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'[OT]: FEDEX and customs clearance'
2005\04\20@142053 by Arkady Skorokhod

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Hello all.

Maybe someone can advice me on the following situation. I purchased some
modules from one firm in Italy which were to be shipped by FEDEX to Israel.
I was charged by the sender for amount of $65 for FEDEX delivery. Yesterday
I was called from FEDEX local office and was told that the parcel was
waiting at the airport for customs clearance and I have two options: 1. To
pick up the parcel at the airport (that is 100 km away from my town) and
pass the customs by myself, or otherwise, 2. To pay FEDEX $36 extra for they
do the customs formalities for me. I have very little experience with FEDEX,
but it seems to me to be a little costly. Besides, I was never told by the
sender that I should expect to pay extra for the delivery. (I put aside here
the fact that it took FEDEX about 10 days to deliver it to Israel.)  The
last thing is that I am pretty sure the components I purchased are free of
duties here.
My question is whether it is a usual practice to charge extra at point of
delivery or does this depend on particular country of delivery or is it just
some kind of misunderstanding.  I contacted the sender with these matters
and they ensured me that the problem will be solved with the FEDEX, but for
some reasons I am still in doubts about that.

Arkady.

2005\04\20@142601 by Marc Nicholas

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face
Yes, it's normal practise. And it has nothing at all to do with the sender
-- they have no control over Customs in your country.


-marc

On Tue, 19 Apr 2005, Arkady Skorokhod wrote:

{Quote hidden}

> -

2005\04\20@144526 by Mauricio Jancic

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face
Yes, something similar happened to me here in Argentina. If the parts you've
bought doesn't have to pay custom taxes you might consider going to the
airport....

Regards,

Mauricio Jancic
Janso Desarrollos - Microchip Consultants Program Member
spam_OUTinfoTakeThisOuTspamjanso.com.ar
http://www.janso.com.ar
(54) 11 - 4542 - 3519


> {Original Message removed}

2005\04\20@144627 by Mike Harrison

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On Tue, 19 Apr 2005 21:18:03 +0200, you wrote:

{Quote hidden}

This is common practice. I would guess that some of the $36 is duty/sales tax and the rest is
FEDEX's fee.  
This can be avoided/reduced by
(a) NOT using FEDEX,UPS etc. - normal Post office services usually have much lower fees.
(b) asking the sender to declare a suitably low value (or at least no more than the sales value).


2005\04\20@150317 by Spehro Pefhany

picon face
At 02:25 PM 4/20/2005 -0400, you wrote:
>Yes, it's normal practise. And it has nothing at all to do with the sender
>-- they have no control over Customs in your country.

Sometimes if you use a more expensive service from the courier they
include brokerage in the cost, but nobody includes taxes that your
government requires them to collect, and they typically want a bit more for
that service if it's dutiable. 10 days? Was this surface from Europe
or something?

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
.....speffKILLspamspam@spam@interlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com




2005\04\20@150709 by Herbert Graf

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On Wed, 2005-04-20 at 19:47 +0100, Mike Harrison wrote:
> This is common practice. I would guess that some of the $36 is duty/sales tax and the rest is
> FEDEX's fee.  
> This can be avoided/reduced by
> (a) NOT using FEDEX,UPS etc. - normal Post office services usually have much lower fees.
> (b) asking the sender to declare a suitably low value (or at least no more than the sales value).

Just want to add a few minor things:

First off, all of this is VERY dependant on the country you're in.

In my case FedEx is actually quite competitive in that they charge $7
for their brokerage fee. The post office charges $5. UPS is THE WORST,
charging $30 or more.

The $36 the original poster been quoted: if that includes both the
brokerage and taxes then it may be the best way to go. Even if you drive
to the airport to do your own brokerage you are STILL going to have to
pay the taxes.

Unfortunately there isn't really a way of avoiding this sort of stuff.
If it's a commercial sample having the sender label the goods as
"commercial sample, zero retail value" sometimes gets around the fees
(but not always).

TTYL


-----------------------------
Herbert's PIC Stuff:
http://repatch.dyndns.org:8383/pic_stuff/

2005\04\20@151338 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> My question is whether it is a usual practice to charge extra
> at point of
> delivery or does this depend on particular country of
> delivery or is it just
> some kind of misunderstanding.

Can't give a full answer, but for deliveries to me (Netherlands) I
either get the parcel without extra pay, or they charge me Sales Tax
(which I can claim back) and some extra ($10 or so) costs for this. The
$10 does not bother me because it is small compared to the value of the
parcels I order.

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2005\04\20@151457 by Marc Nicholas

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On Wed, 20 Apr 2005, Herbert Graf wrote:

> Unfortunately there isn't really a way of avoiding this sort of stuff.
> If it's a commercial sample having the sender label the goods as
> "commercial sample, zero retail value" sometimes gets around the fees
> (but not always).

And, unfortunately, trying to do this on real shipments or getting the
sender to mislabel/misprice stuff is technically Customs fraud pretty much
everywhere in the developed world. If you're a small guy, you'll get
away...but if you're involved in quite a bit of import/export, then things
will go awry.


-marc

2005\04\20@152518 by Pierre Desrochers

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They certainly charge you to be your "Custom Broker".  The customs fees is irrelevant to the fact that they will do the brokerage for you.  When I purchase things like you I try to have a bunch sent at the same time because the brokerage fee is the same, wether the amount is very little or a bit higher.  To this you usually have to ADD the custom fees... but since there is none you only have to pay the broker's work.

Its not fun but I don't thinck there is a way around this.

Arkady Skorokhod wrote:

{Quote hidden}

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2005\04\20@152909 by Arkady Skorokhod

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Harrison" <mikespamKILLspamwhitewing.co.uk>
> This is common practice. I would guess that some of the $36 is duty/sales
tax and the rest is
> FEDEX's fee.
> This can be avoided/reduced by
> (a) NOT using FEDEX,UPS etc. - normal Post office services usually have
much lower fees.
> (b) asking the sender to declare a suitably low value (or at least no more
than the sales value).

A person from FEDEX I was talking with said that $36 is what I have to pay
toFEDEX and doesn't include the customs fee and VAT. It is not that I am
displeased with the fact I need to pay the duties.
It was the sender to insist on particular carrier.
The strange thing to me is that it seems that things with the same value
sent with ordinary post service pass through the costoms with no problems.

2005\04\20@154153 by Marc Nicholas

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Caveat empor, I'm afraid.

-marc

On Tue, 19 Apr 2005, Arkady Skorokhod wrote:

{Quote hidden}

> -

2005\04\20@154533 by Herbert Graf

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On Wed, 2005-04-20 at 15:14 -0400, Marc Nicholas wrote:
>
> On Wed, 20 Apr 2005, Herbert Graf wrote:
>
> > Unfortunately there isn't really a way of avoiding this sort of stuff.
> > If it's a commercial sample having the sender label the goods as
> > "commercial sample, zero retail value" sometimes gets around the fees
> > (but not always).
>
> And, unfortunately, trying to do this on real shipments or getting the
> sender to mislabel/misprice stuff is technically Customs fraud pretty much
> everywhere in the developed world. If you're a small guy, you'll get
> away...but if you're involved in quite a bit of import/export, then things
> will go awry.

Yes, I STRONGLY recommend against, no matter how tempting it may be,
getting your packages labelled incorrectly in order to "get around" the
fees. It's dangerous for your sender, and can even be dangerous for you.

That said, there's nothing wrong with getting the sender to PROPERLY
label the shipment to your advantage. If you are receiving commercial
samples it should be labelled as such. If it's a gift it should be
labelled as such (most countries have a free "gift allowance" up to a
certain value). TTYL


-----------------------------
Herbert's PIC Stuff:
http://repatch.dyndns.org:8383/pic_stuff/

2005\04\21@011259 by SM Ling

picon face
You have to specify the delivery clearly either to:
1. your airport
2. your door

I was hit recently even after I had specified the destination to an address.

Now you have not too many options, except you can ask Fedex to do a reverse
charge (if they allow) but this will affect the relationship with your
seller if they are not agreeable to that.

But first ask your seller if he had specified a door-to-door delivery, or
had forgotten to specified a door-to-door service.

If there is no mistake and if you want the goods, you better clear it fast,
else there will be additional holding-fee, etc being imposed.  Asking
another courier to clear might have you incurr other charges from Fedex as
well.

Sound like "exhortion"?  Close.

Sometime it amazes me that some businesses totaly do not care about ease and
cost of payment and delivery to the buyers.  Guess, they do not and will not
have feedback for them as well.

Ling SM


2005\04\21@025514 by ThePicMan

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At 21.18 2005.04.19 +0200, you wrote:
>Hello all.
>
>Maybe someone can advice me on the following situation. I purchased some
>modules from one firm in Italy which were to be shipped by FEDEX to Israel.
>I was charged by the sender for amount of $65 for FEDEX delivery. Yesterday
>I was called from FEDEX local office and was told that the parcel was
>waiting at the airport for customs clearance and I have two options: 1. To
>pick up the parcel at the airport (that is 100 km away from my town) and
>pass the customs by myself, or otherwise, 2. To pay FEDEX $36 extra for they
>do the customs formalities for me. I have very little experience with FEDEX,
>but it seems to me to be a little costly. Besides, I was never told by the
>sender that I should expect to pay extra for the delivery.

Was your mind ever crossed by the thought that maybe the sender didn't know
this?


>(I put aside here
>the fact that it took FEDEX about 10 days to deliver it to Israel.)  The
>last thing is that I am pretty sure the components I purchased are free of
>duties here.
>My question is whether it is a usual practice to charge extra at point of
>delivery or does this depend on particular country of delivery or is it just
>some kind of misunderstanding.  I contacted the sender with these matters
>and they ensured me that the problem will be solved with the FEDEX, but for
>some reasons I am still in doubts about that.

You may think all the worst about the sender, but to me it's all regular.


>Arkady.



2005\04\21@092716 by Gerhard Fiedler

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ThePicMan wrote:

> Arkady Skorokhod wrote:
>> Maybe someone can advice me on the following situation. I purchased some
>> modules from one firm in Italy which were to be shipped by FEDEX to
>> Israel. I was charged by the sender for amount of $65 for FEDEX
>> delivery. Yesterday I was called from FEDEX local office and was told
>> that the parcel was waiting at the airport for customs clearance and I
>> have two options: 1. To pick up the parcel at the airport (that is 100
>> km away from my town) and pass the customs by myself, or otherwise, 2.
>> To pay FEDEX $36 extra for they do the customs formalities for me. I
>> have very little experience with FEDEX, but it seems to me to be a
>> little costly. Besides, I was never told by the sender that I should
>> expect to pay extra for the delivery.
>
> Was your mind ever crossed by the thought that maybe the sender didn't
> know this?

Good question. Most transportation companies don't really know about these
procedures in other countries all that well. You wonder why, as it should
be easy to generate an up-to-date database of this data for internationally
operating companies, but it doesn't seem to be the rule.  

For that reason, most merchants explicitly exclude all things involved with
customs and international delivery (both cost and time) from their
responsibility in their general conditions. So usually the burden to know
how the different carriers handle such things in your country -- and to add
that to the charged cost and given time frame, generating the real cost and
time frame -- is on you.

This depends of course on your contract with the seller. If he promised you
door-to-door delivery for that fee he charged you, then he should pick up
this extra cost. If not, then you may have "an angle" here. But it is
probable that the sender is just as surprised as you are. Most businesses
without experience with sending to a particular country don't know a lot
about how that works, and as I said above, the carriers are not much help
with that.

That goes for both the private ones and the postal services. I have quite a
few stories about that. Like never go to a USPS agency for an international
shipment without a previously researched clear idea of how you want to ship
it, and with the appropriate rules documents printed from the web with you.
Without that, it's quite likely that they tell you crap like "we don't
insure international shipments" (when of course they do) or "estimated time
for delivery 10 days" (when reality is closer to 20 to 30 days or more).


>> (I put aside here the fact that it took FEDEX about 10 days to deliver
>> it to Israel.)  The last thing is that I am pretty sure the components
>> I purchased are free of duties here.

"Free of duty" doesn't necessarily mean "free of customs processing". As
you are saying, the $36 Fedex wants to charge you are not customs duty,
they are a customs processing fee. For which they offer you the possibility
to do it yourself. It's always a pain to be between a rock (pay $36) and a
hard place (drive to the airport and deal with the hassle), but take this
as one of the -- sometimes painful -- steps on the way of learning how to
(and how not to!) get stuff into your country :)


>> My question is whether it is a usual practice to charge extra at point
>> of delivery or does this depend on particular country of delivery or is
>> it just some kind of misunderstanding.  

It is customary that private carriers charge for customs processing. The
fees vary a lot between carriers and countries. Usually postal services
charge much lower fees or don't charge at all (for the processing, that
is). In some cases there is a chance that packages sent with postal service
packages don't get charged customs duty, whereas private carriers seem to
always get charged.


>> I contacted the sender with these matters and they ensured me that the
>> problem will be solved with the FEDEX, but for some reasons I am still
>> in doubts about that.
>
> You may think all the worst about the sender, but to me it's all
> regular.

So it looks to me. I'm not sure the sender can do much about this, unless
Fedex assured him (in writing?) that there would be door-to-door delivery
without further charges. If not, probably the only thing the sender could
do is pick up the tab for you -- which depends on your relationship with
the sender, both contractual and otherwise.

Gerhard

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