Hi,
I know a few PIClisters do consultancy work for others, so I'm asking this
here. Apologies if some of you consider it a waste of bandwidth, please feel
free to ignore it.
I've developed a PHP-based application for someone. He now considers it to
be "complete enough to use" (and I do too), and wants to get it all up and
running on his server. Problem is, I don't want to hand over all the code
without payment, and I doubt he'll want to hand over any money without seeing
the source code.
So, what would you do? The best plan I've come up with is to hand over half
of the code, then when the payment comes through send the other half... How
is this sort of thing generally done in the software development industry?
>Hi,
> I know a few PIClisters do consultancy work for others, so I'm asking this
>here. Apologies if some of you consider it a waste of bandwidth, please feel
>free to ignore it.
>
> I've developed a PHP-based application for someone. He now considers it to
>be "complete enough to use" (and I do too), and wants to get it all up and
>running on his server. Problem is, I don't want to hand over all the code
>without payment, and I doubt he'll want to hand over any money without seeing
>the source code.
>
> So, what would you do? The best plan I've come up with is to hand over half
>of the code, then when the payment comes through send the other half... How
>is this sort of thing generally done in the software development industry?
Why does he need to see the source code? - surely he can test it to see that it does the job he
wants...?
>On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 12:47:18 +0100, you wrote:
>
> >Hi,
> > I know a few PIClisters do consultancy work for others, so I'm asking this
> >here. Apologies if some of you consider it a waste of bandwidth, please feel
> >free to ignore it.
> >
> > I've developed a PHP-based application for someone. He now considers it to
> >be "complete enough to use" (and I do too), and wants to get it all up and
> >running on his server. Problem is, I don't want to hand over all the code
> >without payment, and I doubt he'll want to hand over any money without
> seeing
> >the source code.
> >
> > So, what would you do? The best plan I've come up with is to hand over
> half
> >of the code, then when the payment comes through send the other half... How
> >is this sort of thing generally done in the software development industry?
>
>Why does he need to see the source code? - surely he can test it to see
>that it does the job he
>wants...?
I had a cautious client express concern that the commenting *could* be
insufficient. We simply negotiated the final payment (more like 10% than
50%) be made after (a fixed time after) they had a chance to look at and
build the code. IOW, that was the final milestone. Of course the object code
had been long tested and accepted by then. It was no problem-- think of
it as a "hold back" on a home renovation contract, and the contract was
more than big enough to make it worthwhile.
In the case of the PHP, they can test it on your server, right? Then
when they find that acceptable and pay you *most* of the $$, you can hand
over the source code or install it on their system. Then they have so many
weeks or whatever for final acceptance of the work (and then cut a check)
before you go into paid maintenance mode.
Of course it's best if this sort of thing is agreed upon before the work
starts, then you don't have the potential problem of disparate or
even dichotomous expectations.
Generally a lot of groundwork needs to be done before even starting
the work to define the ending. A bad time to start thinking about
this is after all the work is done...
Typically I've required 50% of the estimated payment at the beginning
of the work, and the remainder after delivery of the work (meeting all
requirements). If the job takes longer than a month or so
arrangements are made for intermediate milestone work deliveries and
payments. The contract I use stipulates that if either party is
unable to agree that the requirements were completely met and the
payment was completed then they agree to jointly employ a third party
arbitor.
That said, I've never had a client I didn't trust.
In your case, since neither party appears to fully trust the other, I
would suggest either:
1) Have them pay you 50%, deliver the code 100%, receive remainder of
payment once the code works on their webserver.
2) Employ an escrow service. For a fee they will receive both the
code and the payment, and then deliver both to the correct recipient.
This solves the "who hands what over first" but can be more expensive
and time consuming (a hassle) than alternatives.
> Hi,
> I know a few PIClisters do consultancy work for others, so I'm asking this
> here. Apologies if some of you consider it a waste of bandwidth, please feel
> free to ignore it.
>
> I've developed a PHP-based application for someone. He now considers it to
> be "complete enough to use" (and I do too), and wants to get it all up and
> running on his server. Problem is, I don't want to hand over all the code
> without payment, and I doubt he'll want to hand over any money without seeing
> the source code.
>
> So, what would you do? The best plan I've come up with is to hand over half
> of the code, then when the payment comes through send the other half... How
> is this sort of thing generally done in the software development industry?
>
> Thanks.
> --
> Phil. | Acorn RiscPC600 SA220 64MB+6GB 100baseT
> .....philpemKILLspam.....philpem.me.uk | Athlon64 3200+ A8VDeluxe R2 512MB+100GB
> http://www.philpem.me.uk/ | Sony MZ-N710 NetMD Minidisc
> ... ASCII : Another System Crash Is Imminent
> I've developed a PHP-based application for someone. He now considers it to
> be "complete enough to use" (and I do too), and wants to get it all up and
> running on his server. Problem is, I don't want to hand over all the code
> without payment, and I doubt he'll want to hand over any money without seeing
> the source code.
>
> So, what would you do? The best plan I've come up with is to hand over half
> of the code, then when the payment comes through send the other half... How
> is this sort of thing generally done in the software development industry?
1. If you have a signed contract you could trust him and fight it out
in court if he does not pay.
2. Is there any way you could run the application on a server of your
own but pointed at his data sources for purposes of an acceptance
test? That way he could see if it meets his specs but could not use it
if he did not pay.
3. Make him pay as much as you can get him to agree to up front with
the balance due after a successful test.
In the future it would be best to agree on these type of details
before the project starts but I suspect many of us have ben in similar
positions starting out.
> 2. Is there any way you could run the application on a server of your
> own but pointed at his data sources for purposes of an acceptance
> test? That way he could see if it meets his specs but could not use it
> if he did not pay.
That should be possible.. His PostgreSQL server holds the data, but the PHP
scripts run on my server and connect to his SQL server. Never thought of
that.. thanks!
> In the future it would be best to agree on these type of details
> before the project starts but I suspect many of us have ben in similar
> positions starting out.
Yeah, I guess..
I've sorted it out with my employer over the phone just now - thanks for the
suggestions. He's agreed to pay for the work done up to now, and for me to
get a workable version of the database going on his server. Then when I get
back from my holiday (Scotland - prime location for some wildlife
photography) I fix any bugs he's found and get the second part of it
finalised.
> >Hi,
> > I know a few PIClisters do consultancy work for others, so I'm asking
this
> >here. Apologies if some of you consider it a waste of bandwidth, please
feel
> >free to ignore it.
> >
> > I've developed a PHP-based application for someone. He now considers it
to
> >be "complete enough to use" (and I do too), and wants to get it all up
and
> >running on his server. Problem is, I don't want to hand over all the code
> >without payment, and I doubt he'll want to hand over any money without
> seeing
> >the source code.
> >
> > So, what would you do? The best plan I've come up with is to hand over
> half
> >of the code, then when the payment comes through send the other half...
How
> >is this sort of thing generally done in the software development
industry?
>
>Why does he need to see the source code? - surely he can test it to see
>that it does the job he wants...?
Make sure that you keep the copyright? Then if they do go bust/go with
someone else's system later you still have a marketable product? Make sure
you have some clause that it is exclusive to them only while they pay
maintenance?
> > >Hi,
> > > I know a few PIClisters do consultancy work for others, so I'm asking
> this
> > >here. Apologies if some of you consider it a waste of bandwidth, please
> feel
> > >free to ignore it.
> > >
> > > I've developed a PHP-based application for someone. He now considers it
> to
> > >be "complete enough to use" (and I do too), and wants to get it all up
> and
> > >running on his server. Problem is, I don't want to hand over all the code
> > >without payment, and I doubt he'll want to hand over any money without
> > seeing
> > >the source code.
> > >
> > > So, what would you do? The best plan I've come up with is to hand over
> > half
> > >of the code, then when the payment comes through send the other half...
> How
> > >is this sort of thing generally done in the software development
> industry?
> >
> >Why does he need to see the source code? - surely he can test it to see
> >that it does the job he wants...?
>
> Make sure that you keep the copyright? Then if they do go bust/go with
> someone else's system later you still have a marketable product? Make sure
> you have some clause that it is exclusive to them only while they pay
> maintenance?
My experience (in the field of webdesign) is that you would create
what the customer wants and show them that it's fully functional etc.
Then when you have fullfilled what they ask of you (creating the
website), you would ask them to transfer the money to your bank
account so you can finalize the matter by uploading it to their
webspace and making sure that it's as functional as it's supposed to
be.
If you don't want to sound 'dutch', you could always ask them to
transfer 3/4 of the full amount before you would upload the website,
then the other 1/4 when it's where and how they want it.
I personally would prefer to recieve all payments before handing over
the code. Don't be affraid that it will make you look bad, because
there are actually big coorporations that do the same.
philpem.me.uk | Athlon64 3200+ A8VDeluxe R2 512MB+100GB
