Post by thread:[OT] How stuck is that PICcy in the window ?

(dreadfully limp pun) Hi, I need to mount an electronic display smack in the middle of a window. It weighs 240g, consisting of a PIC, PCB, thin plastic case, LEDs, bits and pieces of label etc etc. Measures 8" x 8" x 1/2 " The window is standard plate glass. The unit has to be fairly easily removable at any time, possibly by a ham-fisted counter-minder. Double-sided tape -- 4 pieces 10mm x 20mm, works OK, but I can't put too much more on or it'll look ugly, and I think the heat of the sun will get to it eventually Suckers -- 4 small (22mm), they're OK, but they'll dry up. These are wettable types, not bulb-pump. Are bulb-pump better ? One option I thought of is to suspend the unit from the top of the frame with thin black thread, to take the weight, and the sticking device just holds the unit to the glass (it HAS to be held), but aside from that no other attachment to the window is viable. Does anyone have ideas, especially any fluid that could be used with the suckers that's more or less permanent, like glycerine for example, or some other slow or non- evaporating liquid. TIA

Strong glue kind of Epoxy-Araldite or SuperGlue, attach 2 small hooks directly to the glass (3mm glue spot). Hung your board directly to the hooks (holes at each top corner of the board). Some of those glues can be easily removed from glass using a sharp rasor blade, some don't. Customer can use the hooks to hung something else later... or you can charge them to remove the hooks. :)

Liquid Latex will stick to glass and will function as a glue, when your finished it will just peel off without to many problems. If you can afford a 8-12hr cure time then Clear Silicone should also provide a good stick to glass and also will peel off with little effort, unlike latex this will not discolour in the sunlight. If you wanted to get really tricky you could mold the silicon with lots of depressions so it looks like the suckers on an octipuss tenticle, this would allow you to use the wet and stick principle. With suction cups you may like to try Water and Detergent, or a form of oil, Vasoline is another option, and will not dry out, BUT if you put to much on the item will have a tendancey to slide down the window. There are other glues aroung that will also do the job, you will just need to scrape them off later and you will have to watch that they dont fill the surface holes and imperfections on the glass. Regards Andrew {Original Message removed}

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Jinx, Sounds like a through glass keyboard??? 1. You didn't say whether you are allowed a wire etc from the unit to eg power supply (it may have inbuilt ;t power supply). If a wire is allowed then you COULD use an airpump to provide suction. Fishtank airpumps sell for around $NZ15 and have all the suck you need. They can be set for variable power (usually blow). While they are usually a bit noisy at full power they are reasonably quiet at lower powers. Power is adjusted by changing armature travel on a vibrator AFAIR, 2. You could GLUE it to the window with cyanoacrylate glues. These work quite well and the mess can (probably :-)) be cleaned off the window afterwards. I haven't checked for long term etching etc but Loctite have heaps of info on their site. Cyanoacrylates will NOT bond to alkaline substrates (such as glass) forever but WILL do it for a very long time. You'd have to check to see how they matched your need. Removal is easy enough. Due to the inflexible nature of the adhesive, levering the joint from the side places large stress and fails the adhesive progressively whereas normal application of force across the whole joint results in a VERY strong bond. Russell McMahon _____________________________ >From other worlds - http://www.easttimor.com http://www.sudan.com What can one man* do? Help the hungry at no cost to yourself! at http://www.thehungersite.com/ (* - or woman, child or internet enabled intelligent entity :-)) {Original Message removed}

>> Hi, I need to mount an electronic display smack in the middle of a >> window. It weighs 240g, consisting of a PIC, PCB, thin plastic case, >> LEDs, bits and pieces of label etc etc. Measures 8" x 8" x 1/2 " >> The window is standard plate glass. The unit has to be fairly easily >> removable at any time, possibly by a ham-fisted counter-minder. > You could GLUE it to the window with cyanoacrylate glues. There's a special kit for reattaching mirror mounts to automobile windshields. It's cyanoacrylate adhesive. I've seem some with a pre-cleaner (don't know if it just a cleaner or a mild echtant) as well as the glue. Less than 1 square inch will hold against road vibration and mirror adjustments for years. Removal shouldn't be too bad if you slide a razor blade between the glass and your unit. Lee Jones

On Thu, Feb 24, 2000 at 02:10:14PM +1300, Jinx wrote: > Hi, I need to mount an electronic display smack in the middle of a > window. It weighs 240g, consisting of a PIC, PCB, thin plastic case, > The window is standard plate glass. The unit has to be fairly easily > removable at any time, possibly by a ham-fisted counter-minder. The two requirements are at odds with each other. The first can be satisfied by using the glue that is used to stick rear-vision mirrors onto the inside of windscreens, but it is not easily removable. -- Clyde Smith-Stubbs | HI-TECH Software Email: spam_OUTclydeTakeThisOuThtsoft.com | Phone Fax WWW: http://www.htsoft.com/ | USA: (408) 490 2885 (408) 490 2885 PGP: finger .....clydeKILLspam@spam@htsoft.com | AUS: +61 7 3355 8333 +61 7 3355 8334 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- HI-TECH C: compiling the real world.

> On Thu, Feb 24, 2000 at 02:10:14PM +1300, Jinx wrote: > > > Hi, I need to mount an electronic display smack in the middle of a > > window. It weighs 240g, consisting of a PIC, PCB, thin plastic case, > > The window is standard plate glass. The unit has to be fairly easily > > removable at any time, possibly by a ham-fisted counter-minder. > > The two requirements are at odds with each other. The first can be > satisfied by using the glue that is used to stick rear-vision mirrors > onto the inside of windscreens, but it is not easily removable. Maybe he could glue a bracket to the window and clip the box to that. .

The unit is the base for an LED light chaser around an advertising poster. The LEDs are mounted on foam board, which is very light and no bother to hold up. The electronics have to be away from the poster, but can't always be on the floor or hidden somewhere else All of the suggestions are worth trying, and I could determine which work better in different circumstances, such as DS tape in windows that don't get direct sunlight, glues for more or less permanent installations. Even combinations, such as suckers + small spots of silicone. For the effect to be had, it's worth a little effort. I'll look into any differences between plate and automotive glasses, perhaps the superglues can be put to use in an auxilliary role, eg for the foam board. And I was glad to be reminded of the bracket idea, which came up once but I'd forgotten about. That would also make sense with the poster - slip it into a pocket rather than dismantle the chaser > 1. You didn't say whether you are allowed a wire etc from the unit > to eg power supply (it may have inbuilt power supply). There's an external 5V supply, a thin black two-core. I tried a battery + solar panel but (a) a good crystalline one is too heavy/expensive and (b) not many shop windows point upwards. None actually, so energy collection is not good The magnet idea is impractical for this window (I can imagine how many of the outside ones would be left in the morning) but coincidentally makes the best choice for another project I'm putting together that can be framed - the magnets can go inside I'll report back in a year or three

<x-flowed>If you use thread, get upholstery thread. Its the strongest stuff out there. Bill {Quote hidden}>From: Jinx <joecolquittKILLspamCLEAR.NET.NZ> >Reply-To: pic microcontroller discussion list <.....PICLISTKILLspam.....MITVMA.MIT.EDU> >To: EraseMEPICLISTspam_OUTTakeThisOuTMITVMA.MIT.EDU >Subject: [OT] How stuck is that PICcy in the window ? >Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 14:10:14 +1300 > >(dreadfully limp pun) > >Hi, I need to mount an electronic display smack in the middle of a >window. It weighs 240g, consisting of a PIC, PCB, thin plastic case, >LEDs, bits and pieces of label etc etc. Measures 8" x 8" x 1/2 " >The window is standard plate glass. The unit has to be fairly easily >removable at any time, possibly by a ham-fisted counter-minder. > >Double-sided tape -- 4 pieces 10mm x 20mm, works OK, but I can't >put too much more on or it'll look ugly, and I think the heat of the sun >will get to it eventually > >Suckers -- 4 small (22mm), they're OK, but they'll dry up. These are >wettable types, not bulb-pump. Are bulb-pump better ? > >One option I thought of is to suspend the unit from the top of the frame >with thin black thread, to take the weight, and the sticking device just >holds the unit to the glass (it HAS to be held), but aside from that no >other attachment to the window is viable. Does anyone have ideas, >especially any fluid that could be used with the suckers that's more or >less permanent, like glycerine for example, or some other slow or non- >evaporating liquid. > >TIA ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com </x-flowed>

<x-flowed>I do believe it is stronger than dental floss. It also comes in flat black so that it disappears against a dark background. It also works great for floating things in the dark for halloween. Bill {Quote hidden}>From: James Newton <@spam@jamesnewtonKILLspamPICLIST.COM> >Reply-To: KILLspamjamesnewtonKILLspampiclist.com >To: RemoveMEPICLISTTakeThisOuTMITVMA.MIT.EDU >Subject: Re: [OT] How stuck is that PICcy in the window ? >Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 09:11:52 -0800 > >Stronger than dental floss? > >--- >James Newton spamBeGonejamesnewtonspamBeGonegeocities.com 1-619-652-0593 >http://techref.massmind.org NEW! FINALLY A REAL NAME! >Members can add private/public comments/pages ($0 TANSTAAFL web hosting) > > >{Original Message removed}

Hey, what about fishing line? Or...that rubbery stuff companies use to hold the flap of their trial CD cover closed? Regards, Tim Hamel In a message dated 2/24/00 9:45:22 AM Pacific Standard Time, TakeThisOuTamberscreamsEraseMEspam_OUTHOTMAIL.COM writes: > I do believe it is stronger than dental floss. It also comes in flat black > so that it disappears against a dark background. It also works great for > floating things in the dark for halloween. > > Bill > >

...thinking better, I would use silicone glue spots, one in each corner, 8 to 10mm in diameter, it would hold pretty good your 200g device. I remember silicone glue can be found in clear, black or white colors, so you choose the one that goes better with your board. If the unit should be removed sometimes, probably I would go to glue some small hook pins with silicone to the glass, and hung the board to the hooks.

On Fri, Feb 25, 2000 at 02:43:09AM +1300, Jinx wrote: > into any differences between plate and automotive glasses, perhaps > the superglues can be put to use in an auxilliary role, eg for the > foam board. And I was glad to be reminded of the bracket idea, which Warning: some CA glues will *eat* some types of foam. If you want to examine that route, make sure you do some testing with the foam and CA glue beforehand. (oh yeah - CA is the common abbreviation for cyanacrolyte [I *think* I spelled that right] which is the most common superglue) An adhesive that might also be worth looking into is the stuff used to glue rearview mirrors onto the windshields of cars. I know absolutely nothing about them, but it popped into my mind as a possibility. After all, that stuff *is* designed to attach items on a permanent basis to glass. -- Mike Werner KA8YSD | "Where do you want to go today?" ICQ# 12934898 | "As far from Redmond as possible!" '91 GS500E | Morgantown WV | Only dead fish go with the flow.

<x-flowed>I used some of that fishing line and it is strong. It's also expensive and a little shiny. The shiny part is the killer, the upholstry thread is completely flat black. Bill {Quote hidden}>From: William Chops Westfield <RemoveMEbillwTakeThisOuTCISCO.COM> >Reply-To: pic microcontroller discussion list <PICLISTEraseME.....MITVMA.MIT.EDU> >To: EraseMEPICLISTMITVMA.MIT.EDU >Subject: Re: [OT] How stuck is that PICcy in the window ? >Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 17:51:48 PST > > ... get upholstery thread. Its the strongest stuff out there. > >Not any more. If strength is required with minimum visibility, I'd look >for >some of the advanced polymer fishing lines (kevlar, spectra, etc.) >Stronger >than steel, you know... > >BillW ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com </x-flowed>