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'[OT] The more things change, the more they stay th'
2009\02\06@002758 by solarwind

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Hey all, what does the quote "'The more things change, the more they
stay the same." mean to you?

--
solarwind

2009\02\06@053052 by cdb

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face
There's now't new in this world!

No matter what frills are added to any situation, the basics are the same now as they were a zillion years ago.

Colin

:: Hey all, what does the quote "'The more things change, the more
:: they
:: stay the same." mean to you?
--
cdb, spam_OUTcolinTakeThisOuTspambtech-online.co.uk on 6/02/2009

Web presence: http://www.btech-online.co.uk  

Hosted by:  http://www.1and1.co.uk/?k_id=7988359

D





2009\02\06@070657 by Vitaliy

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"cdb" wrote:
> There's now't new in this world!

I had a conversation with another Christian about this quote from the book
of Ecclesiastes ("there is nothing new under the sun"). He kept insisting on
a literal interpretation -- "yes, there were jet planes", "yes, there were
cars". The usual arguments -- "How come there are no artefacts, where are
the ancient airports?" produced even more fantastic theories. So I finally
suggested that following this logic, Christ must have come to Earth more
than once, and the Second Coming must have happened at least once before.

This probably is a good illustration of my tendency to "seek the truth", at
the expense of maintaining good relations with people. Carnegie would not
approve. :-(

Vitaliy

2009\02\06@072042 by Tony Smith

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> "cdb" wrote:
> > There's now't new in this world!
>
> I had a conversation with another Christian about this quote from the book
> of Ecclesiastes ("there is nothing new under the sun"). He kept insisting
on
> a literal interpretation -- "yes, there were jet planes", "yes, there were
> cars". The usual arguments -- "How come there are no artefacts, where are
> the ancient airports?" produced even more fantastic theories. So I finally
> suggested that following this logic, Christ must have come to Earth more
> than once, and the Second Coming must have happened at least once before.


Huh.  So WWJD does mean "What would Jesus drive?" after all.

Or maybe he subscribes to the 'Big Bang' / 'Big Crunch' cycle.

Tony

2009\02\06@075608 by solarwind

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Please, refrain from false/christian/religious interpretations on this thread :)

Thank you!

2009\02\06@094742 by Gökhan SEVER

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This depends on where you are looking from...

Am I moving, or is the background moving?

Go see yourself:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-uQ3DGOL9Y&feature=PlayList&p=5E40900772B4EFEE&index=3

2009/2/6 solarwind <.....x.solarwind.xKILLspamspam@spam@gmail.com>

> Hey all, what does the quote "'The more things change, the more they
> stay the same." mean to you?
>
> --
> solarwind
> -

2009\02\06@101155 by solarwind

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Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose.

2009\02\06@122544 by Rolf

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solarwind wrote:
> Hey all, what does the quote "'The more things change, the more they
> stay the same." mean to you?
>
>  
I liken it to the saying "The only thing constant is change."

Rolf

2009\02\06@153419 by Gerhard Fiedler

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solarwind wrote:

> Hey all, what does the quote "'The more things change, the more they
> stay the same." mean to you?

What most or all other respondents said is that this basically means
that things change and always will change. I think that it is a bit
different. Saying that things will always change doesn't create a
relationship between more change and more staying the same.

It is often the change (in some things) that shows us what didn't
change. For example, you move to a different country, get a different
girlfriend, adopt a different religion (or management style :) -- but
you'll find that you and your basic problems remain the same, mostly.

So maybe this quote expresses the idea that it is the change that
emphasizes the common characteristics, of which life itself is one...

Gerhard

2009\02\07@103553 by John Ferrell

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I think you set this up in your original question. I offer the following
observations:
Because a very old writing that has endured the test of time happens to be
included in the Bible does not make it exclusively "religious". It is
generally attributed to Solomon but there is no solid evidence to support
this.

In our pursuit of knowledge we are imposing artificial limitations if we
choose to ignore the things that we consider to be religious in nature.

As I get older I have noticed that every thing that changes is either cyclic
or can be represented as a vector. I wonder if the vector becomes cyclic if
it is observed through long enough time.

I feel the aging process is leading me to a more generalized view of the
world as well as the conclusion that Ecclesiastes said it best and is the
oldest writing we have addressing the subject. Of course, it too is part of
the cycle of knowledge and therefore was likely known before this fellow
called Solomon preserved it in writing or whatever...

We all agree to not pursue religious discussions here because they soon
degenerate into personal issues and become detrimental to the common good.

If that makes little or no sense, just consider it evidence of my creeping
senility!

John Ferrell  W8CCW

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do
nothing." -- Edmund Burke
http://DixieNC.US


----- Original Message -----
From: "solarwind" <x.solarwind.xspamKILLspamgmail.com>
To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." <.....piclistKILLspamspam.....mit.edu>
Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 7:56 AM
Subject: Re: [OT] The more things change, the more they stay the same.


> Please, refrain from false/christian/religious interpretations on this
> thread :)
>
> Thank you!
> --

2009\02\07@122358 by solarwind

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I asked this quest because I had to write some sort of an essay on it.
I did a lot of research and finally wrote it. Not a bit of religion at
all.

2009\02\07@122439 by solarwind

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This quote was by a french dude and originally it was: Plus ca change,
plus c'est la meme chose and it was written in some journal in the
1800s.

2009\02\07@123356 by Sean Breheny

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On Sat, Feb 7, 2009 at 10:39 AM, John Ferrell <EraseMEjohnferrellspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTearthlink.net> wrote:
> In our pursuit of knowledge we are imposing artificial limitations if we
> choose to ignore the things that we consider to be religious in nature.
>

Very well said.

Sean

2009\02\07@133411 by solarwind

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On Sat, Feb 7, 2009 at 12:33 PM, Sean Breheny <shb7spamspam_OUTcornell.edu> wrote:
> In our pursuit of knowledge we are imposing artificial limitations if we
> choose to ignore the things that we consider to be religious in nature.

Give me an example..


--
solarwind

2009\02\07@152929 by Tony Smith

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> Please, refrain from false/christian/religious interpretations on this
thread :)
>
> Thank you!


Don't you mean the Agile thread?

Tony

2009\02\07@161849 by Peter Onion

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On Fri, 2009-02-06 at 18:33 -0200, Gerhard Fiedler wrote:
> solarwind wrote:
>
> > Hey all, what does the quote "'The more things change, the more they
> > stay the same." mean to you?
>
> What most or all other respondents said is that this basically means
> that things change and always will change. I think that it is a bit
> different. Saying that things will always change doesn't create a
> relationship between more change and more staying the same.
>
> It is often the change (in some things) that shows us what didn't
> change. For example, you move to a different country, get a different
> girlfriend, adopt a different religion (or management style :) -- but
> you'll find that you and your basic problems remain the same, mostly.
>
> So maybe this quote expresses the idea that it is the change that
> emphasizes the common characteristics, of which life itself is one...
>
> Gerhard

It's a translation of the French saying "Plus ca change, plus c'est la
meme chose"

I think it means that despite people trying to change things, in the
long run they make no difference.   I've also seen it said that it's
similar to saying "history repeats it self".

PeterO

 

2009\02\07@162036 by Peter Onion

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face

On Sat, 2009-02-07 at 10:39 -0500, John Ferrell wrote:

> In our pursuit of knowledge we are imposing artificial limitations if we
> choose to ignore the things that we consider to be religious in nature.

We chose to ignore them here so that history does does repeat itself !

PeterO


2009\02\08@171038 by John Ferrell

face picon face
This is one of my favorite items of interest:
http://www.bibleplaces.com/heztunnel.htm

A mix of history, archeology and religion. Someone achieved a very
complicated success with very limited tools. They must have been smarter
than we are today!

We are on the edge here, hopefully the context will help avoid conflict.
John Ferrell  W8CCW

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do
nothing." -- Edmund Burke
http://DixieNC.US


{Original Message removed}

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