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'[OT]Latest On " My Personal Paypal Horror Story"'
2006\11\12@131948 by Bob Axtell

face picon face
We got our money back from Paypal, but they are not forthcoming
about how it happened, or why Paypal assisted the con artist in
trying to defraud us. We are amazed it got that far, considering:

1. That paypal account had never been an Ebay seller; in fact, Lois
NEVER sold anything on Ebay before.

2. The paypal account had been dormant for almost a year, used for
trinket purchases only.

3. The CC Paypal used was cancelled by us a year ago. But our bank
claims it was never cancelled (yet it was destroyed in the presence of
bank personnel when we cancelled it).

_Somebody_ owes us $250 in overdraft charges. I am going after Paypal
first, Ebay 2nd, and our bank, 3rd.

--Bob
 

2006\11\12@135021 by Richard Prosser

picon face
On 13/11/06, Bob Axtell <spam_OUTengineerTakeThisOuTspamneomailbox.com> wrote:
> We got our money back from Paypal, but they are not forthcoming
> about how it happened, or why Paypal assisted the con artist in
> trying to defraud us. We are amazed it got that far, considering:
>
> 1. That paypal account had never been an Ebay seller; in fact, Lois
> NEVER sold anything on Ebay before.
>
> 2. The paypal account had been dormant for almost a year, used for
> trinket purchases only.
>
> 3. The CC Paypal used was cancelled by us a year ago. But our bank
> claims it was never cancelled (yet it was destroyed in the presence of
> bank personnel when we cancelled it).
>
> _Somebody_ owes us $250 in overdraft charges. I am going after Paypal
> first, Ebay 2nd, and our bank, 3rd.
>
> --Bob
>

Go after all 3 - you might make up enough to cover your time &
inconvienience :-)

RP

2006\11\12@192505 by Gerhard Fiedler

picon face
Bob Axtell wrote:

> 3. The CC Paypal used was cancelled by us a year ago. But our bank
> claims it was never cancelled (yet it was destroyed in the presence of
> bank personnel when we cancelled it).

Sounds that your bank should have to do some explaining. After all, that's
where you canceled it. If they had done that, everything would be fine.
Since they didn't do it, anybody charging to that old number could have
done you harm.

FWIW, I think that most banks deal with such cancellations in a really
irritating shoddy way. The minimum should be a cancellation confirmation in
writing, together with a statement that shows that the account had a 0
balance. With such a confirmation in hands, it should be easy to prove that
any charges to that account are not your business anymore.

Gerhard

2006\11\12@214003 by David VanHorn

picon face
>
>
> FWIW, I think that most banks deal with such cancellations in a really
> irritating shoddy way. The minimum should be a cancellation confirmation
> in
> writing, together with a statement that shows that the account had a 0
> balance. With such a confirmation in hands, it should be easy to prove
> that
> any charges to that account are not your business anymore.


Given that the card was cancelled, I think it's the bank that's on the hook
here.
They allowed an improper transaction.

Back in the 70s, I had an account that was closed without me knowing about
it (missed the notice when we moved). The bank took a deposit to the account
though, and then bounced all the checks I wrote.
In the end, the bank manager wrote letters to each place I had written a
check, explaining that it was their fault, and they paid all charges.

2006\11\13@035818 by Alan B. Pearce
face picon face
>We got our money back from Paypal, but they are not forthcoming
>about how it happened, or why Paypal assisted the con artist in
>trying to defraud us. We are amazed it got that far, considering:
>
>1. That paypal account had never been an Ebay seller; in fact, Lois
>NEVER sold anything on Ebay before.
>
>2. The paypal account had been dormant for almost a year, used for
>trinket purchases only.
>
>3. The CC Paypal used was cancelled by us a year ago. But our bank
>claims it was never cancelled (yet it was destroyed in the presence of
>bank personnel when we cancelled it).
>
>_Somebody_ owes us $250 in overdraft charges. I am going after Paypal
>first, Ebay 2nd, and our bank, 3rd.

The thing that puzzles me about this whole transaction, is why you haven't
bounced eBay and Paypal on the eBay item number. Surely the item number that
he claims was sold to him has to have a traceability in eBays archive that
would show that it wasn't you selling it.

Even after eBay take an item off their web pages they still have records
that are available to police agencies. If they are not going to produce
evidence of the item number to you, then threaten to make a police complaint
regarding fraud, in this case I guess it would come under the American Wire
Fraud regulations, and possibly crosses state boundaries, so ...

2006\11\13@043033 by peter green

flavicon
face

> Given that the card was cancelled, I think it's the bank that's
> on the hook
> here.
> They allowed an improper transaction.
right but if they have no record (or if they have a record but refuse to reveal it) then it becomes your word against theres.



2006\11\20@135548 by M Graff

flavicon
face
Gerhard Fiedler wrote:
> Bob Axtell wrote:
>
>> 3. The CC Paypal used was cancelled by us a year ago. But our bank
>> claims it was never cancelled (yet it was destroyed in the presence of
>> bank personnel when we cancelled it).
>
> Sounds that your bank should have to do some explaining. After all, that's
> where you canceled it. If they had done that, everything would be fine.
> Since they didn't do it, anybody charging to that old number could have
> done you harm.
>
> FWIW, I think that most banks deal with such cancellations in a really
> irritating shoddy way. The minimum should be a cancellation confirmation in
> writing, together with a statement that shows that the account had a 0
> balance. With such a confirmation in hands, it should be easy to prove that
> any charges to that account are not your business anymore.

US banks (cc cards at least) can keep accounts open literally forever.
I had an account I closed because someone had used it for lots of small
charges around the US.  For nearly 5 years after someone was still using
the numbers, and the account would "re-open" -- or worse, they would try
to transfer the card's uses to my new card.

Clearly, something is broken there.  And I did have (in writing) that
the account was closed.  And that no new charges would be accepted.  But
legally, they can open accounts that I continue to use -- they just have
a very open definition of "I" that seems to mean "anyone".

--Michael

2006\11\20@155736 by Gerhard Fiedler

picon face
M Graff wrote:

> US banks (cc cards at least) can keep accounts open literally forever. I
> had an account I closed because someone had used it for lots of small
> charges around the US.  For nearly 5 years after someone was still using
> the numbers, and the account would "re-open" -- or worse, they would try
> to transfer the card's uses to my new card.
>
> Clearly, something is broken there.  

Yup... seems to be obvious, at least to anyone not working in a bank :)

> And I did have (in writing) that the account was closed.  And that no new
> charges would be accepted.  But legally, they can open accounts that I
> continue to use [...]

Isn't that a contradiction? Having in writing that they won't accept new
charges, and then them being "legally" able to still accept charges? Where
does the "legally" come from?

Gerhard

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