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'[OT] Old Computers'
1999\12\27@131653 by Sean Breheny

face picon face
Hi all,

Does anyone know of a good company (preferably on the web, but not
necessarily) who sells oldish computer systems (used is OK) cheap? I'm
talking about,say, 166MHz Pentiums, etc. with no monitor, but which include
ram and possibly hard drive? I'm looking to spend in the ballpark of $100.
I have seen several sites which have outrageous prices (about $250 -
$350!!!) for such a system. You could get a barebones celeron for that
price! I must be searching the wrong way.

I have a friend who has a really old Pentium 90 which has recently
developed problems and he can't afford a new computer right now.

Thanks,

Sean


|
| Sean Breheny
| Amateur Radio Callsign: KA3YXM
| Electrical Engineering Student
\--------------=----------------
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1999\12\27@132906 by Peter Schultz

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face
That is what they try to do, and somehow they all the time find people how
does not think
and will pay for it at ridiculous price.
I was checking used laptops for programming PIC's in the garage. I was
looking
for a minimum system to run MPLAB in Windows, B&W screen ....
Every place I was searching was over $600. They were 5-6 years old laptops
with 386 processors....
You can have a new Pentium II nice laptop for $1200. When I mentioned this
the answer was if you like take it,
if you do not like it ...
       PeterS

1999\12\27@134201 by Andy Kunz

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face
>talking about,say, 166MHz Pentiums, etc. with no monitor, but which include
>ram and possibly hard drive? I'm looking to spend in the ballpark of $100.

Sean, that sounds like my current desktop machine!

Andy

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1999\12\27@135238 by Sean Breheny

face picon face
Hi Andy,

You work without a monitor?! <G>

Are you saying that I am setting too low a goal price? Well, I though I had
heard of people getting machines like this for this price range. I'm pretty
sure it could be done at a hamfest or computer show with a good number of
used vendors. Unfortunately, I don't know of any nearby the near future.

As a matter of fact, it wouldn't matter much if it didn't have a hard
drive, I'm pretty sure his problems are not hard drive related,so we could
just reuse his drive. SO, I am just looking for case/ps, MB, CPU, and 16 to
32 MB ram.

Sean

At 01:35 PM 12/27/99 -0500, you wrote:
{Quote hidden}

| Sean Breheny
| Amateur Radio Callsign: KA3YXM
| Electrical Engineering Student
\--------------=----------------
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1999\12\27@142408 by Dan Creagan

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As far as too low a goal price for a computer:

I just bought four 386/40 laptops with 12-16 meg of RAM and 80-120 meg hard
drives, 2400 modems, monochrome, and external power supplies for $5.00 each.
All are working.  I have seen fully rigged 486/66 machines (32 meg of RAM,
CD, monitor, etc, etc) for less than $70.  My students usually look for
Pentium 75s in the $75 to $125 category. If it is $125 then it has to be
rigged with something special (like lots of memory, color monitor, and/or
tower case). The last time I saw a P75 sold (last week) it went for $75 -
but no monitor.

I used to make my own low end computers for classrooms, demos, and testing.
I don't anymore. They are just too cheap to buy.  Best Buy (discount
department store) was selling 400s with just about everything on them  (32
meg, CD, sound, 3 gig hard drive, blah, blah) for $350 just before
Christmas - it doesn't make sense to buy a used computer with prices like
that.

Dan

>
> Are you saying that I am setting too low a goal price? Well, I though I
had
> heard of people getting machines like this for this price range. I'm
pretty
> sure it could be done at a hamfest or computer show with a good number of
> used vendors. Unfortunately, I don't know of any nearby the near future.
>
> As a matter of fact, it wouldn't matter much if it didn't have a hard
> drive, I'm pretty sure his problems are not hard drive related,so we could
> just reuse his drive. SO, I am just looking for case/ps, MB, CPU, and 16
to
> 32 MB ram.
>
> Sean
>
> At 01:35 PM 12/27/99 -0500, you wrote:
> >>talking about,say, 166MHz Pentiums, etc. with no monitor, but which
include
> >>ram and possibly hard drive? I'm looking to spend in the ballpark of
$100.
{Quote hidden}

1999\12\27@142411 by Andy Kunz

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face
>You work without a monitor?! <G>

Not any more.  I just figured out how to get NTSC 256 color out of a PIC <G>

>Are you saying that I am setting too low a goal price? Well, I though I had

No, my desktop box is a 166, my home machine is a 133, my laptop is a 233
(but it's slower than a 90 because it's running 98 (for a little while
longer)).

Andy

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1999\12\27@145144 by Mike Tennent

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face
On Mon, 27 Dec 1999 13:17:03 -0500, you wrote:

>Hi all,
>
>Does anyone know of a good company (preferably on the web, but not
>necessarily) who sells oldish computer systems (used is OK) cheap? I'm
>talking about,say, 166MHz Pentiums, etc. with no monitor, but which include
>ram and possibly hard drive? I'm looking to spend in the ballpark of $100.
>I have seen several sites which have outrageous prices (about $250 -
>$350!!!) for such a system. You could get a barebones celeron for that
>price! I must be searching the wrong way.
>
>I have a friend who has a really old Pentium 90 which has recently
>developed problems and he can't afford a new computer right now.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Sean
>

Lurker, unlurking.

Check out http://www.intellesale.com/

Under their "Specials" category you might find what you're looking for.

Mike Tennent

1999\12\27@145735 by William Chops Westfield

face picon face
You can probably find a 166 MHz computer for ~$100 IF you can find the
original seller to buy it from.  Once you have to allow for the "cut" of
some agency to buy, test, and store the system (plus shipping), you almost
always end up above that price point.

BillW

1999\12\27@152228 by Mark Willis

flavicon
face
I've been offered P100's about 1 year ago at that sort of price, can
probably get you a P166 for that sort of numbers, Sean;  One local
store's good for this.

Checked, Ack, lost Cell service here, called my cell provider, etc.
(WHY are things always breaking here!  <G>)  He may have parts there, he
wanted me to call back later on - if your friend can get a case locally,
it'd be at least $10 cheaper to ship just a momboard & cards from here.
Probably can find you the rest of those parts here, pretty readily, for
$80ish.  Let's talk off-list if you want to go for it.  Worst case, I
can "gut" one machine here, I've been wanting to upgrade it to a K6-3
anyways <G>

Seattle's a GOOD place to find used hardware.

 Mark

Sean Breheny wrote:
{Quote hidden}

--
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(For private individuals at cost; ask.)

1999\12\27@201435 by Darren Logan

picon face
Try computer geeks at:

http://www.compgeeks.com/

1999\12\27@204824 by paulb

flavicon
face
William Chops Westfield wrote:

> You can probably find a 166 MHz computer for ~$100 IF you can find the
> original seller to buy it from.  Once you have to allow for the "cut"
> of some agency to buy, test, and store the system (plus shipping), you
> almost always end up above that price point.

 Do you guys have "Garage Sales" over there?
--
 Cheers,
       Paul B.

1999\12\27@231202 by Brian Kraut

picon face
We used to get a lot of refurbished laptops cheap at work.  Try Compact Works.
Also, http://www.sharplaptop.com.  You can also search refurbished laptops on Yahoo.  I
agree that a hamfest is the best place.  I just got a pentium 100 with 32 megs of
ram, 800 meg HD and monitor for $75.00.  They had 6 tables full of them.  No, I
don't have a name or adress.

Sean Breheny wrote:

{Quote hidden}

1999\12\27@231614 by quozl

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face
On Mon, Dec 27, 1999 at 08:13:47PM -0500, Darren Logan wrote:
> http://www.compgeeks.com/

Hrm, very interesting.
486 Desktop System, Preassembled, $54.
http://www.compgeeks.com/cgi-bin/details.asp?cat=CobwebCorner&sku=205-0486

Bookmarked.

--
James Cameron   EraseMEquozlspamspamspamBeGoneus.netrek.org   http://quozl.us.netrek.org/

1999\12\27@235436 by Mark Willis

flavicon
face
For that matter, see this link;

http://www.allelec.com/
486DX2/66 Barebones Slim Desktop w/ Built in VGA, 1.44 FD, 8MB RAM ==>
$49.00
NEC 486SX25 Upgradable to DX2/66 System - 1.44FD - VGA - I/O ==> $29.00

Something to look at <G>

 Mark

James Cameron wrote:
{Quote hidden}

--
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(For private individuals at cost; ask.)

1999\12\28@002404 by Jim Paul

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face
Do you mean Compaq Works?

                               Jim
-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Kraut <engaltSTOPspamspamspam_OUTEARTHLINK.NET>
To: spamBeGonePICLISTSTOPspamspamEraseMEMITVMA.MIT.EDU <KILLspamPICLISTspamBeGonespamMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Date: Monday, December 27, 1999 10:12 PM
Subject: Re: [OT] Old Computers


>We used to get a lot of refurbished laptops cheap at work.  Try Compact
Works.
>Also, http://www.sharplaptop.com.  You can also search refurbished laptops on
Yahoo.  I
>agree that a hamfest is the best place.  I just got a pentium 100 with 32
megs of
>ram, 800 meg HD and monitor for $75.00.  They had 6 tables full of them.
No, I
>don't have a name or adress.
>
>Sean Breheny wrote:
>
>> Hi Andy,
>>
>> You work without a monitor?! <G>
>>
>> Are you saying that I am setting too low a goal price? Well, I though I
had
>> heard of people getting machines like this for this price range. I'm
pretty
>> sure it could be done at a hamfest or computer show with a good number of
>> used vendors. Unfortunately, I don't know of any nearby the near future.
>>
>> As a matter of fact, it wouldn't matter much if it didn't have a hard
>> drive, I'm pretty sure his problems are not hard drive related,so we
could
>> just reuse his drive. SO, I am just looking for case/ps, MB, CPU, and 16
to
>> 32 MB ram.
>>
>> Sean
>>
>> At 01:35 PM 12/27/99 -0500, you wrote:
>> >>talking about,say, 166MHz Pentiums, etc. with no monitor, but which
include
>> >>ram and possibly hard drive? I'm looking to spend in the ballpark of
$100.
{Quote hidden}

1999\12\28@082247 by Edson Brusque

face
flavicon
face
> Not any more.  I just figured out how to get >NTSC 256 color out of a PIC
<G>

   Wow! Can I ask HOW???

   Best regards,

   Brusque
Brusque

___________________________________________________________________________
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1999\12\28@091449 by John Pfaff

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face
I was running a 133 MHz Pentium at work until a few weeks ago.  The finally
upgraded me to a 233 MHz Pentium II (still no sound card - drat).

{Original Message removed}

1999\12\28@164857 by quozl

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face
On Mon, Dec 27, 1999 at 11:06:45PM -0600, Jim Paul wrote:
> Do you mean Compaq Works?

Do they??

(Context: I worked for Digital, we were bought out by Compaq)

--
James Cameron   .....quozlspamRemoveMEus.netrek.org   http://quozl.us.netrek.org/

1999\12\28@165857 by paulb

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face
John Pfaff wrote:

> I was running a 133 MHz Pentium at work until a few weeks ago.  The
> finally upgraded me to a 233 MHz Pentium II (still no sound card -
> drat).

 Which points out the simple fact as we all knew anyway that unless you
are in CAD design, you *don't* need the latest, whiz-bang 650 MHz
machine for work (including PIC programming) at all.

 Such machines are primarily - for games.  Multimedia, if you like to
call it that; entertainment.  Games in general.  Pretty animations on
the Internet.  DVD movies.  Games.
--
 Cheers,
       Paul B.

1999\12\28@194119 by Howard McGinnis

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face
My partner was telling me of a place that has $59 P90 systems. I can ask
where that was....

Howard
Howard McGinnis
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1999\12\29@005452 by Keelan Lightfoot

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>  Which points out the simple fact as we all knew anyway that unless you
>are in CAD design, you *don't* need the latest, whiz-bang 650 MHz
>machine for work (including PIC programming) at all.

What about desktop publishing, programming, computer artwork, etc.
I do like a faster computer for PIC programming too. A faster computer
*really* helps out with slow simulations.
Also, with programming, my horrible method of compile, crash, restart,
modify, compile... likes to be done on a faster computer too :>

My brother is in the desktop publishing business, and *trust me*, a faster
computer IS needed :)

- Keelan Lightfoot

>  Such machines are primarily - for games.  Multimedia, if you like to
>call it that; entertainment.  Games in general.  Pretty animations on
>the Internet.  DVD movies.  Games.
>--
>  Cheers,
>        Paul B.

1999\12\29@013354 by quozl

flavicon
face
On Tue, Dec 28, 1999 at 10:51:38PM -0700, Keelan Lightfoot wrote:
> My brother is in the desktop publishing business, and *trust me*, a faster
> computer IS needed :)

He's probably keeping up with the latest slow software then.

Coders who are given fast computers generate slow code.

--
James Cameron   TakeThisOuTquozlspamspamus.netrek.org   http://quozl.us.netrek.org/

1999\12\29@023417 by William Chops Westfield

face picon face
Yeah.  The major reason for faster computers is that "state-of-the-art"
software in ANY area keeps getting slower...

Damn huge GUIs...

(also, by the time you need a new disk and more memory in your computer,
it's probably easier to simply get a whole new computer, from a support
point of view...)

BillW

1999\12\29@132937 by Keelan Lightfoot

flavicon
face
>On Tue, Dec 28, 1999 at 10:51:38PM -0700, Keelan Lightfoot wrote:
>> My brother is in the desktop publishing business, and *trust me*, a faster
>> computer IS needed :)
>
>He's probably keeping up with the latest slow software then.

If he doesn't keep up with 'the latest slow software' then he will have
problems with files that clients are sending to him. This is really only a
problem with Xpress...

The software isn't slow. When you start working with a full page 11x17 600
DPI image in photoshop, the extra processor clout sure comes in handy.

>Coders who are given fast computers generate slow code.

I disagree. I do all my programming work on a fast computer, then every so
often, compile and send the file over to a slower computer (this 100 MHz
thing, for example, or a 16 MHz SE/30) and test the software to see how I
could speed it up.

- Keelan Lightfoot

1999\12\31@005425 by Sean Breheny

face picon face
Hi all,

Thanks for all your help on the old computers question. I am going to ask
my friend what he wants to do.

Sean

At 11:27 AM 12/29/99 -0700, you wrote:
{Quote hidden}

| Sean Breheny
| Amateur Radio Callsign: KA3YXM
| Electrical Engineering Student
\--------------=----------------
Save lives, please look at http://www.all.org
Personal page: http://www.people.cornell.edu/pages/shb7
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1999\12\31@015652 by Mark Willis

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Keelan Lightfoot wrote:
{Quote hidden}

Good enough for me <G>

The point in "Coders who are given fast computers generate slow code."
being that, if you only have a "super-machine", you'd not be motivated -
or ABLE - to realistically speed test the code.  It's an excuse to not
Beowulf all my machines, I think <G>

I once wrote a Windows 3.x app that was designed to run on a 386sx33+,
4+mb Ram, etc.;  My boss got a 386sx16 laptop with 2Mb RAM given to him,
and wanted to see if my app would even load.  It did, no crashes,
connected to the embedded controller simulator properly (we were
off-site), and ran rather well, I thought.  Yep, it was SLOW, paged the
heck out of the HDD too.  To me, it was pretty rewarding to see that
thing run at ALL, though.  Especially compared to how unstable and
cruddy the code had been when I inherited it <G>  If I'd only run &
tested it on one machine, it wouldn't have done that.

(Learned this habit from writing code that can eat the FAT / file
system, but it works well) - I always Compile on a faster Development
machine, and test on a slower "testbed" machine, and keep another
machine or two around for various things like note-taking, formatting a
Floppy while testing new "patch" code, for example - then when the patch
is done I can pop the code onto that floppy across the LAN here & be
done in less time.  And, no notes CAN get lost, as they're on the aux
machines' HDD.  Some of those developers who only use one P3-750 (or
whatever) machine get to thinking that everyone else has 256Mb RAM in
their machine too, and they're flat wrong.  (Others who just use one
machine, know better, I'm just "hooked" on multi-machine here.)

You can use a monitor sharing device, if you want, that's fair <G>

However you code, whatever resources you use - It's great to see others
dedicated to the art of software <G>

 Mark

--
I re-ship for small US & overseas businesses, world-wide.
(For private individuals at cost; ask.)

1999\12\31@022244 by piclist.com

face picon face
Any recomendations on a monitor switch? My machine closet has room for only
one monitor and now I have a new MS machine and I'm starting to work on
making the old one a Linux server. I'm going to wear this connector out
soon.

Is there a video card with an AUX input that will let you switch to another
machines output and back to the localy generated signal on hot key or
something?

James Newton
RemoveMEjamesnewtonEraseMEspamspam_OUTgeocities.com
1-619-652-0593 phone

----- Original Message -----
From: Mark Willis <@spam@mwillisRemoveMEspamEraseMEFOXINTERNET.NET>
To: <EraseMEPICLISTspam@spam@MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 1999 10:55 PM
Subject: Re: [OT] Old Computers


> You can use a monitor sharing device, if you want, that's fair <G>
>
>   Mark
>

1999\12\31@034915 by bill

flavicon
face
> Any recomendations on a monitor switch? My machine closet has room for only
> one monitor and now I have a new MS machine and I'm starting to work on
> making the old one a Linux server. I'm going to wear this connector out
> soon.

Have you tried VNC? It's a "remote control" program, sort of like a stripped
down PC Anywhere, but free and runs on multiple platforms. You can even access
a VNC server using just a java capable web browser when working from a machine
that has no VNC client installed.

You can get it here: http://www.uk.research.att.com/vnc/

For anyone who has two computers with two monitors, but would like
to operate both from one keyboard and mouse, there's a nifty little utility
called "x2vnc" in the "Contributed" section of that web site that passes mouse
and keyboard info from X on a *nix machine to a VNC server running on another
platform, but does not pass any display info back. The result is that the two
machines with two monitors running two different operating systems behave
almost like a single machine with two monitors. It always surprises onlookers
to see my mouse cursor pass smoothly between my two monitors when one is
displaying a KDE desktop (on Linux) and the other is a Win98 desktop.

I haven't tried controlling anything but a Win98 machine, but it should work
with any platform for which a VNC server is available (like Mac or Amiga).
The controlling machine has to be some flavor of Unix.

--
                                       Peace,
                                       William Kitchen
The future is ours to create.

1999\12\31@035742 by Mark Willis

flavicon
face
Belkin makes a switch, ~$100 sometimes locally, that lets you swap one
{Monitor, Keyboard, Mouse} between 6 different computers.

The best price I've seen for it new was in one of those flyers, about
$250, a local store may have one though for the $100ish numbers.

Shift-Ctrl-Alt-1 to pick machine 1, ..6 to pick #6, and they're
cascadable.  Watch for ground loops, of course;  Power these machines
off the same UPS/power strip for best luck.

Cybex makes another switch, $100ish for 2-port, $150ish for 4-port?
Aah, shopper.cnet.com has that line.  For all such machines, see
shopper.cnet.com/shopping/0-11738-301-0-0.html?tag=st.cn.11738-ron.bc.gp,
I guess LinkSys makes these as well.

ComputerGate sells such a beastie, as well, ATen Tech.

Of course, if you can afford M$ $oftware, you can afford to buy this
thing new, and gold-plate it <G>  (Inside joke, sorry folks.  Well, not
very sorry <G>)

Also, analog switches could be used "in a pinch" to switch video (Yes,
for only up to 1024x768 or so, not for some custom 2k x 1k ultra VGA
card <G>)

If all you want is to just swap the VGA signal, ComputerGate (among
others) has a cheap box that does that, Black Box makes some that're $15
locally all the time ("just add cables"), ComputerGate asks $8 for the
2-port and $9 for the 4-way unit.  If you go this way, do yourself a
favor, either:
(a)  Just switch monitors, don't switch the keyboard;  or,
(b)  Power the keyboard off a separate power lump so it doesn't go
brain-dead, snip the Vcc wires inside the switch;  or,
(c)  Power the keyboard off the Vcc wires inside the switch, using a
couple Schottky's and a Cap inside the box, so the keyboard doesn't go
brain-dead.

Only problem with (a) is when (not if!) you start typing on the wrong
keyboard, when on a different machine than you thought you were on;
That's why I like the Keyboard-Video-Mouse switch.  Use a large-ish cap
if you go with (c).

Never seen a video card like that, no, to answer that part <G>

 Mark

piclist.com wrote:
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