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'[OT]: Desert Island scenario- input solicited.'
2005\08\11@110624 by Spehro Pefhany

picon face
There are some very innovative minds here, hope you could provide some
input to this almost-hypothetical scenario.

Imagine the following situation-- you know you are going to be spending 6
months on a remote desert island. The island has sufficient resources which
will provide you with your shelter, food, clothing, and medical requirements,
but anything else (including Internet access) is spotty (slow, expensive).
The inhabitants are not likely to speak much English.

What would you bring with you to make life more interesting/productive/
enjoyable? You have only one week to prepare, purchase or gather whatever it
is, so scanning very much of your dead-tree library is out. You are limited
to, say, 20-30kg weight and commensurate volume.

Appreciate any suggestions!

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
spam_OUTspeffTakeThisOuTspaminterlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com
->> Inexpensive test equipment & parts http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZspeff


2005\08\11@111831 by Mike Hord

picon face
> Imagine the following situation-- you know you are going to be spending 6
> months on a remote desert island. The island has sufficient resources which
> will provide you with your shelter, food, clothing, and medical requirements,
> but anything else (including Internet access) is spotty (slow, expensive).
> The inhabitants are not likely to speak much English.

How's the power supply?

> What would you bring with you to make life more interesting/productive/
> enjoyable? You have only one week to prepare, purchase or gather whatever it
> is, so scanning very much of your dead-tree library is out. You are limited
> to, say, 20-30kg weight and commensurate volume.

For myself, I'd say a laptop with as many books as I can download free off
the internet, plus the best possible astronomy program I can find, the best
possible book on astronomy I can find, and the best telescope I can fit into
the allotted space.  A remote, techno-spotty desert island is liable to have
OUTSTANDING star viewing opportunities.

Also my MP3 player, to cure the "can't get that song out of my head"
moments, and my "pocket sized" travel hammock.

Last, but not least, I'd go for some good fishing gear.  Never had much
chance to fish on desert islands, but sitting and staring at a pole is
often good for a few hours of diversion...

Eliminate items in order they appear in this list.

Mike H.

2005\08\11@111859 by David Van Horn

picon face

What would you bring with you to make life more interesting/productive/
enjoyable? You have only one week to prepare, purchase or gather
whatever it
is, so scanning very much of your dead-tree library is out. You are
limited
to, say, 20-30kg weight and commensurate volume.

25 kilos of $100 bills wouldn't suck..

The question seems ill-formed somehow, like you're trying to get away
from the vacation. I'd be very tempted to leave everything beyond cash,
ID, and a passport at home.


2005\08\11@112844 by Ian Smith-Heisters

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Yeah! A week on a desert island with no internet and no one speaking
English sounds pretty darn good. I think I could definitely enjoy a week
of nothing but swimming, eating and lazing in the sun. Shoot, I could
probably do that for the rest of my life.. If you don't find yourself
that entertaining, it's a good opportunity to learn a new language and
make some desert island friends. Unfortunately, I think I weigh more
than 20-30kg, so I don't think I could tag along ;)

-Ian

David Van Horn wrote:
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2005\08\11@113233 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> but anything else (including Internet access) is spotty
> (slow, expensive).
> The inhabitants are not likely to speak much English.

You did not rule out that they might speak Dutch, but what about a good
course on the language they happen to be speaking?

> What would you bring with you to make life more
> interesting/productive/ enjoyable?

A lot of writing stuff, or a notebook to take notes, or a big-memory
memorecorder?

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2005\08\11@113248 by Alan B. Pearce

face picon face
>For myself, I'd say a laptop with as many books as I can download
>free off the internet, plus the best possible astronomy program I
>can find, the best possible book on astronomy I can find, and the
>best telescope I can fit into the allotted space.  A remote,
>techno-spotty desert island is liable to have OUTSTANDING star
>viewing opportunities.

If taking that load, then add a PCMCIA card GPS - if only because it will
probably become the most accurate timepiece you have. I guess one would also
need some form of solar cell array to recharge the battery, or may be one
has some scheme to use a small motor in reverse driven by a mountain stream.
;))

But I was realistically thinking of a reel of wire and a ham radio
transceiver. If you are that out of the way then any contest will heap
points on you for QRP contacts, and you will be in demand because you are
out of the way.

2005\08\11@113922 by Rolf

face picon face
Spehro Pefhany wrote:

> ....
> What would you bring with you to make life more interesting/productive/
> enjoyable? You have only one week to prepare, purchase or gather
> whatever it
> is, so scanning very much of your dead-tree library is out. You are
> limited
> to, say, 20-30kg weight and commensurate volume.
>
> Appreciate any suggestions!
>
http://www.gutenberg.org/robot/#offline

Rolf

2005\08\11@115057 by Spehro Pefhany

picon face
At 10:18 AM 8/11/2005 -0500, you wrote:


>25 kilos of $100 bills wouldn't suck..

Well, yes, but say money isn't really an issue.

>The question seems ill-formed somehow, like you're trying to get away
>from the vacation. I'd be very tempted to leave everything beyond cash,
>ID, and a passport at home.

In this part of the world, a week or three is a vacation.
This is 6 months of your life, away from friends, family, business/job, and
everything else familiar.

Plus, it's a pretty boring island. You can walk from one side to the other
in a few hours.

Of course you could go to neighboring islands and/or get to know the natives,
but other than money that doesn't require much stuff brought with you.

Maybe maps and other detailed information that can be found much more
easily at home. Yes, that's a good train of thought you've set in motion.
Thanks.

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
.....speffKILLspamspam@spam@interlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com
->> Inexpensive test equipment & parts http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZspeff


2005\08\11@115341 by Mike Hord

picon face
> What would you bring with you to make life more interesting/productive/
> enjoyable? You have only one week to prepare, purchase or gather whatever it
> is, so scanning very much of your dead-tree library is out. You are limited
> to, say, 20-30kg weight and commensurate volume.

Oooh, I forgot an absolute essential:  info covering local wild edible
plants.  Unless it is a REALLY desert-ish desert island.

If power is available, get the PFAF database from pfaf.org; OW, find
a good book.  I wouldn't muck around with local power generation
(hydroelectric, solar, or thermoelectric) if local power wasn't available;
electronics tends to be too much of a PITA most of the time anyway.

Mike H.

2005\08\11@115732 by Tim N9PUZ

picon face
Spehro Pefhany wrote:
> There are some very innovative minds here, hope you could provide some
> input to this almost-hypothetical scenario.
>
> Imagine the following situation-- you know you are going to be spending 6
> months on a remote desert island. The island has sufficient resources which
> will provide you with your shelter, food, clothing, and medical
> requirements,
> but anything else (including Internet access) is spotty (slow, expensive).
> The inhabitants are not likely to speak much English.
>
> What would you bring with you to make life more interesting/productive/
> enjoyable? You have only one week to prepare, purchase or gather
> whatever it
> is, so scanning very much of your dead-tree library is out. You are limited
> to, say, 20-30kg weight and commensurate volume.
>
> Appreciate any suggestions!

You don't say anything about the power situation. I'd pack along a
small battery, solar panel, my portable HF radio, and some antenna
materials so I could be a "DXpedition" in my free time. If it's a rare
location as far as ham radio contacts go there would be no shortage of
new friends waiting to chat.

Tim (Amateur Radio Station N9PUZ)

2005\08\11@115906 by Mike Hord

picon face
> In this part of the world, a week or three is a vacation.
> This is 6 months of your life, away from friends, family, business/job, and
> everything else familiar.
>
> Plus, it's a pretty boring island. You can walk from one side to the other
> in a few hours.

Did you get transferred to Nauru?

Mike H.

2005\08\11@120207 by Ian Smith-Heisters

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Spehro Pefhany wrote:

> Maybe maps and other detailed information that can be found much more
> easily at home. Yes, that's a good train of thought you've set in motion.
> Thanks.

The best way to get to know a place is to get a little lost. At a few
hours walking distance the whole way across, it's enormously unlikely
you'd get dangerously lost.

I thought it was a week. If it were 6 months, I might bring a good knife
and some sunscreen. If you get really bored you could use the knife to
play robinson crusoe, make a raft and sail around the island. And 6
months is definitely enough time to become fluent in whatever language
they speak (it's an immersion program!).

The more your activities depend on what's already on the island, rather
than bringing in all sorts of gizmos (I see no one's suggested an XBox
360 yet), the more you'll get to experience the place and the sense of
having gone somewhere, rather than the same old tricks with a new backdrop.

but maybe I'm just a weirdo.

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part 2 35 bytes content-type:text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
(decoded 7bit)

2005\08\11@122845 by Michael Rigby-Jones

picon face


{Quote hidden}

A digital camera, a stack of flash memory card and batteries.

Regards

Mike

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2005\08\11@123710 by M. Adam Davis

face picon face
I'd bring materials to do things I never get time to do but I'm
interested in.  I've always wanted to make my own hammock.  It would
be fun/interesting/useless to build wind or water machines that do
"useful" work.  Ever since I saw the weight powered ceiling fan in
mosquito coast I've thought it would be fun to do.  Astronomy would be
fun.  Take a simple telescope, and bring the bare materials and
instructions on making a much larger telescope and possibly an
observatory.  Build a loom.  Automate it with punch cards.

I'm always tempted to improve my surroundings.  I'd like to find out
what is spotty about the various services/resources, and see what I
can do during my stay to improve the conditions.

There are lots of things that are too time consuming or impractical to
undertake here that I would love to occupy my time with.  But here -
if I make $60/hr on a client's project, a hammock costs $25, and it
would take me many hours to make my own, then practically, frugally,
etc I choose to work.

Take some model rocket or boat kits.  Do some kite photography.  Grow
a garden (use native plants - don't import your own!)  Write letters,
try drawing (improve your handwriting and drawing skills).
Photography (bring a digital camera and a bunch of memory cards.
don't worry about backups).  Bring a book on plants and a medical
guide for hiking.  More than one pair of good shoes.  Attempt to build
your own forge, then lathe and milling machine powered by the river...
:)

Lots of options...  Tell us how it all goes!

-Adam

On 8/11/05, Spehro Pefhany <EraseMEspeffspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTinterlog.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2005\08\11@130033 by Lindy Mayfield

flavicon
face
You will need an English/Native dictionary or some such for communicating with the natives.

-----Original Message-----
From: @spam@piclist-bouncesKILLspamspammit.edu [KILLspampiclist-bouncesKILLspamspammit.edu] On Behalf Of Spehro Pefhany
Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 6:13 PM
To: Microcontroller discussion list - Public.
Subject: [OT]: Desert Island scenario- input solicited.

There are some very innovative minds here, hope you could provide some
input to this almost-hypothetical scenario.

Imagine the following situation-- you know you are going to be spending 6
months on a remote desert island. The island has sufficient resources which
will provide you with your shelter, food, clothing, and medical requirements,
but anything else (including Internet access) is spotty (slow, expensive).
The inhabitants are not likely to speak much English.

What would you bring with you to make life more interesting/productive/
enjoyable? You have only one week to prepare, purchase or gather whatever it
is, so scanning very much of your dead-tree library is out. You are limited
to, say, 20-30kg weight and commensurate volume.

Appreciate any suggestions!

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
RemoveMEspeffTakeThisOuTspaminterlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com
->> Inexpensive test equipment & parts http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZspeff


2005\08\11@132305 by James Newton, Host

face picon face
CD copy of piclist.com
http://www.piclist.com/dontripthissite.htm#cd


Of course...

---
James.



> {Original Message removed}

2005\08\11@134559 by Spehro Pefhany

picon face
At 10:22 AM 8/11/2005 -0700, you wrote:
>CD copy of piclist.com
>http://www.piclist.com/dontripthissite.htm#cd

James, have you thought of putting it on a DVD? They're like 30 cents
each now, probably cheaper than two CDs.

Anyway, I've ordered a set, thanks ;-)

Best regards,

Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..."            "The Journey is the reward"
spamBeGonespeffspamBeGonespaminterlog.com             Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog  Info for designers:  http://www.speff.com
->> Inexpensive test equipment & parts http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZspeff


2005\08\11@140123 by Wouter van Ooijen

face picon face
> Subject: RE: [OT]: Desert Island scenario- input solicited.

towel and toothbrush?

Wouter van Ooijen

-- -------------------------------------------
Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl
consultancy, development, PICmicro products
docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu


2005\08\11@141537 by Marcel Duchamp

picon face
Wouter van Ooijen wrote:
>>Subject: RE: [OT]: Desert Island scenario- input solicited.
>
>
> towel and toothbrush?
>
> Wouter van Ooijen


Close...
Towel and HHGG (or at least HHDI)

2005\08\11@143519 by Marcel Duchamp

picon face
>
> Close...
> Towel and HHGG (or at least HHDI)

Ooops.  That should have beedn HHGDI: Hitch Hikers Guide to Desert Islands.

2005\08\11@160524 by Richard Prosser

picon face
Brewing materials unless it's available locally.!
RP

On 12/08/05, Marcel Duchamp <TakeThisOuTmarcel.duchampEraseMEspamspam_OUTsbcglobal.net> wrote:
> >
> > Close...
> > Towel and HHGG (or at least HHDI)
>
> Ooops.  That should have beedn HHGDI: Hitch Hikers Guide to Desert Islands.
> -

2005\08\11@162610 by Philip Pemberton

face picon face
In message <RemoveME5.1.1.5.2.20050811110101.040cc618spamTakeThisOuTmail.interlog.com>>          Spehro Pefhany <speffEraseMEspam.....interlog.com> wrote:

> What would you bring with you to make life more interesting/productive/
> enjoyable? You have only one week to prepare, purchase or gather whatever it
> is, so scanning very much of your dead-tree library is out. You are limited
> to, say, 20-30kg weight and commensurate volume.

I'd find out what language the locals speak and attempt to learn it and
whatever rules/customs they may have. No use insulting the locals on your
first day if you have to spend six months on said island. Info on
locally-available edible plants and such would also be very useful.

That and I'd take my Toughbook, a solar panel, my Mindisc recorder, a camera
(and plenty of film), a few astronomy books and starcharts, a small telescope
(maybe) and some astronomy software. Oh, and GPS - an eTrex or something like
that - if only for the clock and compass. No use trying to find a star if you
don't know which direction you're supposed to be looking in, and what time it
is.

If I could squeeze it in, I'd also see about taking some form of radio
transceiver.

Later.
--
Phil.                              | Acorn RiscPC600 SA220 64MB+6GB 100baseT
EraseMEphilpemspamphilpem.me.uk              | Athlon64 3200+ A8VDeluxe R2 512MB+100GB
http://www.philpem.me.uk/          | Sony MZ-N710 NetMD Minidisc
... It's dangerous to be right when the government is wrong. -Voltaire-

2005\08\11@163617 by Philip Pemberton

face picon face
In message <RemoveME23075D38FE1C8144847DFAECA3565F2704E54F6AEraseMEspamEraseMEpai-smx-01.europe.bkhm.net>>          "Michael Rigby-Jones" <RemoveMEMichael.Rigby-Jonesspam_OUTspamKILLspambookham.com> wrote:

> A digital camera, a stack of flash memory card and batteries.

I'd take a 35mm SLR (an Olympus OM-series - an OM2sp if I had one, but I've
only got an OM10 at the mo) and a few boxes of film. That way instead of
carting round a load of AAs, you keep a pair of coin cells in your shirt
pocket. Given the fact that batteries in OMs tend to last around five years,
you're unlikely to need them.

The only disadvantage with film is that it needs to be developed and
printed. The advantage is that you can do far more with it - most digital
SLRs are pretty inflexible compared to their film-based "brothers".

Later.
--
Phil.                              | Acorn RiscPC600 SA220 64MB+6GB 100baseT
RemoveMEphilpemTakeThisOuTspamspamphilpem.me.uk              | Athlon64 3200+ A8VDeluxe R2 512MB+100GB
http://www.philpem.me.uk/          | Sony MZ-N710 NetMD Minidisc
... Anything worth doing is worth overdoing.

2005\08\11@171106 by Michael Rigby-Jones

picon face


>-----Original Message-----
>From: EraseMEpiclist-bouncesspamspamspamBeGonemit.edu [RemoveMEpiclist-bouncesKILLspamspammit.edu]
>Sent: 11 August 2005 21:33
>To: piclistSTOPspamspamspam_OUTmit.edu
>Subject: RE: [OT]: Desert Island scenario- input solicited.
>
>
>
>The only disadvantage with film is that it needs to be
>developed and printed. The advantage is that you can do far
>more with it - most digital SLRs are pretty inflexible
>compared to their film-based "brothers".

Only disadvantage? ;)

I'd be the first the state the advantages of film for many applications but OTOH:

You can only use it once One 36 exposure film plus developing would go a good way towards a useable sized memory card (256MB can be had for ~£10)
It has a finite shelf life It doesn't like to get too hot.
Changing films in bright sunlight is a little risky.
You have to endure the pain of scanning pictures if you want to put them on the web.

IMO Digital cameras are eminently useable on vacations (as I'm sure Russell will agree!).

Regards

Mike

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information contained in it may be confidential and/or protected by
law. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, you must
not make any use of this information, or copy or show it to any
person. Please contact us immediately to tell us that you have
received this e-mail, and return the original to us. Any use,
forwarding, printing or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.
No part of this message can be considered a request for goods or
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=======================================================================

2005\08\11@191233 by Philip Pemberton

face picon face
In message <spamBeGone23075D38FE1C8144847DFAECA3565F2704E54F6DSTOPspamspamEraseMEpai-smx-01.europe.bkhm.net>>          "Michael Rigby-Jones" <KILLspamMichael.Rigby-JonesspamBeGonespambookham.com> wrote:

> Only disadvantage? ;)

Only major disadvantage.

> One 36 exposure film plus developing would go a good way towards a useable
> sized memory card (256MB can be had for ~£10)

Not in my neck of the woods... My digicam uses SmartMedia cards, which seem
to cost a lot more than the equivalent SD or CompactFLASH card.

> It has a finite shelf life

But it can be extended to some degree if the film is kept in a cool place.

> It doesn't like to get too hot.

See above.

> Changing films in bright sunlight is a little risky.

So crouch down, make sure the camera is shadowed by your body, then pop the
cover and unload it. No biggie.

> You have to endure the pain of scanning pictures if you want to put them on
> the web.

But you get better quality if you want biiig enlargements.

> IMO Digital cameras are eminently useable on vacations (as I'm sure Russell
> will agree!).

.. But they don't work as well as film in the dark. Ever tried to photograph
star trails with a digicam? Given that even the most espensive dSLRs can't
manage exposure times over 1/10sec without massive amounts of CCD noise, I
think film still wins here :)

Yes, I know you can bolt a Peltier onto the CCD to keep the noise down, but
who wants to carry the huge battery required to run said Peltier heat pump?

Later.
-- Phil.                              | Acorn RiscPC600 SA220 64MB+6GB 100baseT
EraseMEphilpemspamEraseMEphilpem.me.uk              | Athlon64 3200+ A8VDeluxe R2 512MB+100GB
http://www.philpem.me.uk/          | Sony MZ-N710 NetMD Minidisc
... Taglines that make you go "Hmmm...

2005\08\11@193020 by Russell McMahon

face
flavicon
face
Ian

FYI
Your last 4 posts to PICList, starting 29 July, have appeared to my
system as attachments with a signature also as an attachment. This
tends to greatly reduce the number of people who will read your posts
and makes it harder for people to do so.

This problem has appeared before for other people - AFAIR it affects
only some receiving clients and is caused by the enabling of the
signature at your end. If you're happy with this arrangement that's
fine but if the signature is not crucial to you you may want to
disable it.

I use (gasp) Outlook Express and I know it affects some other clients
as well but I don't recall which OTTOMH.


           RM


This is how your message appeared to me:



----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian Smith-Heisters" <@spam@heisters@spam@spamspam_OUT0x09.com>
To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." <spamBeGonepiclistspamKILLspammit.edu>
Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 4:01 AM
Subject: Re: [OT]: Desert Island scenario- input solicited.


> --

2005\08\11@193028 by John J. McDonough

flavicon
face
----- Original Message -----
From: "Philip Pemberton" <.....philpemspam_OUTspamdsl.pipex.com>
Subject: RE: [OT]: Desert Island scenario- input solicited.


> So crouch down, make sure the camera is shadowed by your body, then pop
> the
> cover and unload it. No biggie.

Along with the above hassles, why put up with it?

> But you get better quality if you want biiig enlargements.

Maybe once upon a time.  Sure, if you use a 4x5 camera and Kodachrome it's
hard to beat, but today's 4 MP cameras beat out 35mm with high speed film,
and more and more 8Mp is becoming common.  It will run circles around small
format negatives.

> .. But they don't work as well as film in the dark. Ever tried to
> photograph
> star trails with a digicam? Given that even the most espensive dSLRs can't
> manage exposure times over 1/10sec without massive amounts of CCD noise, I
> think film still wins here :)

Again, they are getting their act together.  I took some pix of auroras last
fall, and was amazed at the beautiful images of the Pleadies on the frames.

> Yes, I know you can bolt a Peltier onto the CCD to keep the noise down,
> but
> who wants to carry the huge battery required to run said Peltier heat
> pump?

Yeah - kinda like hydrogen treated film.  Don't need to do that stuff
anymore.

--McD

2005\08\11@201551 by Russell McMahon

face
flavicon
face
I'd take a camera (of course), redundant backup storage for images
(one copy is not enough),"adequate" computer, adequate power system
for PC and camera use (solar? / Stirling?/ wind?). Voice recording
capability (possibly already in camera.)

Machette. Useful knives. Quantity of highish tech ropes/cord assuming
this is not available locally. (Rafts, fishing, climbing, making
stuff). Compass! Possibly GPS depending. GOOD map(s). Blowup boat
thingy if boats not available (with due regard to safety). A few good
books of more than read once interest. Whatever I can load onto PC in
relevant or irrelevant material. Small low volume/weight high
capability electronic design/create/repair facility (Waddya mean the
battery terminal's broken off and there's no way to repair it? / ...)
Decent footwear! - maybe not boots but suitable for reefs, jungle,
snakes, ... . Mosquito net. Fish net. Fishing line (although not a
fisherman). Good torcheS (LED head torch with widely variable power
output capability). General purpose repair capability -  glue, sewing
kit, basic patching material.

Goretex 2 layer (light) coat and trousers. Survival bag suitable for
sleeping out in. Enough good suntan lotion.

Material that may be of interest/value to locals. Dictionary. Key
facts re island and people.

More.

With some intelligent compromises the above should be well under 30 kg
and I can think of more. More knowledge would shape final choice.


>> You have to endure the pain of scanning pictures if you want to put
>> them on
>> the web.
>
> But you get better quality if you want biiig enlargements.

Depends on the camera. It is a (perhaps sad) fact that a modern higher
end DSLR (perhapsas low as $US1000) can resolve more line pairs per
inch than top end 35mm film. This has been the case for several years
now, but the price has been dropping rapidly. I have a Minolta 7Hi
where it is NOT true but only the best film cameras in the hands of
experts produce better photos than I can produce (even though I often
don't ;-) ).

Photos I take at weddings (informally and semi-formally) are often as
good as any taken by professional photographers.
The 7Hi largely suffers in sensitivity against it's dearer newer
brothers but this is usually not an issue in most daylight situations.

It's biggest loss against film is dynamic range.
It's biggest gain is just about everything else.

I still have my much loved Minolta SRT303B dinosaur, but it has not
taken a photo in years.

>> IMO Digital cameras are eminently useable on vacations (as I'm sure
>> Russell
>> will agree!).

Indeed. And in many many other places.
I now have over 100,000 "photos" on disk for instantish access.

> .. But they don't work as well as film in the dark. Ever tried to
> photograph
> star trails with a digicam? Given that even the most espensive dSLRs
> can't
> manage exposure times over 1/10sec without massive amounts of CCD
> noise, I
> think film still wins here :)

Granted, but for all except extreme cases such as star trails nightime
photography is easier with a good digicam (including mine).
I get extremely acceptable night-time shots. Firework displays are
easily handled. Exposures out to 10 seconds, which are usually
adequate, produce very acceptable results. A tripod helps ;-).

> Yes, I know you can bolt a Peltier onto the CCD to keep the noise
> down, but
> who wants to carry the huge battery required to run said Peltier
> heat pump?

Ooh. Me. Yes please! :-)
I'd love a Peltier option to improve low light performance.
I have up to 800 ASAbut it's junk noisewise. At 400 ASA it's less than
OK.
200 ASA is good to excellent. 100 ASA ditto.
The single thing I'd most like is better night time noise performance.
I'd be prepared to lug around a Peltier for that if that was the best
way to do it. Start trails would be nice :-).

All up, I'd never go back to film in the 35mm class, nice as it is. I
MIGHT be persuaded that 1/4 plate or better was still worth having
film for, but overall the advantages sof digital are substantial.

- See what you got, know exactly what you are getting.. Utterly
invaluable.

- Large portable capacity. I carry about 2.5 GB of Flash camera
storage at present :-). When in vacation in a strange land mode I take
around 1000 pictures per day. About 30 rolls 35mm x 36exp equivalent.
You could start to tell me all the reasons why I shouldn't or don't
need to, but I want to, I can and I do. And my greatest regret from a
9 week 25 country 44,000 photo world tour was that I didn't take more
photos! madness? You bet! Memories? You bet!!!

- Rapid shots, wide control of settings (even though there's only
aperture, speed and focal length :-)).
(Contrast, sharpness, filters, ...)

More - gotta go .....


       RM


2005\08\11@204340 by Ling SM

picon face
1.  Time to recharge! Exercise gears - restore the blood pressure,
colester, the weight to a healthy level so to benefit many more other 6
months later.

2.  All those learning video and software that I wanted to try.

Ling SM

Spehro Pefhany wrote:
{Quote hidden}

2005\08\11@223602 by Ling SM

picon face
>> What would you bring with you to make life more interesting/productive/
>> enjoyable? You have only one week to prepare, purchase or gather
>> whatever it
>> is, so scanning very much of your dead-tree library is out. You are
>> limited
>> to, say, 20-30kg weight and commensurate volume.

Now there is no excuses for not clearing the accumulated emails, ezines
and other digital contents. :-)

Ling SM

2005\08\12@014818 by William Chops Westfield

face picon face

On Aug 11, 2005, at 5:10 PM, Russell McMahon wrote:

> I'd take a camera .... Machette.

We don't have a clear indication of the ration of "survival gear" to
"don't get bored" gear required...  If I need a machette, I'm not sure
I want to take a computer...

Something no one has mentioned...  I'd go to the shoe store and try
to get a couple of my favorite style/make/model of "athletic" shoe.
I can make do with "local available stuff and activities" for a lot of
things, but shoes that I like tend to be difficult to find :-(

So, Russell: assume I take a digital camera but the resources for
backup storage and media are somewhat limited.  Do you get more
selective about the pictures you take and/or keep, or do you turn
down the resolution of the camera to get more pictures per gByte?

BillW

2005\08\12@030435 by Russell McMahon

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>> I'd take a camera .... Machette.
>
> We don't have a clear indication of the ration of "survival gear" to
> "don't get bored" gear required...  If I need a machette, I'm not
> sure
> I want to take a computer...

I assumed it was not an absolute survival situation as described,but
that you had to "make your own fun". In the given scenario, if I
couldn't be sure of getting one locally, I'd take a machette as well
as a camera. If one wants to build rafts or huts (not out of absolute
necessity but for fun with some seriousness, open coconuts, cut liana.
or do any too serious bush crashing and more, then a machette is your
friend. There are better tools for dedicated tasks but a machette is a
fairly good starting point when there's a weight budget.

> Something no one has mentioned...  I'd go to the shoe store and try
> to get a couple of my favorite style/make/model of "athletic" shoe.
> I can make do with "local available stuff and activities" for a lot
> of
> things, but shoes that I like tend to be difficult to find :-(

You didn't read ALL my post then :-)
I said
   > Decent footwear! - maybe not boots but
   > suitable for reefs, jungle, snakes, ...

Vital! As you say.

> So, Russell: assume I take a digital camera but the resources for
> backup storage and media are somewhat limited.  Do you get more
> selective about the pictures you take and/or keep, or do you turn
> down the resolution of the camera to get more pictures per gByte?

I do both when I must. But in such a unique situation as this I'd try
really hard not to be limited. 1 GB flash cards are about $US60. They
will hold about 800 to 1000 photos at the resolution and compression I
shoot. In a small location I wouldn't be shooting my full 1000 per day
:-). You can compress higher and/or use less pixels down to 100k per
picture and get reasonably OK results. I use a laptop for backup AND
burn CDs. A PC with DVD burner gives good backup capability.Fir around
$US400 you can get a portable backup unit that reads Flash cards,
talks USB, handles MP3 and voice record. This doesn't meet my dual
backup criterion but a secomd hard disk for it would.

1000 per daya is likely to be "slightly excessive" unless one was in
full holiday mode. That's 1 GB/day at std resolution or say a single
3.5" drive. Make that two for backup. Or DVDs x 40 or so !. HDD looks
attractive. Realisticaly with compression, discarding (never!) and
care far less capacity would be OK. I did 9 weeks around the world on
60 GB and about 80 CDs as backups.

FWIW - my dual backup philosophy was rididuled but ended up preventing
otherwise certain data loss on at least two occasions.

Solar is probably the most sensible power source in the time avaiable
for preparation given uncertainty about power. Maybe there's mains.
A windmill may give more power for weight. Getting one in a week to
suit one's need could be tight. I have a friend who designs and build
custom ones so I could achieve it but they are not common as small
portable lower power units.

I'm about to have quick look at using auto raidator fans as low power
windmills :-)

I like the telescope idea. I'd certainly have pocket binoculars.



       RM

2005\08\12@064638 by Mike Hawkshaw

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Well,

Assuming the locals are likely to be friendly, I would take the opportunity
to completely break with the western world (the hardest bit being leaving
the wife and kids at home) and make some new friends.

I would probably take a decent knife, and learn how to carve with it.

I would take some juggling balls, as this is a good way to learn to
communicate, and with 6 months practice, who knows, I could make a living at
it when I got back.

I think I would take my copy of Asley's Book of Knots and make the rest of
the weight up with a selection of good quality small cordage.

Sighs, when do I get to go?

Cheers...Mike.

> {Original Message removed}

2005\08\12@090355 by David Van Horn

picon face

At 10:22 AM 8/11/2005 -0700, you wrote:
>CD copy of piclist.com
>http://www.piclist.com/dontripthissite.htm#cd

James, have you thought of putting it on a DVD? They're like 30 cents
each now, probably cheaper than two CDs.

If you wanted to distribute the burning, I'd be willing to help.




2005\08\12@100429 by Hector Martin

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Most competent readers will/should present text attachments in-line.
At least mozilla does that. I see the attachment, but I can read it
in-line as if it wasn't.

Russell McMahon wrote:
{Quote hidden}

--
Hector Martin (TakeThisOuThector.....spamTakeThisOuTmarcansoft.com)
Public Key: http://www.marcansoft.com/hector.asc

2005\08\12@102425 by John Colonias

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Spehro,

If the weight limitation was not an issue I would have brought
my....girlfriend :)

Just kidding

Regards, John

{Original Message removed}

2005\08\12@123743 by Peter

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On Thu, 11 Aug 2005, Lindy Mayfield wrote:

> You will need an English/Native dictionary or some such for
> communicating with the natives.

The one built into $100 bills usually works fine.

Peter

2005\08\12@214139 by John Ferrell

face picon face
I was thinking a couple of dogs and a lot of beer...
John Ferrell    
http://DixieNC.US

----- Original Message -----
From: "John Colonias" <TakeThisOuTjcoloniasKILLspamspamspamrocketscienceinc.com>
To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." <.....piclistspamRemoveMEmit.edu>
Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 10:22 AM
Subject: RE: [OT]: Desert Island scenario- input solicited.


> Spehro,
>
> If the weight limitation was not an issue I would have brought
> my....girlfriend :)
>
> Just kidding
>
> Regards, John


2005\08\12@215122 by William Chops Westfield

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>> If the weight limitation was not an issue I would have brought
>> my....girlfriend :)
>>
Depending on your particular habits, and the social mores of the
destination, a supply of contraceptive/STD preventative devices
might be a good idea...  One hopes such things would be available
locally, but ...

BillW

2005\08\12@234519 by Russell McMahon

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> Most competent readers will/should present text attachments in-line.

Should, certainly.
But the dread Outlook Express has a(n un)fair share of the market, and
it doesn't do it.


       RM

2005\08\13@092055 by Gerhard Fiedler

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Peter wrote:

>> You will need an English/Native dictionary or some such for
>> communicating with the natives.
>
> The one built into $100 bills usually works fine.

That's the impression you can get if you don't stay long enough or look
close enough... When you want to get past these restrictions, a dictionary
and acquiring some basic native language skills help tremendously in seeing
why it usually didn't work "fine" :)

Gerhard

2005\08\13@131200 by Peter

picon face

On Sat, 13 Aug 2005, Gerhard Fiedler wrote:

> Peter wrote:
>
>>> You will need an English/Native dictionary or some such for
>>> communicating with the natives.
>>
>> The one built into $100 bills usually works fine.
>
> That's the impression you can get if you don't stay long enough or look
> close enough... When you want to get past these restrictions, a dictionary
> and acquiring some basic native language skills help tremendously in seeing
> why it usually didn't work "fine" :)

The way I would put it is, the exchange rate eventually gets translated
more accurately.

Peter

2005\08\15@035549 by Alan B. Pearce

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> .. But they don't work as well as film in the dark. Ever tried to
> photograph
> star trails with a digicam? Given that even the most espensive dSLRs
> can't
> manage exposure times over 1/10sec without massive amounts of CCD
> noise, I
> think film still wins here :)

I suggest you look at magazines like "Astronomy" and "Sky and Telescope" to
see just what sort of night images are being taken by readily available
digital cameras. A quick browse in your local bookshop or newsagents will
soon change your tune on this one.

2005\08\15@040239 by Alan B. Pearce

face picon face
>I'm about to have quick look at using auto
>raidator fans as low power windmills :-)

I have thought that automotive alternators would be a good unit for a
windmill. Hadn't thought about using a radiator fan to drive it - might not
have quite the horsepower though. I was thinking in terms of bigger blades
to get a full horsepower for the alternator (I happen to have an alternator
from a Triumph 2.5PI which is about the 750W mark).

2005\08\15@043920 by Russell McMahon

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flavicon
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> >I'm about to have quick look at using auto
>>raidator fans as low power windmills :-)
>
> I have thought that automotive alternators would be a good unit for
> a
> windmill. Hadn't thought about using a radiator fan to drive it -
> might not
> have quite the horsepower though.

Certainly wouldn't have!

I'm looking for a few watts.
Many remote projects would be happy at the watts level and solar can
be annoying at this level. While substituting  a mechanical solution
is probably not a good idea I'm interested to know how many watts can
be obtained easily with minimal equipment with output most of the
time. In may environments there is often at least a whisper of wind
and it should be easy enough to get power at the watt level from even
a gentle breeze.

To see how this compares with batteries, 1 watt for a year at 5 volts
= 1750 amp hours(!). An Alkaline AA delivers about 2 AH and for a 5
volt supply you'd need 6 of them with a linear regulator so in a year
that's 1750/2 * 6 =~ 5000 A Alkaline batteries (! again). You'd only
need about 700 D cells for the same job. Use an inverter to match load
voltage and you may get down to 500 D cells.

A windmill starts to sound attractive ;-)



       RM





2005\08\15@044436 by Howard Winter

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Alan,

On Mon, 15 Aug 2005 09:02:35 +0100, Alan B. Pearce wrote:

> >I'm about to have quick look at using auto
> >raidator fans as low power windmills :-)
>
> I have thought that automotive alternators would be a good unit for a
> windmill. Hadn't thought about using a radiator fan to drive it - might not
> have quite the horsepower though. I was thinking in terms of bigger blades
> to get a full horsepower for the alternator (I happen to have an alternator
> from a Triumph 2.5PI which is about the 750W mark).

I'm pretty sure you're right - wind generators that I've seen using car alternators seem to be about a metre
across.

Cheers,


Howard Winter
St.Albans, Herts


2005\08\15@050153 by Alan B. Pearce

face picon face
>I'm pretty sure you're right - wind generators that I've seen
>using car alternators seem to be about a metre across.

Yeah, big enough that the neighbours would be likely to object - but it
might take out a few pigeons that seem to like sitting around cooing at each
other.

2005\08\15@060959 by Andrew

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face


On Mon, 15 Aug 2005, Russell McMahon wrote:

> A windmill starts to sound attractive ;-)

There was a 4 part series of articles in Silicon Chip that used a washing
machine motor.

http://www.siliconchip.com.au/cms/A_103233/article.html

Andrew

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