Post by thread:[PIC]: PIC and Realtek 8019as Ethernet

Hello all! I'm back. I'm sorry I haven't been around for the past couple months, but between a move, a new hard drive, and an outrageous amount of work, I haven't had enough time for the list. It was hard...but I managed to nominally keep up with digests. Anyway, I hope everyone is well! And now, for one of the things I've been thinking about while away. I'm looking at connecting a PIC to an Ethernet network. I'd like to use the Realtek 8019as chip, for numerous reasons, the most important one being that it is still widely available and well represented out in the field. This is my first network type project, so I've been reading up on TCP/IP. I've also ordered TCP/IP Lean, a book about embedded systems. I'm not looking to do a full TCP implementation, I'll likely be satisfied with UDP. I will likely have to write at least part, if not the entire stack by myself. I would like to see some examples before I start though considering this is my first project of this type. So far, here is what I have come up with: www.rof.net/yp/alphaone/activities/electronics/3c509b/ This is a really excellent site, and I do plan on building the device, even though is uses the wrong chipset. I hope I will be able to learn about the stack implementation. http://www.eix.co.uk/Ethernet/ This site looked super promising. However, there is no source code online, and the schematic is of too low a resolution to read. I tried emailing the author, but no response. The site is based on an article, so I tried emailing the publisher, but the account isn't valid. The article was in the May and July 2001 issue of Electronics World. If anyone has that magazine, I'd love a decent scan of the schematic. members.vol.at/home.floery/electronix/picnic/ This site looks very promising, except the schematic is a very large drawing, and I can't get it to print out on a smaller piece of paper so I can study it for awhile. Quite annoying, but I will be digging deeper at this site. www.circuitcellar.com/chipcenter-pdfs/1101/c1101fe.pdf I thought it looked good, but it's basically just an exercising of the picdem.net board from Microchip So, that's what I've found so far. Any others? I'm open to other chipsets as well, I have much to learn, and the more examples I see, the better. I haven't ordered the Picdem.net board from Microchip for numerous reasons. Basically, I can't program in C, nor do I own a C compiler, so the Microchip stack is basically useless for me. The only advantage of that board is the inbuilt Ethernet interface. It is slick, but at US$300, I'd rather kludge together a demo board with a PIC and an ISA Ethernet card. Cheaper, and just as effective. So, if you have any code, schematics, ideas, or comments, please let me know, I'd love to hear them! If anyone else has any experience in this area, I'm very interested in hearing about your trials and tribulations. Good to be back :) Josh -- http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList spam_OUTpiclist-unsubscribe-requestTakeThisOuTmitvma.mit.edu

...(snip)... "I'd like to use the Realtek 8019as chip," ... "I've also ordered TCP/IP Lean, a book about embedded systems." Josh: Just two quick points: If it's not too late & you ordered the previous edition, the second edition of that book has been released. I haven't read it (yet) but I do know that it contains some discussion regarding using the PIC for this. If it is too late, then search Microchips website as I think that same author had some relevant info available there (possibly the text for the new PIC chapter???). And secondly, does that Realtek chip contain internal RAM that is available to the external controller (PIC)? I know Realtek does make at least one device that does so, and it'll be important for buffering your packets... Please keep us posted, as there are several of us that are hoping to do similar things in the future ... BTW I just moved too, but am in temporary rental property & cannot do much until I can unpack several months from now :( Bruce. -- http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList .....piclist-unsubscribe-requestKILLspam@spam@mitvma.mit.edu

Well, sadly, I believe it is too late. However, for $15 on eBay, I still think I did ok. The author of the book is I believe the guy who wrote the code (or at least helped) for the Microchip TCP/IP stack. Problem is, it's all in C. I bought the book more for it's informational purposes, rather than actual code snippets. I'm hoping it will discuss TCP/IP on a byte level, and provide methods for dealing with things within the constrains of a controller. If anyone has seen the newer version, please let us know what's in there! Josh -- A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools. -Douglas Adams "Bourdon, Bruce" wrote: > If it's not too late & you ordered the previous edition, the second edition > of that book has been released. I haven't read it (yet) but I do know that > it contains some discussion regarding using the PIC for this. -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

Also have a look at http://www.edtp.com/. You can get the C sources for their "packet whacker", a RTL8019 featured NIC. (And there is the .lst file, so you have assembler sources ;-) ) I don't know if it is a full featured TCP/IP stack (I haven't really locked at the source), but it seems promising. Florian Josh Koffman wrote: {Quote hidden}> Hello all! I'm back. I'm sorry I haven't been around for the past couple > months, but between a move, a new hard drive, and an outrageous amount > of work, I haven't had enough time for the list. It was hard...but I > managed to nominally keep up with digests. Anyway, I hope everyone is > well! > > And now, for one of the things I've been thinking about while away. I'm > looking at connecting a PIC to an Ethernet network. I'd like to use the > Realtek 8019as chip, for numerous reasons, the most important one being > that it is still widely available and well represented out in the field. > This is my first network type project, so I've been reading up on > TCP/IP. I've also ordered TCP/IP Lean, a book about embedded systems. > I'm not looking to do a full TCP implementation, I'll likely be > satisfied with UDP. I will likely have to write at least part, if not > the entire stack by myself. I would like to see some examples before I > start though considering this is my first project of this type. > > So far, here is what I have come up with: > www.rof.net/yp/alphaone/activities/electronics/3c509b/ > This is a really excellent site, and I do plan on building the device, > even though is uses the wrong chipset. I hope I will be able to learn > about the stack implementation. > http://www.eix.co.uk/Ethernet/ > This site looked super promising. However, there is no source code > online, and the schematic is of too low a resolution to read. I tried > emailing the author, but no response. The site is based on an article, > so I tried emailing the publisher, but the account isn't valid. The > article was in the May and July 2001 issue of Electronics World. If > anyone has that magazine, I'd love a decent scan of the schematic. > members.vol.at/home.floery/electronix/picnic/ > This site looks very promising, except the schematic is a very large > drawing, and I can't get it to print out on a smaller piece of paper so > I can study it for awhile. Quite annoying, but I will be digging deeper > at this site. > www.circuitcellar.com/chipcenter-pdfs/1101/c1101fe.pdf > I thought it looked good, but it's basically just an exercising of the > picdem.net board from Microchip > > So, that's what I've found so far. Any others? I'm open to other > chipsets as well, I have much to learn, and the more examples I see, the > better. I haven't ordered the Picdem.net board from Microchip for > numerous reasons. Basically, I can't program in C, nor do I own a C > compiler, so the Microchip stack is basically useless for me. The only > advantage of that board is the inbuilt Ethernet interface. It is slick, > but at US$300, I'd rather kludge together a demo board with a PIC and an > ISA Ethernet card. Cheaper, and just as effective. > > So, if you have any code, schematics, ideas, or comments, please let me > know, I'd love to hear them! If anyone else has any experience in this > area, I'm very interested in hearing about your trials and tribulations. > > Good to be back :) > > Josh > > -- > http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList > piclist-unsubscribe-requestKILLspammitvma.mit.edu > > > -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

Well, it's not microcontroller specific at all, and not cheap, but the ultimate TCP/IP book is TCP/IP Illustrated, by W. Richard Stevens. If you want a TCP/IP "ultimate reference manual". ISBN: 0201633469 Probably not what you're looking for, but thought I'd mention it if you really want to see the nitty-gritty of TCP/IP stacks. There's also a newer book out about TCP/IP Implementation in the same series, but I don't have that one. TCP/IP Illustrated is pulled down off the shelf as a reference regularly, though... Nate On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 23:56, Josh Koffman wrote: > Well, sadly, I believe it is too late. However, for $15 on eBay, I still > think I did ok. The author of the book is I believe the guy who wrote > the code (or at least helped) for the Microchip TCP/IP stack. Problem > is, it's all in C. I bought the book more for it's informational > purposes, rather than actual code snippets. I'm hoping it will discuss > TCP/IP on a byte level, and provide methods for dealing with things > within the constrains of a controller. If anyone has seen the newer > version, please let us know what's in there! -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

Yep that is the only book I use nowadays. Simply the best book for networking reference and study. The implementation book is very good for concepts that has been implemented in the real world. To follow the code you need C and system programming specifically in Unixs. Nate Duehr wrote: {Quote hidden}> Well, it's not microcontroller specific at all, and not cheap, but the > ultimate TCP/IP book is TCP/IP Illustrated, by W. Richard Stevens. If > you want a TCP/IP "ultimate reference manual". > > ISBN: 0201633469 > > Probably not what you're looking for, but thought I'd mention it if you > really want to see the nitty-gritty of TCP/IP stacks. > > There's also a newer book out about TCP/IP Implementation in the same > series, but I don't have that one. TCP/IP Illustrated is pulled down > off the shelf as a reference regularly, though... > > Nate > > On Mon, 2002-10-28 at 23:56, Josh Koffman wrote: > > Well, sadly, I believe it is too late. However, for $15 on eBay, I still > > think I did ok. The author of the book is I believe the guy who wrote > > the code (or at least helped) for the Microchip TCP/IP stack. Problem > > is, it's all in C. I bought the book more for it's informational > > purposes, rather than actual code snippets. I'm hoping it will discuss > > TCP/IP on a byte level, and provide methods for dealing with things > > within the constrains of a controller. If anyone has seen the newer > > version, please let us know what's in there! > > -- > http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: > [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

Ok, my bad. I should have looked into it a bit further. However, the source of my misconception was that the TCP/IP Lean book is included in the purchase of the Picdem.net board. Oops! Josh -- A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools. -Douglas Adams Jim Main wrote: > The author of the book is Jeremy Bentham, whereas, the Mchip stack was > written by a staff member called Nilesh Rajbharti (although they are very > similar) > > The iosoft stack which comes with the picdemnet board, runs on a 16F877, > whereas the Microchip stack runs on an 18F452. -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

Well, time for the daily update on my research. Thank you to all those that have helped so far! http://dunkels.com/adam/uip/ uIP - A Free Small TCP/IP Implementation for 8- and 16-bit Microcontrollers. Interesting. There is even a guy who has ported this to an 18C chip. However, code is all in C, and there seems to be no way to contact the PIC guy. http://www.edtp.com/ They make a small Ethernet module based on the RTL8019. Code is all in C, so of little use to me, but having another schematic is useful. If you look at it though, it doesn't have any of the transformers and the like you see on regular Ethernet cards. Any thoughts on this? I'm fresh out of ideas. http://www.edcheung.com/awards/pic2k/pic2k.htm This guy won a Circuit Cellar contest doing this. I emailed him, and his code is all in C though. Maybe I should take this as a hint to learn C? members.vol.at/home.floery/electronix/picnic/ I haven't had the chance to look at this site much since yesterday. I still can't get the schematic to print on an 8.5x11" sheet of paper, and still be inteligible. I could even do 11x17 if needed. If there is someone who has Adobe Acrobat, and can read the schematic at members.vol.at/home.floery/electronix/picnic/images/layout.png and output a .pdf, I would really appreciate it. I just need something that can intelligently scale a line drawing without trying to do funky stuff with the characters. Anyway, that's where I stand right now. Hopefully, I'll have more tomorrow! Thanks, Josh -- A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools. -Douglas Adams -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Josh Koffman wrote: > http://www.edtp.com/ > They make a small Ethernet module based on the RTL8019. Code is all in > C, so of little use to me, but having another schematic is useful. If > you look at it though, it doesn't have any of the transformers and the > like you see on regular Ethernet cards. Any thoughts on this? I'm fresh > out of ideas. NetMedia sells an RJ45 jack with all the magnetics built in for $5. Gets my vote for sure. I don't remember who actually manufactures them, but it's not tough to find out I'm sure. > http://www.edcheung.com/awards/pic2k/pic2k.htm > This guy won a Circuit Cellar contest doing this. I emailed him, and his > code is all in C though. Maybe I should take this as a hint to learn C? If you're writing or hacking IP on a PIC (or about anything else) it's probably a very good idea. Anywhere you look at TCP/IP code it's more than likely going to be C. Yes, you *can* write it in asm if you're dedicated to it, but you'll have to learn C to understand the source of those who have gone before you anyway. And it's NOT that hard to learn. Dale -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Josh Koffman wrote: *>http://www.edtp.com/ *>They make a small Ethernet module based on the RTL8019. Code is all in *>C, so of little use to me, but having another schematic is useful. If *>you look at it though, it doesn't have any of the transformers and the *>like you see on regular Ethernet cards. Any thoughts on this? I'm fresh *>out of ideas. Usually you can do ethernet w/o transformers if it does not need to drive a lot of cards and if the circuit is already floating (because it has a IP2 class mains transformer or such). It can also do this if it is not floating, by relying on the other side's transformers. If both sides decide to rely on the other side's transformers bad things will happen. Peter -- http://www.piclist.com hint: The list server can filter out subtopics (like ads or off topics) for you. See http://www.piclist.com/#topics