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'[OT]: Oh, my aching head!'
2001\06\07@081614 by Wendy J Olend

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I've just started my "Designing with Microprocessors" class, and guess what
processor we're working with.  The Motorolla HC11.  This means I get to
spend the summer wresting with 2 different instruction sets, 2 different
architectures and a host of other confusing incompatibilities...

<sigh> I'm just barely comfortable with the PIC.  It'll be a miricle if I
can do ANYTHING, with either processor, by the time August rolls around.

Pray for me , guys.

Wendy

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2001\06\07@091500 by Lawrence Lile

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Take heart, we know you can do it.  By the time August rolls around, you'll
be confidently coding in two types of assembly languages as fast as you can
type, and noting all the similarities.

You'll also have a handy chart for each one tattooed onto your arm so you
don't get PIC and HC11 syntax mixed up every time <GRIN>

-- Lawrence Lile

P.S.  I am always writing Visual Basic functions  when coding C and C
functions when coding Visual Basic.   I know the frustration.  That's why
this handy chart is glued to the backside of my glasses.

{Original Message removed}

2001\06\07@100737 by Paul Hutchinson

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You might want to join the HC11 mail-list visit:
http://www.mcu.motsps.com/major.html for subscription info.

Good bunch of people on the list including some Motorola engineers (The list
is owned/operated by Mot).

Paul

> I've just started my "Designing with Microprocessors" class, and
> guess what processor we're working with.  The Motorolla HC11.

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2001\06\07@130334 by Thomas C. Sefranek

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Wendy,

You'll BLESS the day you get to work with as good a microprocessor!

Wendy J Olend wrote:

{Quote hidden}

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2001\06\07@165047 by jamesnewton

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Just as with playing musical instruments, there will be a period of intense
frustration and lessor ability in all areas but that will be followed by an
increased understanding and greater ability in each area. After a while it
is suddenly easy to switch back and forth.

Like those split keyboards Microsoft puts out. I had to work on one at a
clients office for a while and switching back and forth from my standard
keyboard was killing me...

...then one day I just sat down and typed with out any problems at all. And
haven't had any trouble since. It wasn't gradual, it was sudden and
unexpected.

And Perl is starting to make sense to me as well...

...now if I could just get rid of these flying pigs...

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{Original Message removed}

2001\06\07@182911 by Dave Dilatush

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Wendy J Olend <Wendy_J_OlendspamKILLspamRAYTHEON.COM> wrote...

>I've just started my "Designing with Microprocessors" class, and guess what
>processor we're working with.  The Motorolla HC11.  This means I get to
>spend the summer wresting with 2 different instruction sets, 2 different
>architectures and a host of other confusing incompatibilities...

I worked with the 68HC11 for years, and in some ways it's a lot more
straightforward than PICs.  
In some ways, of course, it's not, particularly hardware: if you
implement a memory-mapped system with external RAM, EPROM, and I/O
(typical in what I was doing), you've got some hardware design and
construction to do that's a lot more involved than working with PICs.
PICs are compact by comparison.

On the plus side, I expect you'll find the 68HC11 has some amenities
that make it a bit more programmer-friendly:

 * No pesky bank bits to fret over;
 * No pesky page bits to fret over;
 * A REAL stack that you can actually use for parameter passing, with
   a stack pointer you can manipulate at will;
 * Two accumulators (A and B, each analogous to the PIC's W register)
   that can be used as a single 16-bit register for some operations;
 * Two index registers (X and Y, somewhat akin to FSR/INDF on the
   PIC, that can be used to hold addresses;
 * All memory and I/O (whether on-chip or external) is in a single,
   contiguous 64K address space;
 * On-chip RAM is allocated as a single, contiguous block instead
   of in separate banks as in the PIC;
 * A nice set of conditional branches that (for me, at least) make
   programs "seem" a lot more logical;
 * Table look-ups are a breeze; and
 * The 68HC11 has on-chip peripherals (timers/counters, SPI, UART,
   etc.) that are very similar to those on the PIC.

I migrated from 68HC11s to PICs because of the PIC's lower cost, lower
power consumption, higher speed, its compactness and the availability,
in the newer PICs, of enough RAM and flash ROM to do the jobs I have
at hand.  I **REALLY** like working with the PIC as it allows me a
processor solution for tasks that would be way too small to consider
using a 68HC11; and its high execution speed also allows me to do
things with it that would be impossible with the HC11.  (A fast, 4 MHz
68HC11F1 will execute an instruction in anywhere from 500 nanoseconds
to 1.75 microseconds, whereas a 20 MHz PIC16F877 executes 5
instructions every microsecond.)

That said, the 68HC11 was significantly easier to program than the PIC
is right now, at least for me.  Maybe when I have a few more PIC
projects under my belt I'll feel differently; presently I have just
one commercial PIC-based product out and a start on two others, plus
some homebrew doohickies on my workbench that blink, beep, or go
"phthththttt".

><sigh> I'm just barely comfortable with the PIC.  It'll be a miricle if I
>can do ANYTHING, with either processor, by the time August rolls around.

My bet is you've got it backwards: I suspect you'll be able to do a
LOT more, with BOTH processors, than you can now imagine.  Cheer up!

>Pray for me , guys.

Nah.  You don't need prayers.  You just need some online
encouragement.

When you've learned your first microprocessor, you know only that one
processor (unless you've got a head full of theoretical and historical
computer science lore, which I did not).

When you've learned your second, you begin to see common threads and
can start to generalize; you will know a lot more than just the two
microprocessors.

Once you've learned your third (at least this is my opinion) you've
pretty well learned them all, except for such esoterica as digital
signal processors and the like.  Learning any other chips, from that
point on, becomes pretty routine.

Good luck with the course, and enjoy.

Dave

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