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PICList Thread
'[OT]Re: Price and availability of PIC parts'
2000\02\28@214344 by l.allen

picon face
> This territorial model needs to die, and get
> rebuilt into a client model. IMNSHO. :)

My vote for very good suppliers go to Maxim, TI, Microlinear, SGS-
Thomson and Dallas.
Sure some sent a rep around to check up, thats fine, I dont mind
that but they still came up with the samples and were helpful.


_____________________________

Lance Allen
Technical Officer
Uni of Auckland
Psych Dept
New Zealand

http://www.psych.auckland.ac.nz

_____________________________

2000\02\29@074638 by Alan Pearce

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The problem for New Zealanders wanting to get National Semiconductor parts is as
follows: natsemi used to have a very good distributor in NZ, but they canned
using this distributor in the early to mid 1980's. The then gave the
distributorship to another company. This company is very similar to Radio Shack
in that it is a hobbyist electronics store staffed with young people who know
minimal about chips. Please note here that I am not setting out to denigrate
these stores, they do serve a useful purpose and I have bought stuff from them,
sometimes they are the easiest or only source of what you want. The problem
arose with them being the nation wide distributor, they never had any stock,
they didn't know what the chips you wanted were, in short the source of every
difficulty you could imagine. If the chip you wanted was not a bog standard op
amp or TTL chip, they did not have it. Now NatSemi wonder why NZ "abuses" the
sample handouts.

When the original distributor of NatSemi parts had the agency they were always
my first port of call to get a chip, and they generally had it, or the staff
were well informed and new what you were talking about, and could tell you if
they would ever get the chip. Not so now. Ah well, thats progress for you.

2000\02\29@080309 by Andrew Hooper

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Allan,

I agree!.

I went on a search for a panasonic voltage trigger (1381j) and found nothing
over here, I then went looking for other alternatives and turned up one from
RS, and
that was not in stock and the price they were charging for the $2 component
was $8.40
and i bet that was EX GST to.

Farnell are a little better but still OVERLY EXPENSIVE for their product, a
good example
was a 1Farad gold cap, these should only be around $6 to $8, they sell them
for $17 to $18
i think we are getting the short end of the stick!

Bring back some of the older suppliers, atleast we got service and not some
sales
person who has no idea what a resistor is, there also was a time when the
people
employed by DSE knew a little about electronices, bbut again thats a thing
of the past.

If you ever find a reasonable supplier of SC's please keep me in mind and
let me know :)

Regards
Andrew

I dont mind waiting a couple of days for product
{Original Message removed}

2000\02\29@172811 by Jinx

face picon face
> The problem for New Zealanders wanting to get Nat Semi

The positon with NS at the moment is -- Avnet  are the "official"
rep for NS, they also do Microchip, Motorola, OKI, Seiko, and many
other of the larger mftrs. If you aren't an account holder you have to
deal with a company called Spectron. NS used to be done by
Hardie Technologies (HarTech) until they folded and their agencies
were grabbed by other reps around town, such as Avnet. I used to
deal with HarTech a lot, as they also had Microchip. I switched to
Microchip (1) because I got fed up with non-flash Mot parts and (2)
got fed up with the system at Avnet. HarTech were always helpful,
like Philips, and I could get samples no trouble. However, I can't say
the same for Avnet. They're much more company-orientated and
quite frankly they're not interested in small buyers. The original
intention of Spectron was to collate and compile small orders that
they would then approach the reps with. What's happening now,
and for some time, is that even Spectron will push you for a tube
quantity. As a consequence I've turned to Arrow Components, who
are prepared to sell a part-tube quantity and will get you samples.
The alternative is going somewhere like RadioSpares, who will
charge you 4 times the price for micros or RAM. Retail stores
like Dick Smith or Jaycar just don't have those sort of components
and besides, I wouldn't trust half the staff there to sit the right way
around on a toilet. My last last last resort is a Dick Smith store.
Amongst other horror stories, twice I've taken faulty goods back
there and seen them put back on the shelf. If you think I'm bagging
Avnet in particular, spot on. No, I don't like their sales policies or
being dicked around by them carrying out said policies.

Even Philips have passed their range on to another company,
Active Components, who BTW do a good job with cash sales,
as do Arrow and GEC for Atmel. Parallel importing seems to have
eased the situation somewhat, but not all mftrs have alternate
outlets.

I don't want to go complaining about every component rep I've had
the rough end of the pineapple from. Suffice it to say I think some
of their policies are not helpful to developers. I'm reluctant to try
new designs as I know the sort of trouble I'm going to get in trying
to find a sample. So often I don't bother, or patch something up out
of available components. I can't afford to keep an account going at
every rep I MIGHT want samples from one day. I appreciate the
"economy of scale", but I can't see why they make it difficult or
impossible to buy 3 or 4 items. For example I'm just not prepared
to have to buy a tube of chips and have most left unused for some
time. The way I figure it, if I was in that business I'd rather make
SOME sale than none at all. In the time they spent explaining to
me why they can't sell me 1/2 dozen micros they could have taken
my money for them. And of course I'm not going back for a larger
quantity if I can't get experimental samples in the first place.

> Ah well, thats progress for you.

Progress as defined by the bean-counters maybe


'[OT]Re: Price and availability of PIC parts'
2000\03\01@041852 by Peter Crowcroft
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<x-rich><fontfamily><param>Arial</param><color><param>0000,0000,ffff</param>rom:
 Jinx <<spam_OUTjoecolquittTakeThisOuTspamCLEAR.NET.NZ>

Subject: Re: [OT]Re: Price and availability of PIC parts


This is a RANT


>------------------------

> The problem for New Zealanders wanting to get Nat Semi


>The positon with NS at the moment is -- Avnet  are the "official"

rep for NS, they also do Microchip, Motorola, OKI, Seiko, and many


<<snip>

charge you 4 times the price for micros or RAM. Retail stores

like Dick Smith or Jaycar just don't have those sort of components

and besides, I wouldn't trust half the staff there to sit the right way

around on a toilet. My last last last resort is a Dick Smith store.



>

I don't want to go complaining about every component rep I've had

the rough end of the pineapple from. Suffice it to say I think some

of their policies are not helpful to developers. I'm reluctant to try

new designs as I know the sort of trouble I'm going to get in trying

to find a sample. So often I don't bother, or patch something up out

my money for them. And of course I'm not going back for a larger

quantity if I can't get experimental samples in the first place.


> Ah well, thats progress for you.


Progress as defined by the bean-counters maybe

</color></fontfamily>>----------------


You know this type of complaining really gets to me!


By being on this list YOU are face to face with the exponentially
increasing explosion in knowledge happening today. Yet you want the world
in new Zealand to stay as it was in the 1960's with a fully equiped
DSE/Jaycar down the street with 104 monoblocks in a choice of .1" or .2"
pitch.  Get real.  If you want to live in a backwater for electronic
hardware development then accept that there is an increasing cost. Kids
today are not going into electronics as they did in the 1960's - they are
playing Quake.


Think 'world'.


Do as I do.


1. Buy from the USA for ICs in bulk. Here are the places:


start with:

http://www.semiresources.com/

ic makers then find distributors


I use:

http://www.nuhorizons.com/

http://www.digikey.com/

http://www.arrow.com/

http://www.future.ca/

http://www.future.ca/1033/fai/

http://www.marshall.com/

http://www.hh.avnet.com/parts_master/query.html

http://www.ied.pios.com/


I have my credit card with 2 of them. I email and the goods come UPS,
FedEx, DHL.


No, dont complain to me about the high cost of couriers. You get your
goods in 3 days almost guaranteed. Post offics - 3-4 weeks for
'Airmail'.



2. For IC samples: cultivate some friends in the USA with picture books
of NZ sheep, yacht races and Queenstown mountains in return for samples
as requested.



3. For small numbers of passive components: yes this is a problem. Here
is Hong Kong everything is available just 300 yards away (Apliu St, Sham
Shui Po.)  I think I will start to offer components again for sale.
Payment in $US cash currency notes sent to me.  More on that later.



Rant finished......



regards,


Peter Crowcroft

                   DIY Electronics (HK) Ltd

               PO Box 88458, Sham Shui Po, Hong Kong

Voice: 852-2720 0255   Fax: 852-2725 0610    Email: .....peterKILLspamspam@spam@kitsrus.com

                      Web: http://kitsrus.com

----------------------------------------------------------------------

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2000\03\01@054802 by Andrew Hooper

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<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Peter,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Would be nice if NZ Credit Cards were widely accepted to
:)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>I don't hold one, usually try and make O/S transactions via
EFT</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>but on occasion I have had access to a company CC and it
has</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>been declined because its not internationally
recognized.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>As far as DSE and the likes go, these businesses hire
SALES</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>people to fulfil a semi technical position, I have seen more
than</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>my share of them handling static sensitive IC's without using
any</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>static protection at all.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>The other problem we have over here is that whenever we try
and</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>purchase product from the US we are met with comments
like</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>&quot;Contact out Australasion Agent&quot; then we do so and
they inform</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>us that either the minimum qty is a whole tube (and they
don't</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>supply samples), or &quot;sorry we don't carry
that&quot;.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>And YES I would leave if I had half the chance :)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2></FONT><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Still could be worse, McDonalds could start
selling Chips.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Anyone want to swap some Sheep Photos for a
selection of</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT><FONT size=2>Panasonic 1381 Voltage
Triggers :)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Regards</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2>Andrew</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">
   <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><B>{Original Message removed}

2000\03\01@060106 by mike

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On Wed, 1 Mar 2000 11:27:51 +1300, you wrote:

>> The problem for New Zealanders wanting to get Nat Semi
>
>The positon with NS at the moment is -- Avnet  are the "official"
>rep for NS, they also do Microchip, Motorola, OKI, Seiko, and many
>other of the larger mftrs. If you aren't an account holder you have to
>deal with a company called Spectron. NS used to be done by
>Hardie Technologies (HarTech) until they folded and their agencies
>were grabbed by other reps around town, such as Avnet. I used to
>deal with HarTech a lot, as they also had Microchip. I switched to
>Microchip (1) because I got fed up with non-flash Mot parts and (2)
>got fed up with the system at Avnet. HarTech were always helpful,
>like Philips, and I could get samples no trouble. However, I can't say
>the same for Avnet. They're much more company-orientated and
>quite frankly they're not interested in small buyers.
Same in the UK - I had to talk them into accepting my order for
UKP2,000 on a cash-with order basis!
> If you think I'm bagging
>Avnet in particular, spot on. No, I don't like their sales policies or
>being dicked around by them carrying out said policies.
I would never use Avnet except as a last resort - they're hopeless -
the mountain of paperwork that arose from a couple of faulty returned
items was unbelievable ! An assembly subcontractor I know that buys
huge amounts of components will only deal with Avnet as a very last
resort!

2000\03\01@071121 by Andrew Kunz

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If you are in another country and need something available in the US, you really
should contact Mark Willis (one of the PICLIST demi-gods).  He does a lot of
shipping of this sort.

Andy

2000\03\01@073641 by Russell McMahon

picon face
Peter said -

> If you want to live in a backwater for electronic hardware development
then accept that there is an increasing cost. Kids today are not going into
electronics as they did in the 1960's - they are playing Quake.


and I say

Hey !!!
I'm in New Zealand!
You get some good designs coming out of NZ.
The best companies usually end up being bought out by US firms :-).
Note that a laaaaarge US GPS maker does most of its work here.
A large international wheelchair controller maker does likewise.

I'm currently reading email at  11pm instead of getting on with the overdue
program I'm developing for a company in Taiwan (Z8 based I'm afraid :-)).
NZ is OK for development but yes, there are some unenlightened suppliers.

I have good luck finding SOME who understand about international markets and
design here, build there, sell somewhere else. On the current job the local
agents for Zilog (REC Electronics (were GEC)) have been very helpful even
though the manufacture will be in Taiwan. They deserve a small plug here.

The trouble I have found with Avnet VSI is that the front end is DESIGNED to
be impenetrable to the small buyer and the front-end doesn't understand the
idea of a designer who doesn't buy in bulk. They are fine if you buy mega
dollars of parts from them (or so I'm told). There are some good capable
friendly people there but they are not accessible unless you have an account
and an "in" with them.

I use the net for much comparative pricing. Get Taiwan to provide pricing
when I'm near my target parts.
Thanks for the list of useful suppliers and information sources though.



regards


       Russell McMahon

2000\03\01@142951 by l.allen

picon face
>.  If you want to live in a backwater for electronic hardware development
>then accept that there is an increasing cost.

> 2. For IC samples: cultivate some friends in the USA with picture
> books of NZ sheep, yacht races and Queenstown mountains in
> return for samples as requested.
>
>
Apart from being.....wrong.......and insulting you have missed the
point.

Many suppliers are great(like Maxim, Dallas etc) the original
comment/complaint was that someone said National are a good
company to deal with... I have experiences to the contrary.
Parts are not expensive here... just sometimes hard to get from
some suppliers.

You are very misinformed if you think NZ is a hardware
development backwater. On a per capita basis, despite piss poor
gov policies there is some advanced work going on here.
Little old things like world leading inductive power transfer, world
leading flat motor designs, world leading automotive lead acid
battery deign, world leading ION implantation... yes you're PICs
(and all of Intel etc) are made with NZ ion implantation technology
the list could go on but I think I have said enough.
There are some people on the PICLIST from NZ who are leading in
their field as well.

_____________________________

Lance Allen
Technical Officer
Uni of Auckland
Psych Dept
New Zealand

http://www.psych.auckland.ac.nz

_____________________________

2000\03\01@171007 by Russell McMahon

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   <DIV><FONT size=2>&gt; Would be nice if NZ Credit Cards were widely accepted
   to :)</FONT></DIV>
   <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
   <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT><FONT color=#000000 size=2>I use BNZ VISA for
   international purchases - usually UA, UK, Australia. I've never had a
   problem with it. </FONT></DIV>
   <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT><FONT color=#000000 size=2>I assume all NZ VISAa
   would work as well and no doubt eg American Express.</FONT></DIV>
   <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
   <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
   <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
   <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
   <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Russell McMahon</FONT></DIV>
   <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
   <DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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