Post by thread:[PIC]: PIC10F2xx series

I have looked in the PICLIST archives and I have not found what I am looking for so..... One of my clients is considering a project that could possibly use the PIC10F2xx series of controllers. I am a little concerned with these devices due to there limited program size and 12 bit instruction set. (Been there done that with the 16F506 device. Lots of pain and anguish with the program space and usable RAM.) What are groups thoughts on this series? I know that it has a limited number of I/O's and small program space but do you have some guidelines for its use? Where would you recommend it? What type of apps? Where would you be afraid of it? Looks good but just doesn't cut it. Thanks for your advice and thoughts. Phil

Phil Keller wrote: > What are groups thoughts on this series? I love those little guys! > I know that it has a limited number of I/O's and small program space > but do you have some guidelines for its use? It depends on what you want to do with them of course. One thing to consider is that ICSP must not be an afterthought since 5 of the 6 pins will participate. I find this to be this toughest challenge for designing with the 10Fs, especially since the original 4 10Fs always have the internal pullup on MCLR enabled when the MCLR pin is configured for that role. Fortunately the new ones don't have that problem, but they are more expensive and therefore less interesting. I discuss ICSP issues in more detail at http://www.embedinc.com/picprg/icsp.htm. > Where would you recommend it? Anyplace 4 I/O pins, 512 instructions, 24 bytes of RAM, and 4MHz are sufficient. They are particularly good for high volume applications. The price gets pretty low when you want to buy a few 100K to a few 1M of them. > What type of apps? I've used them a lot for simple switching power supply controllers. In fact I may be teaching a class at Masters on that subject this year. I've also used them in other applications. My most complicated 10F application is a active RFID tag that runs from a coin cell and every 10 seconds sends out a manchester encoded message followed by an IR signature. The IR modulation and the carrier itself are all produced by the 10F202. The IR LED goes on when a pin is high, and off when low. Everything else is firmware. There is also a button on the tag that is debounced. A short press increases the button counter in the RF packet and causes an immediate transmission. A long open causes other things to happen. Another application was an intelligent reset controller and watchdog timer all in one. > Where would you be afraid of it? Looks good but just doesn't cut it. I don't understand the question. Either it has enough resources to do the job or it doesn't. I don't see how fear is relevant. ****************************************************************** Embed Inc, Littleton Massachusetts, (978) 742-9014. #1 PIC consultant in 2004 program year. http://www.embedinc.com/products

I just finished a little project with the 10f200. It reads a rotary encoder and generates up or down pulses to drive the volume control inputs (which were designed to accept switch closures to ground) on a cinema sound processor. It worked out great! As mentioned by others, ICSP and in circuit debugging can be interesting. I did debug using the simulator and staring a code, modifying something, programming the chip again, etc. ("crash and burn" debuggin). ICSP didn't turn out to be an issue here since the encoder detents to open circuit. The other PIC pins are outputs that leave the boards, so if the board is standing alone, the pins are available for ICSP. In this application, I wanted open drain outputs so multiple devices could be on the same set of control lines. So, instead of pulsing the PORT register, I set it low and pulsed the TRIS bits. The outputs went from open circuit (TRIS=1) to low (TRIS=0). Anyway, that was my first try at using the 10F200. It worked out great! Harold -- FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com

Hi This PIC is very useful for miniaturization. I plan to using the 10F203 in a datalogger. With a sensor (LDR or something), a 24AA512 serial EEPROM and 3 contact points for download (could use IR too). On the computer I could fit the whole circuit on a 5x8mm single sided board with a wristwatch battery on the bottom. While I was busy perfecting the design, another idea was presented to me which I am now researching, that is transmitting the sensor values using an Ultra Wide Band transmitter. It should not take a lot of space since there's no need for external transmitter circuitry. I am a little concerneed about the transmission range though. Mark On 1/27/06, Harold Hallikainen <spam_OUTharoldTakeThisOuThallikainen.com> wrote: {Quote hidden}> > I just finished a little project with the 10f200. It reads a rotary > encoder and generates up or down pulses to drive the volume control inputs > (which were designed to accept switch closures to ground) on a cinema > sound processor. It worked out great! > > As mentioned by others, ICSP and in circuit debugging can be interesting. > I did debug using the simulator and staring a code, modifying something, > programming the chip again, etc. ("crash and burn" debuggin). ICSP didn't > turn out to be an issue here since the encoder detents to open circuit. > The other PIC pins are outputs that leave the boards, so if the board is > standing alone, the pins are available for ICSP. > > In this application, I wanted open drain outputs so multiple devices could > be on the same set of control lines. So, instead of pulsing the PORT > register, I set it low and pulsed the TRIS bits. The outputs went from > open circuit (TRIS=1) to low (TRIS=0). > > Anyway, that was my first try at using the 10F200. It worked out great! > > Harold > > > -- > FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com > -

You have any more details regarding this UWB transmitter? On 1/28/06, Mark Jeronimus <.....zombie.piclistKILLspam@spam@gmail.com> wrote: {Quote hidden}> > Hi > > This PIC is very useful for miniaturization. > > I plan to using the 10F203 in a datalogger. With a sensor (LDR or > something), a 24AA512 serial EEPROM and 3 contact points for download > (could > use IR too). On the computer I could fit the whole circuit on a 5x8mm > single > sided board with a wristwatch battery on the bottom. While I was busy > perfecting the design, another idea was presented to me which I am now > researching, that is transmitting the sensor values using an Ultra Wide > Band > transmitter. It should not take a lot of space since there's no need for > external transmitter circuitry. I am a little concerneed about the > transmission range though. > > Mark > > On 1/27/06, Harold Hallikainen <haroldKILLspamhallikainen.com> wrote: > > > > I just finished a little project with the 10f200. It reads a rotary > > encoder and generates up or down pulses to drive the volume control > inputs > > (which were designed to accept switch closures to ground) on a cinema > > sound processor. It worked out great! > > > > As mentioned by others, ICSP and in circuit debugging can be > interesting. > > I did debug using the simulator and staring a code, modifying something, > > programming the chip again, etc. ("crash and burn" debuggin). ICSP > didn't > > turn out to be an issue here since the encoder detents to open circuit. > > The other PIC pins are outputs that leave the boards, so if the board is > > standing alone, the pins are available for ICSP. > > > > In this application, I wanted open drain outputs so multiple devices > could > > be on the same set of control lines. So, instead of pulsing the PORT > > register, I set it low and pulsed the TRIS bits. The outputs went from > > open circuit (TRIS=1) to low (TRIS=0). > > > > Anyway, that was my first try at using the 10F200. It worked out great! > > > > Harold > > > > > > -- > > FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com > > --

Hi This is the general principle of UWB: http://www.asahi-net.or.jp/~ny3k-kbys/contents/uwb_technology.html<www.asahi-net.or.jp/%7Eny3k-kbys/contents/uwb_technology.html> * * I also got some clues from section 3 of this document: www.kuroda.elec.keio.ac.jp/pdf/kuroda/2003/2003_19.pdf <home.12move.nl/zombie/UWB5-Demodulated.MP3> I hope this is what you need. Mark On 1/28/06, Shawn Wilton <.....black9KILLspam.....gmail.com> wrote: {Quote hidden}> > You have any more details regarding this UWB transmitter? > > On 1/28/06, Mark Jeronimus <EraseMEzombie.piclistspam_OUTTakeThisOuTgmail.com> wrote: > > > > Hi > > > > This PIC is very useful for miniaturization. > > > > I plan to using the 10F203 in a datalogger. With a sensor (LDR or > > something), a 24AA512 serial EEPROM and 3 contact points for download > > (could > > use IR too). On the computer I could fit the whole circuit on a 5x8mm > > single > > sided board with a wristwatch battery on the bottom. While I was busy > > perfecting the design, another idea was presented to me which I am now > > researching, that is transmitting the sensor values using an Ultra Wide > > Band > > transmitter. It should not take a lot of space since there's no need for > > external transmitter circuitry. I am a little concerneed about the > > transmission range though. > > > > Mark > > > > On 1/27/06, Harold Hallikainen <haroldspam_OUThallikainen.com> wrote: > > > > > > I just finished a little project with the 10f200. It reads a rotary > > > encoder and generates up or down pulses to drive the volume control > > inputs > > > (which were designed to accept switch closures to ground) on a cinema > > > sound processor. It worked out great! > > > > > > As mentioned by others, ICSP and in circuit debugging can be > > interesting. > > > I did debug using the simulator and staring a code, modifying > something, > > > programming the chip again, etc. ("crash and burn" debuggin). ICSP > > didn't > > > turn out to be an issue here since the encoder detents to open > circuit. > > > The other PIC pins are outputs that leave the boards, so if the board > is > > > standing alone, the pins are available for ICSP. > > > > > > In this application, I wanted open drain outputs so multiple devices > > could > > > be on the same set of control lines. So, instead of pulsing the PORT > > > register, I set it low and pulsed the TRIS bits. The outputs went from > > > open circuit (TRIS=1) to low (TRIS=0). > > > > > > Anyway, that was my first try at using the 10F200. It worked out > great! > > > > > > Harold > > > > > > > > > -- > > > FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com > > > -- >

Mark Jeronimus wrote: >Hi >This is the general principle of UWB: >http://www.asahi-net.or.jp/~ny3k-kbys/contents/uwb_technology.html<www.asahi-net.or.jp/%7Eny3k-kbys/contents/uwb_technology.html> >* >* >I also got some clues from section 3 of this document: >www.kuroda.elec.keio.ac.jp/pdf/kuroda/2003/2003_19.pdf ><home.12move.nl/zombie/UWB5-Demodulated.MP3> >I hope this is what you need. > >Mark > > Looks to me like the transmitter is very simple, but the receiving is very hard. The receiver has to filter *syncronized* to the transmitter, or else you have to slide the receiver filter along until you get the signal. It doesn't look at all easy to build that par - but I hope I am wrong! Also, the last url above should probably be: <http://home.12move.nl/zombie/UWBTransceiver.png> David

I'm experimenting with single-end audio communication and pulse frequency modulation (modulation strength 0.2x f0 around f0). The receiving side doesn't have to synchronize, but just convert the frequency to volts. I've made a working simulation using a resettalbe integrator, reciprocal calculator (for audio FM only), ac coupling and an antialiasing filter on 0.58x f0. The last 4 steps are best done in a microcontroller. Mark On 1/29/06, David P Harris <@spam@dpharrisKILLspamtelus.net> wrote: {Quote hidden}> > Mark Jeronimus wrote: > > >Hi > >This is the general principle of UWB: > >www.asahi-net.or.jp/~ny3k-kbys/contents/uwb_technology.html< > www.asahi-net.or.jp/%7Eny3k-kbys/contents/uwb_technology.html> > >* > >* > >I also got some clues from section 3 of this document: > >www.kuroda.elec.keio.ac.jp/pdf/kuroda/2003/2003_19.pdf > ><home.12move.nl/zombie/UWB5-Demodulated.MP3> > >I hope this is what you need. > > > >Mark > > > > > Looks to me like the transmitter is very simple, but the receiving is > very hard. The receiver has to filter *syncronized* to the transmitter, > or else you have to slide the receiver filter along until you get the > signal. It doesn't look at all easy to build that par - but I hope I > am wrong! > > Also, the last url above should probably be: > <http://home.12move.nl/zombie/UWBTransceiver.png> > > David > > > -

On 1/29/06, David P Harris <KILLspamdpharrisKILLspamtelus.net> wrote: > Looks to me like the transmitter is very simple, but the receiving is > very hard. The receiver has to filter *syncronized* to the transmitter, > or else you have to slide the receiver filter along until you get the > signal. It doesn't look at all easy to build that par - but I hope I > am wrong! Receiving is very similar to spread spectrum technology, with a sliding comparator. At least conceptually. So it's a solved problem, we just need to implement it. -Adam