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'[OT]: New toy... WOW!'
2000\06\20@062820 by Octavio P Nogueira

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> Why not try Sweden, we're almost reachin' $7 by now. You americans don't
> realize how lucky you are :-) So I'll stick with my Volkswagen Golf
running 35
> miles a gallon, and then I can also afford one of those, which I would
like!
>
> Brgds,
> Marcus

How about $9.50 in Brazil?

Friendly Regards

Octavio Nogueira
===================================================
spam_OUTnogueiraTakeThisOuTspampropic2.com                  ICQ# 19841898
ProPic tools - low cost PIC programmer and emulator
http://www.propic2.com
===================================================

2000\06\21@161541 by jamesnewton

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Anyone ever looked into the proposition that the human "engine" (as on a
bicycle, etc...) actually produces more waste than a well maintained
gasoline powered motorcycle or car? Think about it for a while... What
actually happens to your poop, pee, sweat... not to mention the packaging
involved in feeding you the extra calories it takes to pump those legs...

..if you won't buy that one, how about a comparison between a pedal pusher
and an electric car? Clean hydro or wind generation... power lines...
battery... motor.

Know why New Yorkers liked the first gas cars? They didn't have to deal with
horse poop on the streets. There were articles written about how gas cars
would save the environment. Humans only * look * cleaner.

---
James Newton .....jamesnewtonKILLspamspam@spam@geocities.com 1-619-652-0593


{Original Message removed}

2000\06\21@173517 by M. Adam Davis

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Well, if you were to measure the fumes produced by a car as compared to the
waste of a human, then I think you'd find the human to actually produce less
waste...

And given a certian calorie input (ie, gas has a lot of energy, food has little
by comparison) and waste output, I think you'd find the human ahead.

-Adam

James Newton wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> {Original Message removed}

2000\06\21@174608 by l.allen

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Adam Wrote...

> Well, if you were to measure the fumes produced by a car as compared to the
> waste of a human, then I think you'd find the human to actually produce less
> waste...
>
> And given a certian calorie input (ie, gas has a lot of energy, food has little
> by comparison) and waste output, I think you'd find the human ahead.
>
> -Adam
>
> James Newton wrote:
> >
> > Anyone ever looked into the proposition that the human "engine" (as on a
> > bicycle, etc...) actually produces more waste than a well maintained
> > gasoline powered motorcycle or car? Think about it for a while... What
> > actually happens to your poop, pee, sweat... not to mention the packaging
> > involved in feeding you the extra calories it takes to pump those legs...

There are a few other issues here like, the old central processor
above the ears there, its a hungry little beast turning considerable
amounts of protein into around 100 watts of electricity to run the
wet super computer. So a human can (there are exceptions I know)
think and peddle.


_____________________________

Lance Allen
Technical Officer
Uni of Auckland
Psych Dept
New Zealand

http://www.psych.auckland.ac.nz

_____________________________

2000\06\21@175631 by M. Adam Davis

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Lance Allen wrote:
> There are a few other issues here like, the old central processor
> above the ears there, its a hungry little beast turning considerable
> amounts of protein into around 100 watts of electricity to run the
> wet super computer. So a human can (there are exceptions I know)
> think and peddle.

I thought of that, but since a car can drive and play the radio/cool the
car/charge the laptop/etc then I figured I could null out the 'additional'
things each machine can perform while traveling which consume additional energy.

-Adam

2000\06\21@192936 by Damon Hopkins

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"M. Adam Davis" wrote:
>
> Lance Allen wrote:
> > There are a few other issues here like, the old central processor
> > above the ears there, its a hungry little beast turning considerable
> > amounts of protein into around 100 watts of electricity to run the
> > wet super computer. So a human can (there are exceptions I know)
> > think and peddle.
>
> I thought of that, but since a car can drive and play the radio/cool the
> car/charge the laptop/etc then I figured I could null out the 'additional'
> things each machine can perform while traveling which consume additional energy.
>
> -Adam
I'm sure there are some conversions that can be made here.. we could
talk about efficiency
how many calories in a given trip it takes a human vs a car. compare
that with weights get all kinds of crazy useless data.. :) It is
probably more efficient to ride a bike than drive a car. All kinds of
extraneous tangets could get involved here.. what about the amount of
work and waste produced to produce a car versus that of a bicycle.. one
thing I'd be willing to bet is that if you were to price the cost of
driving a car to work everyday for 5 years versus the cost of riding a
bike to work a bike costs FAR less. this of course assumes time has no
value, and both vehicles sole purpose is for the commute to work..
really it's a MUTE point.. as most things can be whittled down to.

                               Damon Hopkins

2000\06\21@194638 by l.allen
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Damon Wrote


> I'm sure there are some conversions that can be made here.. we could
> talk about efficiency
> how many calories in a given trip it takes a human vs a car. compare
> that with weights get all kinds of crazy useless data.. :)

> really it's a MUTE point.. as most things can be whittled down to.
>
>                                 Damon Hopkins

Nothing new ever got done by thinking inside the square.....
There were these bloody fools years ago who thought about using
crystals instead of valves (translate 'tubes') to amplify.....

Energy efficiency is a HUGE topic grossly neglected for decades
to our shame and if there was ever a topic that is important, no
matter how outside the square, its this.
10 litre Diesel Engines moving 2 tonne 4WD vehicles around as a
means to commute is sane?
Bio - Kinetic power generation is a hot topic amongst the
visionaries of the next wave in computing.


Crazy useless data?  I dont think so.




_____________________________

Lance Allen
Technical Officer
Uni of Auckland
Psych Dept
New Zealand

http://www.psych.auckland.ac.nz

_____________________________

2000\06\22@041423 by Alan B. Pearce

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> > There are a few other issues here like, the old central processor
> > above the ears there, its a hungry little beast turning considerable
> > amounts of protein into around 100 watts of electricity to run the
> > wet super computer. So a human can (there are exceptions I know)
> > think and peddle.


Perhaps we should be attaching a peltier device to harness the heat to generate
electricity to drive a motor to help the cyclist which will lower his
temperature......... I think we need a PIC to solve the feedback loop problem
and adjust how much energy gets fed to the motor so the cyclists temperature
does not drop too far and reduce the electricity output..... Now we need a dump
for the excess electricity - how about a headlight!

2000\06\22@115356 by Michael Damon Hopkins

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"Alan B. Pearce" wrote:
>
> > > There are a few other issues here like, the old central processor
> > > above the ears there, its a hungry little beast turning considerable
> > > amounts of protein into around 100 watts of electricity to run the
> > > wet super computer. So a human can (there are exceptions I know)
> > > think and peddle.
>
> Perhaps we should be attaching a peltier device to harness the heat to generate
> electricity to drive a motor to help the cyclist which will lower his
> temperature......... I think we need a PIC to solve the feedback loop problem
> and adjust how much energy gets fed to the motor so the cyclists temperature
> does not drop too far and reduce the electricity output..... Now we need a dump
> for the excess electricity - how about a headlight!
also an LCD so we can watch the stats.. :) ohh and some eeprom for
dataloging..


               Damon Hopkins

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