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'[OT] Ebay brokerage'
2005\08\09@130451 by PicDude

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Hi all,

I am about to purchase an item on Ebay, but have a reason to distrust the
seller.  I intend to pay with Paypal, but not sure that I have any easy
protection in case of probelms.  I would like to know if there are any safe
3rd party brokerage services that I can use for a small fee to protect me if
the item isn't as described.

BTW, I ask here cause I haven't found anything known trustable yet and I know
the topic of Paypal and Ebay has been discussed here before.

Cheers,
-Neil.


2005\08\09@132027 by Spehro Pefhany

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At 12:05 PM 8/9/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>Hi all,
>
>I am about to purchase an item on Ebay, but have a reason to distrust the
>seller.  I intend to pay with Paypal, but not sure that I have any easy
>protection in case of probelms.  I would like to know if there are any safe
>3rd party brokerage services that I can use for a small fee to protect me if
>the item isn't as described.
>
>BTW, I ask here cause I haven't found anything known trustable yet and I know
>the topic of Paypal and Ebay has been discussed here before.
>
>Cheers,
>-Neil.

I would suggest just not buying if you distrust the seller.

There are escrow services but not many people use them, or are willing to
use them. Some have been exposed as fakes (ripping off the seller).

If you decide to go ahead, a credit-card funded paypal payment is probably
your best bet for relatively small amounts. If the seller won't accept that,
head for the exit.

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
spam_OUTspeffTakeThisOuTspaminterlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com
->> Inexpensive test equipment & parts http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZspeff


2005\08\09@133130 by Wouter van Ooijen

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> BTW, I ask here cause I haven't found anything known
> trustable yet and I know
> the topic of Paypal and Ebay has been discussed here before.

AFAIK a Paypal buyer can cause the seller much more trouble than the
other way round. But I don't know for sure, I just sell and so far
nobody has tried to cause me trouble (knocking on wood now).

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2005\08\09@133307 by PicDude

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On Tuesday 09 August 2005 12:27 pm, Spehro Pefhany scribbled:
> I would suggest just not buying if you distrust the seller.
>
> There are escrow services but not many people use them, or are willing to
> use them. Some have been exposed as fakes (ripping off the seller).

Could much of this be due to the added cost?  I am expecting/willing to pay a
small fee for this.


> If you decide to go ahead, a credit-card funded paypal payment is probably
> your best bet for relatively small amounts. If the seller won't accept
> that, head for the exit.

I have not used Paypal in a very long time, and they have caused me some
headaches in terms of verifying my bank account and then my credit card, so
that I can use this account, which I have used in the past.  Although I do
intend to use the CC via Paypal, I expect if I have a problem with the
seller/item, that I will also get a lot of red-tape with Paypal if I need to
fight it, so was hoping for something else.  BTW, this is $250.

Cheers,
-Neil.


2005\08\09@140703 by Spehro Pefhany

picon face
At 12:33 PM 8/9/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>On Tuesday 09 August 2005 12:27 pm, Spehro Pefhany scribbled:
> > I would suggest just not buying if you distrust the seller.
> >
> > There are escrow services but not many people use them, or are willing to
> > use them. Some have been exposed as fakes (ripping off the seller).
>
>Could much of this be due to the added cost?  I am expecting/willing to pay a
>small fee for this.

No, AFAIUI, it's mostly because the traditional way is to pay up front and
fast, and anything else is a hassle. Plus the added risk that the escrow
service may not send the money for one reason or another (say the buyer
changes his or her mind at some point). Then there are shipping expenses and
eBay fees to apportion etc.

{Quote hidden}

There's eBay buyer protection up to $200, less $25 for using the service, so if
you conform to the requirements for that you'll be on the hook for $75 tops.

http://pages.ebay.com/help/tp/esppp-coverage-eligibility.html

As well as the other requirements, note carefully the time limits, a bad
seller may try to stretch you out past the deadline. Look carefully at the
seller's feedbacks (especially negs and neutrals) to see where their issues
may be (before bidding).

See: http://www.toolhaus.org for a way to separate the wheat from the chaff
on feedbacks.

I've been ripped off only once in many hundreds of transactions, and this
fellow (a 'buyer' in New York) knew exactly what he was doing. Some items
such as new high-end electronics, new laptops, new digital SLRs, high-end new
cell phones etc. are magnets for scumsucking b*stards, and I refuse to use
eBay for that sort of thing. For oddball technical stuff, it's the cat's *ss.

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
.....speffKILLspamspam@spam@interlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com
->> Inexpensive test equipment & parts http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZspeff


2005\08\09@142422 by Don Taylor

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On Tue, 9 Aug 2005, Spehro Pefhany wrote:
> At 12:33 PM 8/9/2005 -0500, you wrote:
>> I have not used Paypal in a very long time, and they have caused me
>> some headaches in terms of verifying my bank account and then my credit
>> card, so that I can use this account, which I have used in the past.
>> Although I do intend to use the CC via Paypal, I expect if I have a
>> problem with the seller/item, that I will also get a lot of red-tape
>> with Paypal if I need to fight it, so was hoping for something else.
>> BTW, this is $250.
...
> I've been ripped off only once in many hundreds of transactions, and
> this fellow (a 'buyer' in New York) knew exactly what he was doing. Some
> items such as new high-end electronics, new laptops, new digital SLRs,
> high-end new cell phones etc. are magnets for scumsucking b*stards, and
> I refuse to use eBay for that sort of thing. For oddball technical
> stuff, it's the cat's *ss.

Likewise.  Computer Recyclers in Texas turned out to be a fraud operation
with a long history.  But I only found that out after they sent me junk
that wasn't what they described and delayed doing anything until Ebay
threw them off.

But I've bought way too many strange little books and never had a problem.

One alternative you might consider.  What is the location of the seller?
Perhaps someone on the list would go over, look at the merchandise, do the
deal for you and put it in the mail for cost.

I've done a "drive by" once at an address locally where the buyer was
pretty sure this was a fraud deal.  The buyer decided to not go further.

2005\08\09@145915 by PicDude

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On Tuesday 09 August 2005 01:13 pm, Spehro Pefhany scribbled:
> There's eBay buyer protection up to $200, less $25 for using the service,
> so if you conform to the requirements for that you'll be on the hook for
> $75 tops.

Actually, the word you used previously, "escrow", got me some good info on
google.  (I had previously been searching for "brokerage").  Apparently ebay
and many other sites recommend "escrow.com".

BTW, I also found this interesting and somewhat funny article...
       http://www.zug.com/pranks/powerbook/


> I've been ripped off only once in many hundreds of transactions, and this
> ...

I've had a few minor problems (like a $5 wireless PCMCIA not working), but
nothing major.  This item is a $250 set of exhaust headers, but having not
used Paypal for some time, when I tried to, it forced me to get verified
(bank account).  Paypal said it was only to verify my identity and would not
even let me use the money in my account until I did this.  So I did, and when
I tried to pay using my credit card, I was now told that there is another new
policy where they have to verify my credit card, and get something called an
"expanded use number" -- even though I've used this CC in the past, and it
was still not expired.  I explained this to the seller and that I did not
have any other option, so they agreed to wait but then immediately turned
around and filed a dispute with Ebay claiming that I "refused to pay".  That
is the part I am worried about -- they lied to me, and that is what adds the
distrust into the whole situation.  These are listed "brand new in box", and
I intend to hold them to this, but need to make sure I have a way to do so.

Cheers,
-Neil.


>
> Best regards,
>
> Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the
> reward" speffspamKILLspaminterlog.com             Info for manufacturers:
> http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for
> designers:  http://www.speff.com ->> Inexpensive test equipment & parts
> http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZspeff


2005\08\09@211200 by Andrew Warren

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PicDude <.....piclistKILLspamspam.....mit.edu> wrote:

> I am about to purchase an item on Ebay, but have a reason to distrust
> the seller.  I intend to pay with Paypal, but not sure that I have any
> easy protection in case of probelms.  I would like to know if there are
> any safe 3rd party brokerage services that I can use for a small fee to
> protect me if the item isn't as described.

   The easiest advice, of course, is: If you don't trust the seller,
   don't buy from him.

   If you have no choice, though, what you're looking for is an escrow
   -- either a commercial escrow service like escrow.com, or a
   knowledgeable friend geographically near the seller.

   If you go with a commercial service, use escrow.com; they're
   recommended by Ebay.  DON'T use another escrow service unless you
   have some way to know FOR CERTAIN that they're legitimate.  Details
   of the escrow process are available at:

       https://www.escrow.com/solutions/escrow/process.asp

   I've used escrow.com a couple of times; it's pretty painless.  You
   may even be able to convince your seller to split the escrow fee
   with you.

   -Andy

=== Andrew Warren - EraseMEfastfwdspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTix.netcom.com

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