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'[PIC:] drop in replacement for pic 16f876'
2004\06\03@042826 by tin=22?=

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my code got bigger and bigger, and there is no room left for further improvements of the design, as the 16f876 is completely  full. there is also no way to use the icd debugger, as this one consumes some memory too.

as further compression of the code is impossible, I wonder if there is an easy way to replace the 16f876 (28 pin pdip) with anything bigger. I think this has to be something from the 18fxxx family.

is there a fully pin and function compatible device, that allows me to replace the controller 'in the field', without touching the board?

my design uses all pins as digital i/o's and has an icd interface.

thank you for your help!
tino

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2004\06\03@045943 by hael Rigby-Jones

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{Quote hidden}

The 18F252 is pin compatible apart from the low voltage programming pin
(PGM) which was moved from pin 24 on the 16F876 to pin 26 on the 18F252
part.  Not a problem if you don't use low voltage programming however.

The part has 16K words of program memory.  Note you will have to use the
ICD2 debugger, the original ICD does not support the 18F parts.

Of coures you will still need to port your 16F code over, but Microchip does
have a document showing the main aspects of porting to the 18F familly (but
I don't know the doc number, sorry!).

Regards

Mike




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2004\06\03@050400 by Mike Harrison

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On Thu, 3 Jun 2004 10:29:11 +0200, you wrote:

>my code got bigger and bigger, and there is no room left for further improvements of the design, as the 16f876 is completely  full. there is also no way to use the icd debugger, as this one consumes some memory too.
>
>as further compression of the code is impossible, I wonder if there is an easy way to replace the 16f876 (28 pin pdip) with anything bigger. I think this has to be something from the 18fxxx family.
>
>is there a fully pin and function compatible device, that allows me to replace the controller 'in the field', without touching the board?
>
>my design uses all pins as digital i/o's and has an icd interface.
>
>thank you for your help!
>tino
Look at the 18F series - as well as more flash, the instruction set and lack of paging should allow
some code size reductions as well.

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2004\06\03@052058 by Jason S

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I was going to suggest the 18F252, so I just looked it up.

It has 16k *bytes* of instruction memory, and with a 16 bit instruction
word, that translates to 8k words of instruction memory, exactly the same as
the 16F876.

As far as I can tell there are no PICs with more than 8k words of
instruction memory.

Jason


> {Original Message removed}

2004\06\03@052307 by hael Rigby-Jones

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>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Michael Rigby-Jones" <@spam@Michael.Rigby-JonesKILLspamspamBOOKHAM.COM>
>> To: <KILLspamPICLISTKILLspamspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
>> Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2004 1:59 AM
>> Subject: Re: [PIC:] drop in replacement for pic 16f876
>>
>> The 18F252 is pin compatible apart from the low voltage programming
>> pin
>> (PGM) which was moved from pin 24 on the 16F876 to pin 26 on
>the 18F252
>> part.  Not a problem if you don't use low voltage
>programming however.
>>
>> The part has 16K words of program memory.  Note you will have to use
>> the ICD2 debugger, the original ICD does not support the 18F parts.

>{Original Message removed}

2004\06\03@052308 by hael Rigby-Jones

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{Quote hidden}

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2004\06\03@052720 by hael Rigby-Jones

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>-----Original Message-----
>From: Jason S [picEraseMEspam.....CANADASPEAKS.COM]
>Sent: 03 June 2004 10:24
>To: EraseMEPICLISTspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU
>Subject: Re: [PIC:] drop in replacement for pic 16f876
>
>As far as I can tell there are no PICs with more than 8k words
>of instruction memory.

Forgot to add: Several PICs have more than 8K words, e.g. the 18F6620 has
32K words and the 18F6720 has 64K words.

Regards

Mike




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2004\06\03@054209 by Jason S

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Yep you're right.  I even have a bunch of 18F252's I bought from Steve
Kosmerchock, so I feel like my instruction space just doubled  :)  My
crystals for them are still on order (I'm too used to the chips with an
internal oscilator, I didn't even think to order crystals) so I haven't had
a chance to play with them.

I'm looking forward to the 1536 ram bytes more than the instruction space.
I'm working with a 2x24 LCD off a 12F675, and I'm using 48 bytes as a
scratch space for the LCD.  With only 64 bytes of ram in the chip, that's
hard to do.

Jason

{Original Message removed}

2004\06\03@060531 by hael Rigby-Jones

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{Quote hidden}

Yep, the extra RAM is certianly very usefull.  Makes programming much less
stressfull when you don't need to scratch around to find the last few bytes
you need!

Remember the 18F also has the RC oscillator option so you can get up and
running with a couple of components from the junk box if frequency
accuracy/stability isn't a prime concern.

Regards

Mike




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2004\06\03@060740 by tin=22?=

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any idea how the document, describing code porting from 16f to 18f pics is called?
I couldn't find something like that at microchip.
thanx!
tino

******************************************************************************************************

>{Original Message removed}

2004\06\03@063307 by Omer YALHI

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Check out AN716 - Migrating designs from PIC16C74A/74B to PIC18C442

I can email the pdf (369Kb) if needed.

Regards,

Omer

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2004\06\03@063307 by hael Rigby-Jones

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>-----Original Message-----
>From: "Bühler, Martin" [KILLspamMartin.BuehlerspamBeGonespamKEYMILE.COM]
>Sent: 03 June 2004 11:07
>To: EraseMEPICLISTspamEraseMEMITVMA.MIT.EDU
>Subject: Re: [PIC:] drop in replacement for pic 16f876
>
>
>any idea how the document, describing code porting from 16f to
>18f pics is called? I couldn't find something like that at
>microchip. thanx! tino
>
>***************************************************************
>***************************************

AN716 Migrating Designs from PIC16C74A/74B to PIC18C442 www.microchip.com/stellent/idcplg?IdcService=SS_GET_PAGE&nodeId=1824&
appnote=en011722

Obviously this dosen't cover any flash memory specific operations such as
table writes, but the general architecture and instruction set of the 18C is
essentialy the same as the 18F parts.

Regards

Mike




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2004\06\03@082757 by Roy J. Gromlich

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====================

The document is #AN716 -- Migrating Designs from PIC16C74A/74B to PIC18C422

The 18F and 18C are "almost" identical - they are so close that you should
not be aware of differences in normal use.

Note that the 18F/C chips have "many" great features in addition to the increased code and file space - a real stack and some truly usefully new
instructions, as well as a flat (non-paged) program memory model. Alas
the files are still banked, but there are easy ways to get around that.

You will need to tweak your code to use the new capabilities, but unless you
are using very obscure coding tricks it shouldn't take a serious redesign.
I ran into a dead end using the 16F parts last year and switched to the 18C452.
I had the old code running on the 18C in one afternoon, although I spent the rest of the week tuning and rewriting to make use of the new chip options.

Roy J. Gromlich



-- Original Message --
From: "Bühler, Martin" <.....Martin.Buehlerspam_OUTspamKEYMILE.COM>
To: TakeThisOuTPICLIST.....spamTakeThisOuTMITVMA.MIT.EDU
Send: 2004-06-03
Subject: Re: [PIC:] drop in replacement for pic 16f876

any idea how the document, describing code porting from 16f to 18f pics is
called?
I couldn't find something like that at microchip.
thanx!
tino

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