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'[PIC]: NT compatability'
2000\09\19@035225 by Michael Rigby-Jones

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I'm shortly to get a new PC here at work, which will (by corporate order) be
running NT4.  I am a little concerned about compatibility with MPLAB,
PICSTART+, ICE2000 and the ICD as I have heard of a few people on the list
having problems.  I believe all these should work under NT but I'd like some
confirmation before I find out the hard way with dealines looming.

Regards

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2000\09\19@042645 by Wollenberg, Frank

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AFAIK MPLAB and PICMASTER doesn't work under NT.
Frank
-----------------------------------------------
Frank Wollenberg
GSP Sprachtechnologie GmbH
12247 Berlin, Germany
Tel.:   +49 (0)30 769 929 - 78
Fax.:   +49 (0)30 769 929 - 12
eMail:  <spam_OUTf.wollenbergTakeThisOuTspamgsp-berlin.de>
www:    <http://www.gsp-berlin.de>



{Original Message removed}

2000\09\19@043747 by robertf

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I'm using NT4 SP3 with rev 7 hardware, rev 2.01 firmware Picstart, MPLAB
ver. 5.00.00- works fine.
No info on the remainder of your gears.

Robertf

{Original Message removed}

2000\09\19@044632 by Michael Rigby-Jones

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That's a great help.  I would think that if the Picstart works then the rest
of it should as well. I would think if anything, the serial/parallel comms
would be most likely to cause trouble.

Mike

> {Original Message removed}

2000\09\19@052905 by Jamie Dainton

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Hello Michael,

Tuesday, September 19, 2000, 08:45:46, you wrote:

MRJ> I'm shortly to get a new PC here at work, which will (by corporate order) be
MRJ> running NT4.  I am a little concerned about compatibility with MPLAB,
MRJ> PICSTART+, ICE2000 and the ICD as I have heard of a few people on the list
MRJ> having problems.  I believe all these should work under NT but I'd like some
MRJ> confirmation before I find out the hard way with dealines looming.

I doubt that the majority of this software/hardware will work. NT does
NOT allow direct access to the ports. It may be easier to point out
that the software will not work, therefore you should continue using
Win9x.

--
From Jamie Dainton
Tuesday, September 19, 2000 09:57:47
The Bat! 1.46 Beta/5
Windows 98 4.10 2222

.....pgpKILLspamspam@spam@dainton.org.uk?subject=sendKey

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2000\09\19@054608 by Michael Rigby-Jones

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{Quote hidden}

Hopefully, the authors of MPLAB don't use direct hardware access for the
serial comms.  If they have used the Windows API (and it sounds like they
must have) then it should have a good chance of working.

I'd be loathe to stick with Win9x as the new PC is a dual P3-733, so only
one CPU would be used unless I run Win NT or 2000.

I guess I'll have to "suck it and see", but I have had some encouraging
reports on here already.

Cheers

Mike

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2000\09\19@055018 by Martin Schaefer

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> From Jamie Dainton:

> I doubt that the majority of this software/hardware will work. NT does
> NOT allow direct access to the ports. It may be easier to point out
> that the software will not work, therefore you should continue using
> Win9x.

This is completely nonsense! I work exclusively with NT and I'm using MPLAB,
PICSTART, PRO MATE and ICE2000. All tools are working fine.


Martin


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2000\09\19@062629 by Jamie Dainton

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Hello Martin,

Tuesday, September 19, 2000, 12:13:18, you wrote:

MS> This is completely nonsense! I work exclusively with NT and I'm using MPLAB,
MS> PICSTART, PRO MATE and ICE2000. All tools are working fine.

They may work but NT does not allow direct access to the ports.

--
From Jamie Dainton
Tuesday, September 19, 2000 11:24:48
The Bat! 1.46 Beta/5
Windows 98 4.10 2222

pgpspamspam_OUTdainton.org.uk?subject=sendKey

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2000\09\19@063723 by Alan B. Pearce

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>They may work but NT does not allow direct access to the ports.

yes and no!!!! It depends on wether you are using Workstation or Server. It is definitely harder to talk directly to the hardware in Server than it is in Workstation. This caused me some hassle when trying to use a DOS based serial interface program that operated in a polled environment. The program worked satisfactorily on Workstation, but when the machine was converted to Server, with no hardware changes, the extra software handling inside NT Server caused no end of hassle with timeouts on the polled environment. We came to the conclusion that the hardware was more available under Workstation, possibly so Fax programs and the like could use Workstation as their server without incurring too much processing overhead.

You may well find that Workstation is not as secure as you think it is. I have had a minute play with using a Picstart Plus on NT Workstation without any problems using MPLAB 4.

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2000\09\19@065602 by Martin Schaefer

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> From Jamie Dainton

> They may work but NT does not allow direct access to the ports.

This is correct, but you dont need direct access to the ports. All
communication with the development tools is serial RS232. And there is a
clearly defined protocol. You only have to use it. And that's what the tools
vom Arizona do.

Martin

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2000\09\19@074910 by Dale Botkin

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On Tue, 19 Sep 2000, Martin Schaefer wrote:

> > From Jamie Dainton:
>
> > I doubt that the majority of this software/hardware will work. NT does
> > NOT allow direct access to the ports. It may be easier to point out
> > that the software will not work, therefore you should continue using
> > Win9x.
>
> This is completely nonsense! I work exclusively with NT and I'm using MPLAB,
> PICSTART, PRO MATE and ICE2000. All tools are working fine.

I'd have to agree.  While I don't use PICSTART, PROMATE, or ICE2000, I do
use MPLAB and MELabs' EPIC (which DOES use direct parallel port access,
and comes with an NT driver).  There are a lot of othe tools as well for
the PIC and some 805x variants.  No problems at all with NT4 SP4, 5 or 6.
Plus the platform is one hell of a lot less buggy than Win9X (I use both).

Dale
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discoveries, is not "Eureka!" (I found it!) but "That's funny ..."
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2000\09\19@075349 by Bob Ammerman

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Watch out with the dual processor thing. Lots of WINDOZE software is not
properly written to handle multiple CPUs.

Bob Ammerman
RAm Systems
(contract development of high performance, high function, low-level
software)

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Rigby-Jones <@spam@mrjonesKILLspamspamNORTELNETWORKS.COM>
To: <KILLspamPICLISTKILLspamspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2000 5:42 AM
Subject: Re: [PIC]: NT compatability


> > {Original Message removed}

2000\09\19@081818 by Thomas Washburn

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On Tuesday, September 19th, 2000, Jamie Dainton wrote:

> > I'm shortly to get a new PC here at work, which will (by
> > corporate order) be running NT4.  I am a little concerned
> > about compatibility with MPLAB, PICSTART+, ICE2000 and the
> > ICD as I have heard of a few people on the list having
> > problems.  I believe all these should work under NT but
> > I'd like some confirmation before I find out the hard way
> > with dealines looming.
>
> I doubt that the majority of this software/hardware will work. NT does
> NOT allow direct access to the ports. It may be easier to point out
> that the software will not work, therefore you should continue using
> Win9x.

Microchip's tech support claims that the MPLAB/PICSTART+ combination
is now fully NT-compatible.  The MPLAB distribution even includes a
conspicuous-looking "PORTIONT.DLL" dynamic library in addition to
"PORTIO.DLL".

That said, I keep getting communications errors when talking to the
PICSTART+ using MPLAB under NT4.  Microchip figures it's a problem
with the PICSTART+ itself.  They're sending a replacement PICSTART+
to try.

-Tom

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2000\09\19@085013 by Olin Lathrop

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> I'm shortly to get a new PC here at work, which will (by corporate order)
be
> running NT4.  I am a little concerned about compatibility with MPLAB,
> PICSTART+, ICE2000 and the ICD as I have heard of a few people on the list
> having problems.  I believe all these should work under NT but I'd like
some
> confirmation before I find out the hard way with dealines looming.

Parts of MPLAB used to not run on NT but this was (finally!) fixed.  I use
NT4 all the time to run the MPLAB IDE, assembler, librarian, linker, and
associated support for the Picstart+ and the ICE-2000.  All works fine,
other than the regular MPLAB bugs and annoyances.


*****************************************************************
Olin Lathrop, embedded systems consultant in Devens Massachusetts
(978) 772-3129, RemoveMEolinTakeThisOuTspamcognivis.com, http://www.cognivis.com

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2000\09\19@163520 by hard Prosser

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There was a problem running MPLAB etc with NT in earlier versions. Later on
came a separate DLL to download which fixed the problem. I the current
versions seem to be OK  without downloading anything special. I'm running
NT4 with MPLAB, ICEPIC, PICSTART+ without problems and I'm pretty sure I
did a straightforward install from the CD.


Richard P








I'm shortly to get a new PC here at work, which will (by corporate order)
be
running NT4.  I am a little concerned about compatibility with MPLAB,
PICSTART+, ICE2000 and the ICD as I have heard of a few people on the list
having problems.  I believe all these should work under NT but I'd like
some
confirmation before I find out the hard way with dealines looming.

Regards

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2000\09\19@201955 by Gennette, Bruce

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Talk to your IT people and tell them that you require *DIRECT* access to the
parallel and serial ports.

When they say that it is impossible to arrange on NT4.0 then tell them you
have heard of portio.dll which is a special driver that allows it.  They
will most likely insist that you are not allowed to alter the standard setup
on all company PCs (read here easy for them to maintain).

Go through your department head if you have to to get (force) your IT
department to create an alternative setup for instrumental PCs as well as
the standard setup for office PCs.

Been there, done that - it only took 3 months here at the Hunter Institute
of Technology Science Department to force the IT department into creating a
non-office version of the standard setup.  Then, suddenly, Engineering
wanted it, and Electrical, and Electronics, and Sign Writing and Garment
Design and . . .  and every department that had anything other than a
printer connected to their PC.

Of course you also need NT4.0 service pack 6 and the latest drivers for any
special hardware.  The point is that none timing critical devices should
talk through the NT Hardware Abstraction device drivers while timing
critical devices *CAN* use portio.dll *IF* it has been installed.

Bye.

       {Original Message removed}

2000\09\20@232502 by Mitchell D. Miller

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While true, any application (even one that is not multi-threaded) can run on
a separate processor from the O/S.  Therefore, in some sense, you are using
one processor for the O/S and the other for an application.  Not sure that
would buy much, and you are right ... an application not written
multi-threaded will not automatically use more than one processor.

-- Mitch


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To: <TakeThisOuTPICLISTEraseMEspamspam_OUTMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2000 6:39 AM
Subject: Re: [PIC]: NT compatability


{Quote hidden}

> > > {Original Message removed}

2000\09\22@090552 by Olin Lathrop

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> While true, any application (even one that is not multi-threaded) can run
on
> a separate processor from the O/S.  Therefore, in some sense, you are
using
> one processor for the O/S and the other for an application.  Not sure that
> would buy much, and you are right ... an application not written
> multi-threaded will not automatically use more than one processor.

The NT "OS" does not run on a specific processor.  There are a number of
threads used by the kernel, which each could run on any available processor
whenever they are scheduled.  There are rare exceptions where a thread with
sufficient rights can force its execution to a certain subset of processors,
but in practise most OS and related work is done by threads that don't set
any unusual processor affinity.

A single threaded app is just another thread that is added to the list of
threads.  It, like most other threads will run on whatever processor is
available when it is scheduled.  There is no guarantee that it won't run on
processor 0 for 200mS, go to sleep for 100mS, then run on processor 1 for
100mS.


*****************************************************************
Olin Lathrop, embedded systems consultant in Devens Massachusetts
(978) 772-3129, EraseMEolinspamcognivis.com, http://www.cognivis.com

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