584

"Great spirits have always encountered violent
oppposition from mediocre minds."--A.Einstein

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2000\08\25@131112 by rchock, Steve

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Andy,

>>In my book this is more important than
>>keeping things internally the same, because it allows me to keep the PCB
the
>>same even when upgrading to a new family chip

I agree 150% I love the fact that I can do prototype work with a "FLASH"
part and then switch over to OTP if I want. Even better is designing with
a 2K or 4K part and you find out you need more memory. Not a board redesign,
just deal with it in software.

Steve


Steven Kosmerchock
Radio Frequency Systems
Phoenix,  Arizona  USA
(WORK) http://www.rfsamericas.com

http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/lab/6584

"Great spirits have always encountered violent
oppposition from mediocre minds."--A.Einstein

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2000\08\25@131738 by Dan Michaels

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Paul Reilly wrote:

>I just checked out some of those devices! Woah they are not cheap!
>$170 for the emulation one! Why so expensive? Would it not be possible
>to get a DIL socket and PLCC socket and build a small PCB to link them up
>as required? That should only cost a 1/10th of those devices. I mean
>there's nothing special in these devices is there, they're just
>connectors, right?
>

The astronomically high prices come from the costs of the ZIF
sockets. Just check those prices alone to see.

The cheapo or homemade adapters will use a regular $1 PLCC socket,
but this will not be suitable for "production" use - ie, programming
tons of chips every day.

However, what I personally do is to solder SIP machine pin receptacles
into the holes on the pcb, and stick the regular PLCC socket into
those. This way I can replace the cheapo socket as necessary. Still,
I don't have to program lots of PLCC chips - which goes better with
the ZIF.

cheers,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
===================

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2000\08\25@132154 by Bob Ammerman

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What's even worse: For programming most modern PICs you really only need a
few pins wired thru'

Bob Ammerman
RAm Systems
(contract development of high performance, high function, low-level
software)

{Original Message removed}

2000\08\25@133820 by Dan Michaels

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At 11:24 AM 8/25/00 -0400, you wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I have a PICSTART Plus programmer and was wondering if/how I could program
>> a PLCC or QFP packaged PIC 16F877. The smaller size of these devices
>> would allow me to squeez the device/project in to a smaller enclosure.
>>
>> Are there any 40pin DIL --> PLCC socket adapters and if I had one of these
>> or hard wired something up, would it work?
>>
........
>Be prepared to fork out between $80 and $120US for these adapters.
>

How does $21.95 and re-programmable sound? [have a nite out on
the town with the savings].

http://www.sni.net/~oricom/plc-adpt.htm


best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
===================

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2000\08\25@182912 by mike

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On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 11:57:31 -0400, you wrote:

>Basically anybody could make one.
>Just wire it like the dip package.
>RA0 on DIP to RA0 on PLCC package. Shouldn't
>be too difficult. Just leave the NC pins alone,
>and make a small PCB that has PLCC to DIP wiring.
>
>Steve
..remember that  for programming you only need to wire up 5 of the
pins....

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2000\08\26@052213 by Paul Reilly

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> ..remember that  for programming you only need to wire up 5 of the
> pins....
>
Excellent. This will be even easier so!

Thanks all,

Paul

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