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'[OT]: How to control a motor'
2000\11\13@181034 by Dan Michaels

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face
Bob Ammerman wrote:
>
>> At 10:47 AM 11/13/2000 -0800, you wrote:
>> >Think "Hackers break in, use his own invention to kill inventor of
>> >Internet-controlled roboguard."  I think I'll pass on this one, folks!
>> >
>> >  Mark
>> >
>>
>> Roboguard doesn't recognize guy in the mirror. Gives self
>> 8-seconds to comply. Shoots, bullets bounce off wall, destroying
>> robo-guard. End of matter.
>>
>
>Time to create a new PICLIST tag?
>
>[SCRIPT]:
>

That admin "bad-guy" Mark Willis forgot to change it to [OT]:
when he trickled off the theme.

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2000\11\14@200117 by Jinx

face picon face
www.shopweb.net/poo-chi.htm?swtop

Knowing my luck, mine would "play dead" as soon as I got it
out of the box

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2000\11\14@201615 by Dan Michaels

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Jester wrote:
>http://www.shopweb.net/poo-chi.htm?swtop
>
>Knowing my luck, mine would "play dead" as soon as I got it
>out of the box
>

Did you find any technical info for it?
A schematic, per chance?

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2000\11\14@203131 by Jinx

face picon face
From: Dan Michaels


> Jester wrote:
> >http://www.shopweb.net/poo-chi.htm?swtop
> >
> >Knowing my luck, mine would "play dead" as soon as I got it
> >out of the box
> >
>
> Did you find any technical info for it?
> A schematic, per chance?

Unlikely - you could always shell out $24.99 and play Vet-For-A-Day

Don't you just love those cutesy pink hearts for eyes ? Shame to take
a screwdriver to them. In front of the kids. Completely bladdered. Hey,
everyone else is dysfunctional, good enough for my kids too

Seriously, for full retail of $29.99 what would you expect to find ? Couple
of pager motors and some dodgy soldering. The learning part isn't a bad
idea, probably generously puffed up in the ad blurb though. Wonder what
you could REALLY teach it to do he he. Hands up anyone who's tried to
teach a parrot to swear

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2000\11\14@210810 by Dan Michaels

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>Don't you just love those cutesy pink hearts for eyes ? Shame to take
>a screwdriver to them. In front of the kids. Completely bladdered. Hey,
>everyone else is dysfunctional, good enough for my kids too
>

good thing you made this one [OT]:

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2000\11\14@222600 by Jinx

face picon face
> >everyone else is dysfunctional, good enough for my kids too
> >
> good thing you made this one [OT]:
>

*******************
Basically a good boy

> >Guys, can we go to [OT]: on this please? Thanks...
---
> >James Newton (PICList Admin #3)
*******************

So anyway, how would you rationalise all the best from turtles, cute
puppies, rovers and the like to make a learning robot ? I'd like to
get into robotics more but not just for the sake of it. For all the effort
of designing and building one I'd want it to be able to self-modify
and actually perform tasks, rather than just run around the house
chipping paintwork or nose-diving into the cat's bowl

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2000\11\15@005501 by Dan Michaels

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Mr Trouble wrote:
>
>So anyway, how would you rationalise all the best from turtles, cute
>puppies, rovers and the like to make a learning robot ? I'd like to
>get into robotics more but not just for the sake of it. For all the effort
>of designing and building one I'd want it to be able to self-modify
>and actually perform tasks, rather than just run around the house
>chipping paintwork or nose-diving into the cat's bowl
>

I for one don't want to spend a lot of time building something
mechanical - since I don't have a milling machine [durn it - fond
memories of end-mills churning thru aluminum], so that's why I
was looking at doing an RC-car/tank hack.

Also, if by "rationalize" you mean to endow your creation with the
mental power of a rover/etc [dingo ????], then you are probably in
line behind all of the AI labs in the universe.

You might, however, take a look at Rodney Brooks' stuff I mentioned
previously - I esp like his approach - based upon the idea that
there is an entire globe full of organic-animatronimals that
sustain robust existences without the advantage of possessing
higher brain capacities --> ie, insects for instance are extremely
successful beings, vis-a-vis survival, but of course, they are
dumb as bugs - also, elephants are not the sort you want to
get in the way of if ticked off, but then they are also not
smart enough to play chess either - if you catch my drift
here ----

-[if you don't, the point is you can get lots of very complex
survival-prone behavior out of beings that aren't all that
bright - Brooks' idea is "bottom-up" rather than classical
top-down AI - start with something robust enough to survive for
more than 2 msec, then add "layers" of higher-control to that
- basically the concept behind bottom-to-top ordering in
the animal kingdom - start simple]:

http://www.ai.mit.edu/people/brooks/paperlist.html

"A Robust Layered Control System for a Mobile Robot"
"A Robot That Walks; Emergent Behaviors from a Carefully Evolved Network"
"Intelligence for Miniature Robots"
"Elephants Don't Play Chess"

[hmmmm, probably way past my bedtime]
- danM

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2000\11\15@115437 by Dan Michaels

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Jinx wrote:

>So anyway, how would you rationalise all the best from turtles, cute
>puppies, rovers and the like to make a learning robot ? I'd like to
>get into robotics more but not just for the sake of it. For all the effort
>of designing and building one I'd want it to be able to self-modify
>and actually perform tasks, rather than just run around the house
>chipping paintwork or nose-diving into the cat's bowl
>

Info on machine learning:  http://www.bvandam.net/

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2000\11\19@220850 by Dan Michaels

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Tom and others,

I went and played with the Radio Shack toys this weekend. The
T1 tank is nice and slow [100 feet/min] and powerful, but hard
to control by hand -[these are not your kid's 15YO hands, I guess].

The 2 tread drive motors have separate R/C channels and you have
to control them individually. To go straight you push both
controls forward at the same time, etc - you compensate for
different motor speeds manually. Turning is not pretty. Punch
one motor and the thing swings around like crazy.

The other one I looked at was the Buzzsaw 4WD, high/low-gearing
monster truck. Goes 500 feet/min in high gear, lots slower
[not-specified] in low. Has bang-bang steering, but still lots
easier to control than the tank. With a variable H-bridge on
the motor, this one may be doable - if it still has any torque
left with the motors running at less than full current.

The tank may be easier to control by computer than by hand,
but I think you would definitely need to measure motor RPMs to
get it to go straight.

best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
http://www.oricomtech.com <--[slowly getting the new site up]
=========================

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2000\11\21@042038 by Tom Handley

picon face
  Dan, thanks for the info! Looking at the current R/S catalog,
I can't find the T1 tank. The one they have is called "Sentinel"
and the turret rotates though it's not clear how you do that
based on the picture of the remote... 100 ft/min is too fast for
my use and using PWM control to slow things down gives up a lot
of torque. I wish I could see what's inside. I'll stop by my local
R/S soon and see if they have one I can play with.

  Right now I'm considering starting from scratch... I looked
at Jameco and they have some powerful low-rpm DC motors with
internal gearing for around $15-$20. This eliminates an external
gear box. I also looked at the Robot Store and found a dual motor
gear box assembly for $20 but the shaft length is only 4". For
$39 they have a tracked bulldozer kit for $40 that uses the above.
It's out of stock until at least next month. It's also smaller
than I prefer (7"x5.5"). They have other motor gear box assemblies
for around $20. The motors use 3-4.5V. For more info:

     http://www.RobotStore.com

  - Tom

At 10:08 PM 11/19/00 -0500, Dan Michaels wrote:
{Quote hidden}

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom Handley
New Age Communications
Since '75 before "New Age" and no one around here is waiting for UFOs ;-)

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2000\11\21@062552 by staff

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Tom Handley wrote:
>
>    Dan, thanks for the info! Looking at the current R/S catalog,
> I can't find the T1 tank. The one they have is called "Sentinel"
> and the turret rotates though it's not clear how you do that
> based on the picture of the remote... 100 ft/min is too fast for
> my use and using PWM control to slow things down gives up a lot
> of torque. I wish I could see what's inside. I'll stop by my local
> R/S soon and see if they have one I can play with.
>
>    Right now I'm considering starting from scratch... I looked
> at Jameco and they have some powerful low-rpm DC motors with
> internal gearing for around $15-$20.


Guys, a while back I needed some robotics parts and asked around
a few local repairers for old (dead) fax machines. With a couple
of phone calls I got about 10 old faxes that had been traded in.
These are junk and most shops have to pay $$ to dispose of them.

Most (thermal paper) faxes use two stepper motors, one for feed-in
and one for feed-out of the paper. 7 of the ten faxes were like this.
The motors are usually exactly the same part, and commonly have
attached gearing of 7:1, with 48 step stepper motors, six wire
unipolar at 12v or 48v. So you get a matched pair of motors from
almost every fax you strip.

I used a matched pair of motor-gearbox for a small robot experiment,
a 48 step motor with 7:1 gearing is just about perfect to attach
a wheel to and put them in your robot. Speed is about 1 to 2
inches/sec depending on wheel size. And torque is quite good,
surprisingly. If you are thinking of starting from scratch don't
rule out the fax motor option. :o)
-Roman

PS. Faxes also have good modular switchmode supplies, stepper
control chips, 1x16 or 2x16 LCD hitachi displays, and about 40
tiny leds for the reader. And lots of matched cogs/shafts etc.
Well worth stripping if you want to play with robotics.

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2000\11\21@120433 by Dan Michaels

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Tom Handley wrote:
>   Dan, thanks for the info! Looking at the current R/S catalog,
>I can't find the T1 tank. The one they have is called "Sentinel"
>and the turret rotates though it's not clear how you do that
>based on the picture of the remote... 100 ft/min is too fast for
>my use and using PWM control to slow things down gives up a lot
>of torque. I wish I could see what's inside. I'll stop by my local
>R/S soon and see if they have one I can play with.
>


Hi Tom, speed definitely is a problem with any of these R/C toys.
The tank is by far the slowest of all the toys. The RS tank
probably is called Sentinel. It has 4 controls - left motor, right
motor, cannon fire, and turret rotate. The turret obviously has a
only a simple motor-cam mechanism, as you hold the button and the
cannon sweeps back and forth, covering maybe 50 deg total.

Re PWM control, somewhere I saw a comment about getting more
torque by using PWM than by controlling the current thru the
motor - full-size_voltage/current_pulses vs
continuous_variable_current. Is this not true?

Re seeing the innards of a tank, I published some links last
week, one showing the insides. I am sure they are all similar.
Here it is:

- really nice picture of model tank innards - 2 motors, geared
 way down, not sure how they synchronize the speeds:
 http://www.modeltanks.fsnet.co.uk/tamiyam1a1.htm

Now I know how they synchronize the speeds - they don't. "You"
just push the 2 motor buttons manually.

best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
http://www.oricomtech.com
=========================

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2000\11\21@120853 by Dan Michaels

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Roman Black wrote:
>Tom Handley wrote:

>>    Right now I'm considering starting from scratch... I looked
>> at Jameco and they have some powerful low-rpm DC motors with
>> internal gearing for around $15-$20.
......
>
>PS. Faxes also have good modular switchmode supplies, stepper
>control chips, 1x16 or 2x16 LCD hitachi displays, and about 40
>tiny leds for the reader. And lots of matched cogs/shafts etc.
>Well worth stripping if you want to play with robotics.
>

Drat - exactly what I "didn't" want to do was spend 6 months
starting from scratch, just to get the "basics" working.

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2000\11\21@123122 by Dan Michaels

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Tom Handley wrote:

>   Right now I'm considering starting from scratch... I looked
>at Jameco and they have some powerful low-rpm DC motors with
>internal gearing for around $15-$20. This eliminates an external
>gear box. I also looked at the Robot Store and found a dual motor
>gear box assembly for $20 but the shaft length is only 4". For
>$39 they have a tracked bulldozer kit for $40 that uses the above.
>It's out of stock until at least next month. It's also smaller
>than I prefer (7"x5.5"). They have other motor gear box assemblies
>for around $20. The motors use 3-4.5V. For more info:
>
>      http://www.RobotStore.com
>

Hi Tom,

Looked at their stuff - the 3-709 twin motor gear box kit at $19.95
looks pretty good, and the bulldozer looks very hackable. The
tanks use a similar motor-gear arrangement, but this one is
probably geared down more - good. Seems I saw that same bulldozer
on several sites last week - so you might hunt around.

Also, the bulldozer is "wired", not R/C, from the looks of it.
Also, Toys-R-Us has a similar bulldozer advertised for only $19.95,
and lots prettier [if that's what you are into]. You might check
that. Maybe can steal the R/C from your car, and put it in the dozer.

Alternately, the 3-709 motors go into a Dalek replica - that oughta
scare the cat.

best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
http://www.oricomtech.com
=========================

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2000\11\21@123925 by Bill Westfield

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A recently received Edmund's scientific catalog has a bunch of robotics
oriented stuff, including a geared, tracked vehicle platform:

http://www.edmundscientific.com/Products/DisplayProduct.cfm?productid=1081

Only one motor, looks pretty small, no steering.  But looks like a nice
gearbox, and cheap (even compared to RS toys.)

BillW

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2000\11\21@143508 by Dan Michaels

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BillW wrote:
>A recently received Edmund's scientific catalog has a bunch of robotics
>oriented stuff, including a geared, tracked vehicle platform:
>
>http://www.edmundscientific.com/Products/DisplayProduct.cfm?productid=1081
>
>Only one motor, looks pretty small, no steering.  But looks like a nice
>gearbox, and cheap (even compared to RS toys.)
>


Can't get any simpler than that - probably too simple - not sure
it would fill Tom's reqs. Good gear ratio - maybe could put two
of these side by side, remove inside treads/wheels, and build a
decent hackable unit that way.

- danM

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2000\11\21@210913 by Dan Michaels

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Tom Handley wrote:
>   Dan, thanks for the info! Looking at the current R/S catalog,
>I can't find the T1 tank. The one they have is called "Sentinel"
>and the turret rotates though it's not clear how you do that
>based on the picture of the remote... 100 ft/min is too fast for
>my use and using PWM control to slow things down gives up a lot
>of torque. I wish I could see what's inside. I'll stop by my local
>R/S soon and see if they have one I can play with.
>

Tom, here is another tank drive base unit:

http://www.goldmine-elec.com/RobotItems.htm

best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
http://www.oricomtech.com
=========================

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2000\11\22@002851 by Bala Chandar

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Roman Black wrote:

Guys, a while back I needed some robotics parts and asked around
a few local repairers for old (dead) fax machines. With a couple
of phone calls I got about 10 old faxes that had been traded in.
These are junk and most shops have to pay $$ to dispose of them.

Most (thermal paper) faxes use two stepper motors, one for feed-in
and one for feed-out of the paper. 7 of the ten faxes were like this.
The motors are usually exactly the same part, and commonly have
attached gearing of 7:1, with 48 step stepper motors, six wire
unipolar at 12v or 48v. So you get a matched pair of motors from
almost every fax you strip.

I used a matched pair of motor-gearbox for a small robot experiment,
a 48 step motor with 7:1 gearing is just about perfect to attach
a wheel to and put them in your robot. Speed is about 1 to 2
inches/sec depending on wheel size. And torque is quite good,
surprisingly. If you are thinking of starting from scratch don't
rule out the fax motor option. :o)

PS. Faxes also have good modular switchmode supplies, stepper
control chips, 1x16 or 2x16 LCD hitachi displays, and about 40
tiny leds for the reader. And lots of matched cogs/shafts etc.
Well worth stripping if you want to play with robotics.
-Roman
--

Thanks a lot Roman! That's a very useful piece of information.

Next time I visit a junk shop, I will specifically look for a fax machine
which seems to have a wealth of parts for a robotics enthusiast. Previously,
I used to look for only junk printers and floppy drives!

Bala

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2000\11\22@005931 by Dan Michaels

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Bala Chandar wrote:
>
>Thanks a lot Roman! That's a very useful piece of information.
>
>Next time I visit a junk shop, I will specifically look for a fax machine
>which seems to have a wealth of parts for a robotics enthusiast. Previously,
>I used to look for only junk printers and floppy drives!
>

Jinx, I think it was, told me he took an old dot matrix printer,
turned it belly-up, and ran it around the room driven by its
roller.

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2000\11\22@010518 by dre Domingos F. Souza

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>Guys, a while back I needed some robotics parts and asked around
>a few local repairers for old (dead) fax machines. With a couple
>of phone calls I got about 10 old faxes that had been traded in.
>These are junk and most shops have to pay $$ to dispose of them.

       Interesting that here in Brazil, YOU have to pay to put your dirty hands onto this kind of trash. In the land of "we use everything at hand", every repairman has to have lots of old units to scrap and get the parts to fix the better ones. Sad but true.


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2000\11\22@010741 by dre Domingos F. Souza

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>Jinx, I think it was, told me he took an old dot matrix printer,
>turned it belly-up, and ran it around the room driven by its
>roller.

       I've done it. It's funny! :oD


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2000\11\22@024138 by staff

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Dan Michaels wrote:
>
> Roman Black wrote:
> >Tom Handley wrote:
>
> >>    Right now I'm considering starting from scratch... I looked
> >> at Jameco and they have some powerful low-rpm DC motors with
> >> internal gearing for around $15-$20.
> ......
> >
> >PS. Faxes also have good modular switchmode supplies, stepper
> >control chips, 1x16 or 2x16 LCD hitachi displays, and about 40
> >tiny leds for the reader. And lots of matched cogs/shafts etc.
> >Well worth stripping if you want to play with robotics.
> >
>
> Drat - exactly what I "didn't" want to do was spend 6 months
> starting from scratch, just to get the "basics" working.


Dan, I pulled two identical motors/gearboxes from a fax,
glued two plastic wheels to the final gears of the gearbox,
and mounted it in a metal box. In a few hours work had a
nice little robot platform, stepper driven with about 0.1mm
step resolution. And I know it is a lot more rugged than
a "toy" construction, some of the older style faxes are
quite rugged.
-Roman

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2000\11\22@034257 by Jinx

face picon face
> >Jinx, I think it was, told me he took an old dot matrix printer,
> >turned it belly-up, and ran it around the room driven by its
> >roller.
>
>         I've done it. It's funny! :oD

The not-funny bit is getting

Help help being abused, call Panasonic Victim Support
Held hostage by sadist, starting to like taste of Axminster
Help help being abused, call Panasonic Victim Support
Held hostage by sadist, starting to like taste of Axminster
Help help being abused, call Panasonic Victim Support
.................
off the carpet

btw I slaughtered another one today, any ideas on alternate uses
for 9-pin print heads ? They look so lonely there on the bench after
everything else has been put into boxes. The pin coils are driven
by an HA13408 (also one there to drive two bipolar steppers) so
must need a fair whack of power and/or speed for impact

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2000\11\22@081214 by Arthur Brown

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How about a tattoing machine controlled by a PIC
(you could then bring it in from that cold world of [OT]:  it's very popualr
your part of the world .
come to think about it this may be better suited for a ink-jet

Re: gards Art

{Original Message removed}

2000\11\22@101026 by Tom Handley

picon face
  Dan, it sounds like we are chasing around the `Net' about 5 mins from
each other. Pull over at the next truck stop and let's have a beer ;-)

  I ran across the links you mentioned and was up most all night finding a
wealth of new info but I didn't bookmark many of them. I did run across an
*EXCELLENT* site for motor info at:

     http://www.us-epanorama.net/motorcontrol.html#general

  Another simple, but practical source of motor hacks for robots is:

     http://members.tripod.com/RoBoJRR/motortech.htm

  I also found a few interesting things at:

     http://www.robotmag.com/default.htm

  Apparently, Mabuchi is the main vendor for motors used in R/C stuff:

     http://www.mabuchi-motor.co.jp/eng/mot/index.html

  Right here in Portland, OR and up in Seattle, WA, check out:

     http://www.rdrop.com/~marvin/
     http://www.seattlerobotics.org/

  It turns out that I know Marvin from the days when I was an Amiga
(Remember the Amiga?) developer and he's very active in Robotics. I need to
look him up as he is local. I should also attend a PARTS meeting here in
Portland.

  The gear boxes and several robots including the bulldozer, that have
been mentioned from a variety of vendors, are also available from Edmund
Scientific which has better pictures of them:

     http://www.edsci.com/

  Another decent commercial site is Arrik Robotics:

     http://www.robotics.com/

  There are so many sites but you have already seen them. As far as my
project, it's evolving as I type... I'll followup on where I'm heading after
I get some sleep and digest what I've run across tonight. I'm still debating
R/S Tank or Scratch... I do know this; the platform and the drive are the
hard part. Once I nail that down, doing the sensors and software is the fun
part. Sensors are one of my strong points.

  - Tom

At 12:04 PM 11/21/00 -0500, Dan Michaels wrote:
{Quote hidden}

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom Handley
New Age Communications
Since '75 before "New Age" and no one around here is waiting for UFOs ;-)

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2000\11\22@120645 by Dan Michaels

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Jinx wrote:
>btw I slaughtered another one today, any ideas on alternate uses
>for 9-pin print heads ? They look so lonely there on the bench after
>everything else has been put into boxes. The pin coils are driven
>by an HA13408 (also one there to drive two bipolar steppers) so
>must need a fair whack of power and/or speed for impact
>

West Auckland Tattoo Parlor ?????

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2000\11\22@123736 by dre Domingos F. Souza

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>>btw I slaughtered another one today, any ideas on alternate uses
>>for 9-pin print heads ? They look so lonely there on the bench after
>>everything else has been put into boxes. The pin coils are driven
>>by an HA13408 (also one there to drive two bipolar steppers) so
>>must need a fair whack of power and/or speed for impact
>West Auckland Tattoo Parlor ?????

       HUAHUHAUHA, nice use! ;oD


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2000\11\22@124558 by Dan Michaels

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Tom Handley wrote:
>   Dan, it sounds like we are chasing around the `Net' about 5 mins from
>each other. Pull over at the next truck stop and let's have a beer ;-)
>

:)
====================

>   I ran across the links you mentioned and was up most all night finding a
>wealth of new info but I didn't bookmark many of them. I did run across an
>*EXCELLENT* site for motor info at:
>
>      http://www.us-epanorama.net/motorcontrol.html#general
>

Yes, think I mentioned that one - very good - and not just for
motors. Someone else mentioned ePanorama, and looks like a
really good site - finland.
=====================

>   There are so many sites but you have already seen them. As far as my
>project, it's evolving as I type... I'll followup on where I'm heading after
>I get some sleep and digest what I've run across tonight. I'm still debating
>R/S Tank or Scratch... I do know this; the platform and the drive are the
>hard part. Once I nail that down, doing the sensors and software is the fun
>part. Sensors are one of my strong points.
>

All in all, I think the 3-709 twin motor gear box kit at $19
from   http://www.RobotStore.com   looks most promising for what
you want - if you want to hack it. Unfortuantely, with my shaky
knees and woozy upclose vision [and no milling machine], I
am probably not wanting to build too much. Just lash my PIC
onto a pre-build platform that already has R/C control. Maybe
add some specialty motor control.

Re from scratch - by the time I lashed wheels onto some kinda
frame [hmmm, what frame??], added motor control and R/C
electronics, figured out how to do turning, etc/etc, it would
be 6 months.

The RS tank looks almost ideal - for the hack category -
although it may be slightly too fast. However, I plan to
investigate the bulldozers some more. They can't be very fast.
Toy-R-Us also has loaders and backhoes or something.

best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
http://www.oricomtech.com
=========================

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2000\11\22@131928 by Dan Michaels

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Hey, Tom [Handley], I was just looking at the Robotstore.com
3-709 gear some more. Here are the specs:

  3-709 - Twin Motor Gear Box Kit - $19.95
  Two DC motors & gears in a compact unit. Same as in the Bulldozer.
  Provides full fwd-rev-left-right action! Build with 1 of two
  different ratios: fast 58:1 or strong 203:1. Size: 75 x 50 x 23 mm.
  Shafts: 3 mm hex, 105 mm long. Add your own wheel, hubs or tracks.

Notice this comes in 2 gear ratios. I wonder - this thing might be
the same size [or even same unit] as used in the RS sentinel tank.
I bet the tank has the faster ratio, and it might just be possible
to pop the slow/high-torque ratio version of the 3-709 into the tank.
This might be ideal.

best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
http://www.oricomtech.com
=========================

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2000\11\22@140528 by dre Domingos F. Souza

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>All in all, I think the 3-709 twin motor gear box kit at $19
>from   http://www.RobotStore.com   looks most promising for what
>you want - if you want to hack it. Unfortuantely, with my shaky
>knees and woozy upclose vision [and no milling machine], I
>am probably not wanting to build too much. Just lash my PIC
>onto a pre-build platform that already has R/C control. Maybe
>add some specialty motor control.

       Have you tried that little motors from microwave ovens? They have it's own motor gear box, and has LOTS of strengh. IIRC, they are 110V. But they are SO cheap, that you can pull the motor apart to rewire, or to put a 12V motor on it.

>The RS tank looks almost ideal - for the hack category -
>although it may be slightly too fast. However, I plan to
>investigate the bulldozers some more. They can't be very fast.
>Toy-R-Us also has loaders and backhoes or something.

       Bulldozers are funny if you implement all the control axes on it :o)


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2000\11\22@181236 by Jinx

face picon face
> any ideas on alternate uses for 9-pin print heads ?
>
> West Auckland Tattoo Parlor ?????
>

Been thinking about getting a tattoo. But 6" taller than I am now

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2000\11\22@215223 by dre Domingos F. Souza

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>> any ideas on alternate uses for 9-pin print heads ?
>> West Auckland Tattoo Parlor ?????
>Been thinking about getting a tattoo. But 6" taller than I am now

       What about a quake tatoo? It would be nice on the chest :o)


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       Linux User #85093

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2000\11\23@003528 by Dan Michaels

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Tom Handley wrote:
>      http://www.seattlerobotics.org/
>
Tom, I was tracking down this link of yours, and vectored off
to the following:

       http://www.sinerobotics.com

Of all the 2-wheeled-warty little things, the Spade II shown
looks most interesting, but they don't seem to sell it. They
do sell a couple a uninteresting warts, however:

       http://www.sinerobotics.com/m-slyder.html

Of more interest is a geared-down twin-motor DIY kit for $15:

       http://www.sinerobotics.com/twinmotor.html

best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
http://www.oricomtech.com
=========================

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2000\11\23@005908 by dre Domingos F. Souza

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>Tom, I was tracking down this link of yours, and vectored off
>to the following:
>        http://www.sinerobotics.com
>Of all the 2-wheeled-warty little things, the Spade II shown
>looks most interesting, but they don't seem to sell it. They
>do sell a couple a uninteresting warts, however:

       Talking about running things, it's good to remember that tamya has EVERYTHING a robot builder can ask. See it's catalog!D


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2000\11\23@130437 by Dan Michaels

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Tom Handley wrote:
>      http://www.robotmag.com/default.htm
>

Tom, here's another tank project. I was tracking down the
site mentioned above, and vectored over to:

http://www.leang.com/robotics/

His tank uses Tamiya twin motors and salvaged wheels/treads from
a $11 toy. Good pics of inner workings - nice job - of course,
he "would" have access to a milling machine.

http://www.leang.com/robotics/past/commando/commando.html

best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
http://www.oricomtech.com
=========================

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2000\11\23@144036 by Peter L. Peres

picon face
>9pin dot matrix heads

They usually need about 2A per coil. How about improvising a 'manual
printer', using the head, a parallel port, and a wheel+optocoupler from a
mouse. You would hold it in your hand like a big pen and 'draw' across
paper, with the wheel giving timing pulses (only one phase), and the
computer program could print something. I'll leave the ribbon problem to
you <g>.

I once tried to make a set of very small electrovalves using a 9pin print
head. I did not succeed because of machining difficulties (I took out 4
pins, leaving evey other, to form 5 valves against 2 sandwiched plates
drilled with precise holes. The actual valves were 1mm steel balls between
the sandwiched plates and a membrane kept the thing airtight. The valves
were 'normally open').

Peter

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2000\11\23@150815 by Dan Michaels

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face
Tom Handley wrote:
........
I also looked at the Robot Store and found a dual motor
>gear box assembly for $20 but the shaft length is only 4". For
>$39 they have a tracked bulldozer kit for $40 that uses the above.
>It's out of stock until at least next month.

Tom,

- here is another site with exactly the same dual-motor
 geartrain and bulldozer:

       http://www.hvwtech.com/gearsets.htm

- now here is the sort of thing "I" really had in mind
 all along - not your basic 2-wheeled wart:

       http://www.wizard.org/gadget.html

- also, this may be the "ultimate" platform for a 2-wheeled wart,
 better even than thinkertoy wheels on a Palm or floppy drive
 --> thought problem --> what to do with all those AOL CD-ROMs
 --> answer: drill'em

       members.nbci.com/_XMCM/roboticspage/projects.htm
       http://members.nbci.com/_XMCM/roboticspage/

best regards,
- Dan Michaels
Oricom Technologies
http://www.oricomtech.com
=========================

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2000\11\24@034340 by Blars Blarson

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In article <200011230348070150.0B7534CE@200.217.18.6>
.....xandinhospamRemoveMEinterlink.com.br writes:
>        Talking about running things, it's good to remember that tamya has=
> EVERYTHING a robot builder can ask. See it's catalog!

I've got to find this place, I could use a few positronic brains and
power-plants from late model bolos.  Somehow I suspect they'll be out of
stock...
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2000\11\24@155934 by Christopher E. Brown

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On Fri, 24 Nov 2000, Blars Blarson wrote:

> In article <200011230348070150.0B7534CE@200.217.18.6>
> spamBeGonexandinho@spam@spamspam_OUTinterlink.com.br writes:
> >        Talking about running things, it's good to remember that tamya has=
> > EVERYTHING a robot builder can ask. See it's catalog!
>
> I've got to find this place, I could use a few positronic brains and
> power-plants from late model bolos.  Somehow I suspect they'll be out of
> stock...


       Hmmm, IIRC there was never a primary production BOLO based on
positronic tech for the core CPU (though there were various
experimental units, and I am not positive about the post MKXXXII units
deployed twards the end of the Melconian war as less than .01 percent
of inhabited planets (ours and theirs) survived the great scourge,
and no BOLO R&D facilities survived).

       Course, as even a MKXXs molycirc based core after being
stripped of its armor and backup units is the size of a VW bus, it
might not fit into a chassis designed for PIC usage.



       There don't seem to be any direct mag bottle fusion units from
BOLOs around, but I think I saw some Tokamak units produced for the
38th century (paratime) Holy Roman Empire.  I think I have the alt
timeline coords if you need em.


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2000\11\27@164830 by Alice Campbell

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OK, guys, just remember dinners at seven.
mom

{Quote hidden}

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2000\11\27@205357 by Dan Michaels

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>>         The roaches seem to have survived, but they are not routing packets
>> correctly.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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2000\11\27@205814 by Christopher E. Brown

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On Mon, 27 Nov 2000, Dan Michaels wrote:

> >>         The roaches seem to have survived, but they are not routing packets
> >> correctly.
>
> !!!!!!!!!!!!!


       It goes with the other .sig

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2000\11\28@215615 by dre Domingos F. Souza

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>They usually need about 2A per coil. How about improvising a 'manual
>printer', using the head, a parallel port, and a wheel+optocoupler from a
>mouse. You would hold it in your hand like a big pen and 'draw' across
>paper, with the wheel giving timing pulses (only one phase), and the
>computer program could print something. I'll leave the ribbon problem to
>you <g>.

       This exists :o)


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