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PICList Thread
'[OT] OT discussions'
2007\07\04@151844 by Rich

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I very much enjoy the stimulating colloquy on this list.  There are very many intelligent and well informed people on the list and I continue to examine my ideas and learn more than engineering and technology here.  
   I have heard some complaints in the past about OT threads. It is my personal hope that they will never disappear.  We are all people no better or no worse than another.  It is a great opportunity that we have to listen to all corners of the world and interact intellectually with each other.  
   It is perhaps one of the most important aspects of civilization.  Whether we are nationalists or globalists we are all citizens of the world.  It puzzles me that so many perceive that nationalism can only exist at the expense of other nationals.  That is the old 19th century idea.  Today we can literally be both.  I believe that old prejudices are dissolving and more cooperation is replacing them.  
   

2007\07\05@031735 by Peter P.

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I think that OT discussions should be related to the group's subject. I.e. URLs
related to technology, employment (including visas and related material),
regulation, science and humor related to the topic of the group.

I also think that other political subjects should not occur if possible. In
fact, James has it in the rules (bylaws ?) of the group, 'no politics'. In
particular inflammatory subjects should be quenched fast.

There are 2000 people on this group and less than 1% participate actively on a
regular basis. I don't think that it's fair to drag the rest into usenet-style
flame-fests. After all, the usenet is still there for that.

I am guilty as charged for starting several OT threads, and I am aware of that,
and that's why I write this message.

So, I think that there should be an extra type of thread delimitation, not
necessarily a direct part of the group, where political flame-fests could be
organized. I was thinking about starting one of the free blogs and then posting
a single message in the group with the URL and the topic of the flame-fest. E.g.
someting along the lines of:

Subject: [POLITICS] We are discussing H1Bs and their fairness

url: http://someblog.blogspot.com

But this would be a type of hijacking of the group's attention. Of course anyone
from the piclist membership would be able to start a subject and participate
(blogs are password protected for writing).

Peter P.




2007\07\05@124101 by alan smith

picon face
and...there always is the delete key....used often....hmmm....probably should have used it here but....hey....I had a min to read it....
 
 And you never know what lil tidbit of info you come across.  Great for trivia games....

"Peter P." <spam_OUTplpeter2006TakeThisOuTspamyahoo.com> wrote:
 I think that OT discussions should be related to the group's subject. I.e. URLs
related to technology, employment (including visas and related material),
regulation, science and humor related to the topic of the group.

I also think that other political subjects should not occur if possible. In
fact, James has it in the rules (bylaws ?) of the group, 'no politics'. In
particular inflammatory subjects should be quenched fast.

There are 2000 people on this group and less than 1% participate actively on a
regular basis. I don't think that it's fair to drag the rest into usenet-style
flame-fests. After all, the usenet is still there for that.

I am guilty as charged for starting several OT threads, and I am aware of that,
and that's why I write this message.

So, I think that there should be an extra type of thread delimitation, not
necessarily a direct part of the group, where political flame-fests could be
organized. I was thinking about starting one of the free blogs and then posting
a single message in the group with the URL and the topic of the flame-fest. E.g.
someting along the lines of:

Subject: [POLITICS] We are discussing H1Bs and their fairness

url: http://someblog.blogspot.com

But this would be a type of hijacking of the group's attention. Of course anyone
from the piclist membership would be able to start a subject and participate
(blogs are password protected for writing).

Peter P.




2007\07\05@145755 by Vitaliy

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face
alan smith wrote:


> and...there always is the delete key....used often....hmmm....probably
> should have used it here but....hey....I had a min to read it....

I simply "mark as read" instead of delete, but the idea is the same. :)

Don't like it -- don't read it. Pick your battles, no reason to feel that
you have to respond to everything (talking to myself, mostly :)

2007\07\05@163204 by Peter P.

picon face
Vitaliy <spam <at> maksimov.org> writes:

Vitaliy, did you receive my private email a few days ago ?

thanks,
Peter P.



2007\07\05@182121 by Xiaofan Chen

face picon face
On 7/5/07, Vitaliy <.....spamKILLspamspam@spam@maksimov.org> wrote:
> I simply "mark as read" instead of delete, but the idea is the same. :)

It is quite easy to use Gmail or Yahoo mail to do this. But the stupid
Hotmail would not make it. It seems that Hotmail does not have
this function. Strange.

> Don't like it -- don't read it. Pick your battles, no reason to feel that
> you have to respond to everything (talking to myself, mostly :)
>

2007\07\05@192128 by Russell McMahon

face
flavicon
face
>I think that OT discussions should be related to the group's subject.
>I.e. URLs
> related to technology, employment (including visas and related
> material),
> regulation, science and humor related to the topic of the group.

You are welcome to think that.
But, as widely discussed on a number of past occasions, and as
explained in the FAQ, PICList has a wider scope for its OT tag. Those
who do not wish to be exposed to such are entirely welcome to not
subscribe to OT.

HOWEVER

> I also think that other political subjects should not occur if
> possible. In
> fact, James has it in the rules (bylaws ?) of the group, 'no
> politics'. In
> particular inflammatory subjects should be quenched fast.

that is indeed in the rules and it's up to James as to how much rope
he allows. It's notable that he generally allows more than the rules
suggest he will, but that one may be hung with the extra rope fairly
promptly when he personally decides the subject has been exhausted
:-).

> There are 2000 people on this group and less than 1% participate
> actively on a
> regular basis.

That sounds rather low. That's < 20.
But yes, participation varies.
BUT

> I don't think that it's fair to drag the rest into usenet-style
> flame-fests. After all, the usenet is still there for that.

James agrees with you thoroughly on that and there is no approved
place for flamefests here. They do try and spring up from time to time
but the hard and inviolable rule is that personal abuse will not be
tolerated.

> I am guilty as charged for starting several OT threads, and I am
> aware of that,
> and that's why I write this message.

Guilty of what?
OT is there for almost exactly what it is used for. If you have added
to the richness of this group as intended then you have done well.
Alternative energy research, Inkjet cartridge removal, Weeder style
counters, Google searches ... .
All fine topics.
Some should even argually be in [EE]: = Everything Engineering (eg the
Weeder question).

> So, I think that there should be an extra type of thread
> delimitation, not
> necessarily a direct part of the group, where political flame-fests
> could be
> organized.

No. No flame fests supported in any way :-).
BUT an invitation to mature conversation elsewhere would be allowab;le
(almost) even now.

These could be by email with NO formal group. *eg* IF you want to talk
about this send me emails with "xxyyz" in subject line and I'll send
all I get to all who send me such messages. But, starting a Yahoo etc
group would be easier.

> I was thinking about starting one of the free blogs and then posting
> a single message in the group with the URL and the topic of the
> flame-fest. E.g.
> someting along the lines of:
>
> Subject: [POLITICS] We are discussing H1Bs and their fairness
>
> url: http://someblog.blogspot.com

A blog. Even better.
BUT > Subject: [OT]: We are discussing H1Bs and their fairness

would do that well enough now

or  what I use (informally)

> Subject: [OT][WOT]  We are discussing H1Bs and their fairness

It's understood.
Or you could use:

   > Subject: [VITALIY]: We are discussing H1Bs and their fairness

:-)


       Russell

2007\07\05@214624 by Vitaliy

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face
"Peter P. wrote:
> Vitaliy <spam <at> maksimov.org> writes:
>
> Vitaliy, did you receive my private email a few days ago ?
>

Nope, I haven't received your PM. :(

I have SpamAssassin running on my mailbox, and although I regularly go
through the spam folder, it's entirely possible that I missed your message.

Can you try resending it to vitaliyspamKILLspammaksimov.org, and CC
.....vitaliyKILLspamspam.....scantool.net?

Thanks,

Vitaliy

2007\07\06@073733 by Gerhard Fiedler

picon face
Vitaliy wrote:

>> Vitaliy, did you receive my private email a few days ago ?
>
> Nope, I haven't received your PM. :(
>
> I have SpamAssassin running on my mailbox, and although I regularly go
> through the spam folder, it's entirely possible that I missed your
> message.

I think you can tell SpamAssassin to let pass messages that have a certain
word in the subject, which you could mention in a signature.

Gerhard

2007\07\06@151958 by Vitaliy

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face
Gerhard Fiedler wrote:
>>> Vitaliy, did you receive my private email a few days ago ?
>>
>> Nope, I haven't received your PM. :(
>>
>> I have SpamAssassin running on my mailbox, and although I regularly go
>> through the spam folder, it's entirely possible that I missed your
>> message.
>
> I think you can tell SpamAssassin to let pass messages that have a certain
> word in the subject, which you could mention in a signature.

Yes, you can also feed it spam and let it learn from false hits -- haven't
had time to play with that, though.

It turns out the default setting works just fine, I just accidentally marked
Peter's message as unread (and it didn't come up in my search, because he
used a different e-mail address).


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