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'[OT] Teasing new users (was: MPLAB in Linux - Chec'
2009\01\08@121216 by M. Adam Davis

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I occasionally teased other users by telling them to press "+" three
times quickly on the BBS. "+++" is a modem command to switch from data
to command mode, and they would be left in their terminal with

+++
OK

While the modem awaited their next command.

Not much different than telling newbies to get some headlamp fluid to
fix their headlight problem on their car in a car forum, or the myraid
of jokes to be played on new electronic enthusiasts...

-Adam

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 6:42 PM, Tamas Rudnai <spam_OUTtamas.rudnaiTakeThisOuTspamgmail.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

>> --

2009\01\08@122357 by Harold Hallikainen

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> I occasionally teased other users by telling them to press "+" three
> times quickly on the BBS. "+++" is a modem command to switch from data
> to command mode, and they would be left in their terminal with
>
> +++
> OK

Long ago, I designed a telemetry system that allowed the user to program
it in Basic. A television network in Canada used this system to watch
their transmitter sites. In this particular installation, they used
dial-up modems that normally carried data for display, printing, and
storage on a hard drive at the control point. But, they could also upload
new code to the system through the modem. That new code included a PRINT
"+++" as part of the modem control code. Sometimes, this line would drop
the modem in to command mode during an upload. So, we had to change it to
PRINT "+";"+";"+"

Harold


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2009\01\08@154054 by solarwind

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Press F10 in counter strike source to activate aimbot.

2009\01\08@174622 by Sean Breheny

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That is a bit strange since AFAIK, the sequence has to be +++ followed
by nothing for at least 1 second. I guess that could happen if
something delayed the file transfer at exactly the right point. Also,
this should only affect the modem which is sending the new code, not
the (remote) receiving site.

Sean


On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 12:25 PM, Harold Hallikainen
<@spam@haroldKILLspamspamhallikainen.org> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2009\01\08@180147 by Alex Harford

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On Thu, Jan 8, 2009 at 2:35 PM, Sean Breheny <KILLspamshb7KILLspamspamcornell.edu> wrote:
> That is a bit strange since AFAIK, the sequence has to be +++ followed
> by nothing for at least 1 second. I guess that could happen if
> something delayed the file transfer at exactly the right point. Also,
> this should only affect the modem which is sending the new code, not
> the (remote) receiving site.

Perhaps a delay due to XMODEM checksum?

2009\01\08@182055 by William \Chops\ Westfield

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On Jan 8, 2009, at 2:35 PM, Sean Breheny wrote:

> That is a bit strange since AFAIK, the sequence has to be +++ followed
> by nothing for at least 1 second.

The original hayes modems required a one-second pause on BOTH sides of  
the escape sequence.  But not all the clones were that smart.  (Also,  
IIRC, Hayes got a patent for that particular bit of cleverness  
(deservedly so?), so the more careful clone vendors (if there is such  
a thing) may have left it out intentionally.)

BillW

2009\01\08@184826 by Harold Hallikainen

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> That is a bit strange since AFAIK, the sequence has to be +++ followed
> by nothing for at least 1 second. I guess that could happen if
> something delayed the file transfer at exactly the right point. Also,
> this should only affect the modem which is sending the new code, not
> the (remote) receiving site.
>
> Sean


I agree, the 1 second dead time should have taken care of it. The remote
site was echoing what it received, so it could drop that to command mode
and our code at the remote site was then not running, so nothing worked.
We DID have the remote modem set to autoanswer, so we were able to
recover.

Harold



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2009\01\09@042551 by Alan B. Pearce

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>Not much different than telling newbies to get some
>headlamp fluid to  fix their headlight problem on
>their car in a car forum, or the myraid of jokes
>to be played on new electronic enthusiasts...

or the apprentice sent to the store for a long wait, or striped paint or ...

One store I heard of got fed up with apprentices being sent for striped
paint, so when the next one turned up, the conversation went something like
this ...

"What colours does the boss want?"

"Don't know, he didn't say"

"Well, would white and green be OK?"

"yeah, i guess so"

OK, wait there, I'll go get a pot for you to check".

Assistant disappears out back of store, comes back with pot, and pries lid
off. Inside pot is white paint with green stripes, where some green has been
started to be mixed in.

Money changes hands, apprentice takes paint back, only boss is not to0
pleased to find he is now out of pocket with a can of paint that is
effectively useless for anything.

But the one that amused me, when I started my apprenticeship the guy I was
assigned to had a father who had been a builder. Their standard trick was to
send the apprentice down to the local hardware store for a bastard file.
Apprentice would get to said shop only to find pretty curvaceous woman
behind counter. Now this being in the immediate prewar period, there was no
way he was going to ask a woman for that type of file, so she knowing
exactly what he had been sent down there for, would send him back with every
type of file but the correct one. I believe the said apprentice would spent
practically all day going back and forth without getting the correct file.

2009\01\09@052736 by Jinx

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> Not much different than telling newbies to get some headlamp
> fluid to  fix their headlight problem on their car in a car forum,
> or the myraid of jokes to be played on new electronic enthusiasts...

Ours in the resin plant was to get the new lab rat out there with a
tape to measure the oil length *. Direct them to the bulk soy tanks
and leave them to it. Then wait for the factory manager to tell them
to get the hell down from there

* oil length is actually the ratio of oil to resin in eg paint base, not
the depth of oil in a tank

As a new lab rat once upon a time, I may or may not have been got.
Let's just say I know what the top of the factory manager's head looks
like

2009\01\09@062044 by Thomas C Sefranek

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Jinx" <RemoveMEjoecolquittTakeThisOuTspamclear.net.nz>
To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." <spamBeGonepiclistspamBeGonespammit.edu>
Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 6:26 AM
Subject: Re: [OT] Teasing new users (was: MPLAB in Linux - Check it Out!)


>> Not much different than telling newbies to get some headlamp
>> fluid to  fix their headlight problem on their car in a car forum,
>> or the myraid of jokes to be played on new electronic enthusiasts...
>
>From my tour in VIetnam with heliocopters:
Send the new guy to get a can of prop wash.
Send the new guy to get a can of azmuth.
(The supply hut guys were all "in" on this and would re-direct the new guy
to another supply hut, as they had just run out...)
(They actually had a washing compound, and when the guy would return with
that,... "No, you want the spray can of prop wash...")
Have the new guy "compression start" the "Heli" by running the blade.
Replace the resistor "direction of  color bands", so the current would flow
correctly.

 *
 |  __O    Thomas C. Sefranek  TakeThisOuTtcsEraseMEspamspam_OUTcmcorp.com
 |_-\<,_   Amateur Radio Operator: WA1RHP
 (*)/ (*)  Bicycle mobile on 145.41, 448.625 MHz

ARRL Instructor, Technical Specialist, VE Contact.
hamradio.cmcorp.com/inventory/Inventory.html
http://www.harvardrepeater.org

2009\01\09@062400 by cdb

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When I worked in a supermarket, the meat room would get their trainee
butchers to ask the meat manager for left handed 's' hooks or the
favourite, was to be told to ask someone for a long weight, as a
carcass would need balancing. They would dutifully ask for one,
whereupon  they would be told ' wait there, I'll go and get you one ',
after about 15 minutes one of the managers would by accident stroll by
to find out why they weren't working, normally as they tried to
explain it would dawn on them what had just happened.

I suppose these days, people wouldn't take it as a joke or initiation
ceremony, but as work place bullying or harassment.

Colin
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Web presence: http://www.btech-online.co.uk  

Hosted by:  http://www.1and1.co.uk/?k_id=7988359







2009\01\09@063124 by Jinx

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> I suppose these days, people wouldn't take it as a joke or initiation
> ceremony, but as work place bullying or harassment.

Yeah, got "grievance" written all over it

2009\01\09@081924 by Carl Denk

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In junior high school (grades 7 and 8) metal shop class, the standing
one was to as for a left handed prostitute. The grey haired teacher who
retired a year or so later, would chuckle quietly. (This had to been in
1951). :)

cdb wrote:
{Quote hidden}

2009\01\09@113233 by Herbert Graf

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On Thu, 2009-01-08 at 17:35 -0500, Sean Breheny wrote:
> That is a bit strange since AFAIK, the sequence has to be +++ followed
> by nothing for at least 1 second. I guess that could happen if
> something delayed the file transfer at exactly the right point. Also,
> this should only affect the modem which is sending the new code, not
> the (remote) receiving site.

Unfortunately not all modems were designed as well as others. Many
modems would enforce this "delay around the +++ rule", some however
didn't.

I distinctly remember one cheaper modem that would react to a +++
without much of a delay around it. Very annoying.

TTYL

2009\01\09@125130 by Paul Hutchinson

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> -----Original Message-----
> From: EraseMEpiclist-bouncesspammit.edu On Behalf Of William "Chops"
> Westfield
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 6:21 PM
>
> On Jan 8, 2009, at 2:35 PM, Sean Breheny wrote:
>
> > That is a bit strange since AFAIK, the sequence has to be
> +++ followed by nothing for at least 1 second.
>
> The original hayes modems required a one-second pause on BOTH
> sides of the escape sequence.  But not all the clones were that smart.
>  (Also, IIRC, Hayes got a patent for that particular bit of cleverness  
> (deservedly so?), so the more careful clone vendors (if there
> is such a thing) may have left it out intentionally.)
>
> BillW

The guard time was adjustable using the modem's S12 register, the default
was 1 second but it could be set from 0 to 5.1 seconds.

Paul


2009\01\09@141015 by Harold Hallikainen

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> On Thu, 2009-01-08 at 17:35 -0500, Sean Breheny wrote:
>> That is a bit strange since AFAIK, the sequence has to be +++ followed
by nothing for at least 1 second. I guess that could happen if
>> something delayed the file transfer at exactly the right point. Also,
this should only affect the modem which is sending the new code, not
the (remote) receiving site.
>
> Unfortunately not all modems were designed as well as others. Many
modems would enforce this "delay around the +++ rule", some however
didn't.
>
> I distinctly remember one cheaper modem that would react to a +++
without much of a delay around it. Very annoying.
>


I THINK Hayes may have had a patent on delay+++delay .  Yep, here it is.
It's claim 1 in http://www.pat2pdf.org/pat2pdf/foo.pl?number=4549302 .

Harold



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2009\01\12@210616 by Vitaliy

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"Harold Hallikainen" wrote:
>> I distinctly remember one cheaper modem that would react to a +++
> without much of a delay around it. Very annoying.
>>
>
>
> I THINK Hayes may have had a patent on delay+++delay .  Yep, here it is.
> It's claim 1 in http://www.pat2pdf.org/pat2pdf/foo.pl?number=4549302 .

Harold, you are amazing. Were you a patent clerk, or a librarian in another
life? :)  How did you manage to find this patent?

If you will excuse my total ignorance, may I ask what is a "claim"? I see
where they talk about the "command mode" in the Abstract, but the sections
are numbered 1-20.

Vitaliy

2009\01\12@223019 by Harold Hallikainen

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> "Harold Hallikainen" wrote:
>>> I distinctly remember one cheaper modem that would react to a +++
>> without much of a delay around it. Very annoying.
>>>
>>
>>
>> I THINK Hayes may have had a patent on delay+++delay .  Yep, here it is.
>> It's claim 1 in http://www.pat2pdf.org/pat2pdf/foo.pl?number=4549302 .
>
> Harold, you are amazing. Were you a patent clerk, or a librarian in
> another
> life? :)  How did you manage to find this patent?
>
> If you will excuse my total ignorance, may I ask what is a "claim"? I see
> where they talk about the "command mode" in the Abstract, but the sections
> are numbered 1-20.
>
> Vitaliy

Nope... My experience with patents is not very deep. In general I think I
know a little about a lot. In this case, the little turned out to be
something of interest.

The "claim" is what the inventor claims is his/her invention and allows no
one else to use during the term of the patent. The claims are what the
patent actually protects. Everything else is background. The "silence" +++
silence" claim is in column 17 line 26 through 35.

Thanks!

Harold

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2009\01\12@233126 by Vitaliy

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"Harold Hallikainen" wrote:
> The "claim" is what the inventor claims is his/her invention and allows no
> one else to use during the term of the patent. The claims are what the
> patent actually protects. Everything else is background. The "silence" +++
> silence" claim is in column 17 line 26 through 35.

Thanks, now I don't feel so bad for missing that part when I skimmed through
the document. I think I would have missed it even if I read through the
whole thing.

"means, operative when said modem is in said transparent mode of operation,
for detecting provision of said predetermined sequence of said data signals,
and for causing said modem to switch to said command mode of operation, if
an only if said predetermined sequence of data signals occurs contiguous in
time with at least one said occurrence of said passage of said predetermined
period of time during which none of said data signals are provided to said
data input port"


2009\01\13@000120 by Harold Hallikainen

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{Quote hidden}

Yes, patents are surely a model of clarity!

Harold

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2009\01\13@021814 by Jinx

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> Yes, patents are surely a model of clarity!

I wrote up a technical, functional and applications description for a
business partner. 3 pages + diagrams. I assumed he was going to
submit it as is to the NZPO for $60. But he gave it to his lawyer -
a veterinarian turned patent attourney. I have no idea if he's passed
the bar or just set himself up as a self-styled "expert". $2000 (not
mine, thankfully, as everyone except me lost interest) and a dozen
extra pages later I couldn't make head nor tail of it. Seriously.
Gobbledy-gook from go to whoa, which IMVH-IANAL-O added
next to nothing to the original

2009\01\13@050214 by apptech

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> Yes, patents are surely a model of clarity!

Yes, that is indeed the intention. Clarity, however, does not necessarily
vequate to good reading.



R


2009\01\13@092907 by Tamas Rudnai

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> I THINK Hayes may have had a patent on delay+++delay .  Yep, here it is.
> It's claim 1 in http://www.pat2pdf.org/pat2pdf/foo.pl?number=4549302 .

...and from now we are triple the damage ...

Tamas


On Fri, Jan 9, 2009 at 7:11 PM, Harold Hallikainen
<RemoveMEharoldEraseMEspamEraseMEhallikainen.org>wrote:

{Quote hidden}

> -

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