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'[OT]:: Shanghai calling'
2008\06\19@082158 by Apptech

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I'm off to China Saturday evening (45 or so hours from now)
for one week
Only an internet away ... :-). Qingdao. Hotel internet is
good.

I'll be passing through Shanghai on the way back.
No other opportunities for touristing as my wife assure me
that I'm meeting the rest of the family in Brisbane to start
a long planned holiday.
I'm transiting between the two airports with a major aim of
riding the high speed maglev "Bullet Train" - probably the
fastest I will ever travel on land (or in this case JUST off
land).

Apart from that, what can I see most worthwhilely in
Shanghai in about 2 hours. I spent a few hours just walking
the city centre a few months back (many photos).

The Bund is said to be worth seeing - and I have no idea
what it offers in views, but will be then.
Any other encapsulated must do's for a whistle stop city
crossing tourist.



       Russell


2008\06\19@083457 by James Nick Sears

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Great, I want to go to China ASAP.  Do you do flickr (or other photo sharing)?

On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 8:21 AM, Apptech <spam_OUTapptechTakeThisOuTspamparadise.net.nz> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2008\06\19@095930 by Bob Ammerman

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> I'm off to China Saturday evening (45 or so hours from now)
> for one week
> Only an internet away ... :-). Qingdao. Hotel internet is
> good.

Enjoy.

My daughter (age 23) just moved to Qingdao to teach 4th graders at an
'ex-pat' school there. The school is run like an American school, using
California acedemic standards, and over half the students are Korean :-)
Qingdao has an 80,000 strong Korean ex-pat community.

My two younger children will be joining her for a summer adventure. They're
leaving next Tuesday.

My wife and I will be joining them in August for the older one's wedding to
a fine young Chinese man.

Very exciting indeed.

I'll ask my daughter about any 'must-see' things in Qingdao.

-- Bob Ammerman


2008\06\19@100009 by Alan B. Pearce

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>The Bund is said to be worth seeing - and I have no idea
>what it offers in views, but will be then.

My memories of being in the Bund in 1997, was looking across the river at
the Shanghai Tower and it nearly disappearing in the smog. When you see how
close it is across the river, you will appreciate my incredulousness at what
the air was like. Other than that I don't remember much of the visit, as it
was a pretty whirlwind trip that day, and I would have to go back and look
at photos to remember what we did see.

2008\06\19@100313 by gardenyu

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 I'm from Shanghai,although been in US for years, my opinions may well worth looking at.
My boss ( a pure US white man) wanted to visit China, he kept asking me: do you have enough hospitals? do you have church? etc. I always answer his questions with a little "anger". What his impression on China is still somewhat "from film". But nowadays, you may still find many ancient sightseeings like the Great Wall, but as to Shanghai, it is nothing different from other metropolitans all around the world. Given days, you may find that human nature is quite similar, maybe a little different in habits only.You may find quite some pros and cons about China, but take a little forgiveness, it's with a 1.5 billion population.
 As to the sightseeing in Shanghai. I would say you will find many architects realizing their dreams in China ( cheap labor!). If you are standing on the west coast of The Bund, on your side is what called "global exhibition", full of large buildings from different countries who invaded Shanghai before, but on the other end called "Pudong" across the river, you'll see all those modern miracles, like a huge TV tower, a 88-storeys building, etc. Ypu'd better arrive at night, the lights are just wonderful.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bund   If you have time, go have some good meals in Shanghai. We haven't had something called electrical engineering for thousands of years, during which we developed amazing cuisine styles. It is nothing like" sweet and sour chicken" and if you may spend just hundreds of bucks or pounds, you'll forget your "white bread" for the rest of life.
 Besides, Qingdao is famous for its beer and beach. And if you arrive at "Pudong international airport" in Shanghai, there is a Maglev outside who travels at 500 kilimeters an hour.
   

> Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 00:21:26 +1200> From: .....apptechKILLspamspam@spam@paradise.net.nz> Subject: [OT]:: Shanghai calling> To: PICLISTspamKILLspamMIT.EDU> > I'm off to China Saturday evening (45 or so hours from now) > for one week> Only an internet away ... :-). Qingdao. Hotel internet is > good.> > I'll be passing through Shanghai on the way back.> No other opportunities for touristing as my wife assure me > that I'm meeting the rest of the family in Brisbane to start > a long planned holiday.> I'm transiting between the two airports with a major aim of > riding the high speed maglev "Bullet Train" - probably the > fastest I will ever travel on land (or in this case JUST off > land).> > Apart from that, what can I see most worthwhilely in > Shanghai in about 2 hours. I spent a few hours just walking > the city centre a few months back (many photos).> > The Bund is said to be worth seeing - and I have no idea > what it offers in views, but will be then.> Any other encapsulated must do's for a whistle s
top city > crossing tourist.> > > > Russell> > > -- > http://www.piclist.com PIC/SX FAQ & list archive> View/change your membership options at> mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist
_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live Photo gallery 数码相机的超级伴侣,轻松管理和编辑照片,还能制作全景美图!
http://get.live.cn/product/photo.html

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2008\06\19@101549 by Apptech

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> Great, I want to go to China ASAP.  

Translate that ... ?

> Do you do flickr (or other photo sharing)?

More photos than you can shake many sticks at

   http://public.fotki.com/russellmc/

Not many China there yet.
16,000 + to choose from from my last 2 visits :-)

Around the world
27 countries and counting:

       http://public.fotki.com/russellmc/atw/

       R

2008\06\19@102116 by Apptech

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> I'll ask my daughter about any 'must-see' things in
> Qingdao.

Appreciated.
I'll be fairly busy there but any recommendation may help.

Replies after soon to

       apptechnz     at     gmail.com



       Russell

2008\06\19@134438 by Rich

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It has been my experience that people are often ignorant of the things about which they are curious. It is sometimes challenging to be patient but it is often the wise decision.  I have spent many years traveling and a great deal of time in China, I might add.  I found that many Chinese had preconceived notions of America that were simply untrue. But I could understand why.
   I have seen many changes in China over the years, especially in Shanghai and Beijing.  But the same is true for other Asian countries, time and technology brings change.  The fact that your boss is "pure white" probably has nothing to do with his curiosity. He has probably not taken the responsibility for educating himself and sees you as an immediate authority. I take it as a sign of respect for you. I found that learning Chinese was valuable but I only learned Mandarin.  I can only say a few words in Cantonese.  I was, in some ways, disappointed to see some of the very old part of Beijing (Peking) destroyed, but I suppose that is part of change. You might advise him to learn some of the basic characters and some basic conversation with attention to proper tones.  Unless he is going to do business or interact with officials, he only needs basic conversation skills. I think you have great advantages having Chinese language skills and English skills.  I have little Chinese way back in my background.  But I grew up in America and did not learn Chinese until I decided to go to China.


{Original Message removed}

2008\06\19@153921 by gardenyu

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I'm just having no advantage by speaking two languages, playing with schematics and layouts all day in my tiny dark office. I wish our products will be shipped to China and I could be some local product manager in the future.
I've seen so many cultural conflicts happening in China throughout these years, tradition, communist, capitalism....  Take Beijing as an example,  many traditional houses and walls were destroyed, with modern stadiums for Olympic Games built.  It's really hard to tell which way is right, I guess it's just some growing pains.



> From: .....rgrazia1KILLspamspam.....rochester.rr.com> To: EraseMEpiclistspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTmit.edu> Subject: Re: [OT]:: Shanghai calling> Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 13:40:58 -0400> > It has been my experience that people are often ignorant of the things about > which they are curious. It is sometimes challenging to be patient but it is > often the wise decision. I have spent many years traveling and a great deal > of time in China, I might add. I found that many Chinese had preconceived > notions of America that were simply untrue. But I could understand why.> I have seen many changes in China over the years, especially in Shanghai > and Beijing. But the same is true for other Asian countries, time and > technology brings change. The fact that your boss is "pure white" probably > has nothing to do with his curiosity. He has probably not taken the > responsibility for educating himself and sees you as an immediate authority. > I take it as a sign of respect for you. I found that learning Chinese was > valuable but I only le
arned Mandarin. I can only say a few words in > Cantonese. I was, in some ways, disappointed to see some of the very old > part of Beijing (Peking) destroyed, but I suppose that is part of change. > You might advise him to learn some of the basic characters and some basic > conversation with attention to proper tones. Unless he is going to do > business or interact with officials, he only needs basic conversation > skills. I think you have great advantages having Chinese language skills and > English skills. I have little Chinese way back in my background. But I > grew up in America and did not learn Chinese until I decided to go to China.> > > {Original Message removed}

2008\06\19@231151 by Rich

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My impression of you is that your are highly intelligent and perceptive. In time you will find the success you expect.  Do not lower your expectations and you can achieve all that you are capable of.  That will be much more than you may think. Tenacity is the key, and patience goes along with it. I too was somewhat disappointed to see some of old Peking disappear. I will get back next year.  I will spend most of my time in Beijing.  Keep your sights on your goals and work as though they are inevitable and they will be.
Rich


{Original Message removed}

2008\06\19@233128 by James Nick Sears

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On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 10:14 AM, Apptech <apptechspamspam_OUTparadise.net.nz> wrote:
>> Great, I want to go to China ASAP.
>
> Translate that ... ?

ASAP as in the literal sense of "as soon as possible".  Hopefully
within the next year or two.  Haven't been but have heard I absolutely
have to experience it.

{Quote hidden}

Great, thanks.  Will definitely give them a look.

-n.


>
>        R
>
> -

2008\06\20@022034 by David Meiklejohn

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gardenyu wrote:
>
> My boss ( a pure US white man) wanted to visit China, he kept asking me:
> do you have enough hospitals?

It's natural to worry about, if you got to another country, especially a
developing one, what happens if you get sick.  I'm sure that the hospitals
in China are generally good, but I know some expat westerners who live in
Shanghai, who will choose to travel back to Europe or the US if they need
major surgery.

> But nowadays, you may still find many ancient
> sightseeings like the Great Wall, but as to Shanghai, it is nothing
> different from other metropolitans all around the world. Given days, you
> may find that human nature is quite similar, maybe a little different in
> habits only.You may find quite some pros and cons about China, but take a
> little forgiveness, it's with a 1.5 billion population.

I live in Sydney, Australia, but I have been to Shanghai about a dozen
times now (for about a week at a time).  I agree that people are people,
although some small differences can be quite noticeable (and annoying).
For example, Chinese people don't do a lot of queuing.  When I'm at a
ticket window or something, and someone goes right in front of me, just as
I'm about to pay or step into the elevator or whatever, it strikes me as
being very rude.  But I know that it's not meant that way; it's just how
things are done.  A bit like how, when I'm eating and I hold food in my
hand instead of spitting bones onto the plate (or table!), Chinese people
I'm dining with will think me rude.

Partly it's those different "habits", like the fact that cars don't stop
for pedestrians at crossings, or the wild taxi rides from the airport,
that gives Shanghai quite a different feel to any Western city I've been
to, in the US, Europe, or Australia.  It has quite a different feel from
Hong Kong, as well.  So I don't agree with "nothing different from other
metropolitan (areas) around the world".

> As to the sightseeing in Shanghai. I would say you will find many
> architects realizing their dreams in China ( cheap labor!). If you are
> standing on the west coast of The Bund, on your side is what called
> "global exhibition", full of large buildings from different countries who
> invaded Shanghai before, but on the other end called "Pudong" across the
> river, you'll see all those modern miracles, like a huge TV tower, a
> 88-storeys building, etc. Ypu'd better arrive at night, the lights are
> just wonderful.

Yes, the Bund is a must-see.  Nighttime is best, but still worth a visit
during the day.  The only downside for me, in going places like that, is
that because I stand out as a westerner, I can't stand by the river,
looking at the view, for more than a minute or two before someone sticks a
wrist-full of watches in my face, asking "Omega?  Rolex?", or wanting me
to go look at their art exhibition, or asking to practice their english.
It's much more relaxing to wander about somewhere less touristy, where I
don't feel like a target for scammers.

> If you have time, go have some good meals in Shanghai. We haven't had
> something called electrical engineering for thousands of years, during
> which we developed amazing cuisine styles. It is nothing like" sweet and
> sour chicken" and if you may spend just hundreds of bucks or pounds,
> you'll forget your "white bread" for the rest of life.

I agree that the food is good (and many styles are available in Shanghai,
including Japanese and Western).  I've regularly been taken for expensive
Chinese banquets, where the food never seems to stop coming, as well as
cheap places, touristy ones (think Xintiandi) and in between.  And yet I'm
never as thrilled by the food as the locals are.  My team there will look
to me eagerly for approval when they do something like giving me the
fish's head because it's the best part, and I try to be polite and eat
some - and yes, much food there really is delicious.  And yet I always
look forward to the Western food I'm used to, when I go home.  People
can't help but get a taste for foods as they grow up - even "white bread".

In fact, after the last time I went to China (May), I quite literally
enjoyed eating some plain white bread, fresh from a bakery, when I got
home, because I suspect that something I ate in Hangzhou really didn't
agree with me!  :-)

Overall - China is well worth visiting - if you've only lived in the west,
you'll find it really different - quite an experience.


David Meiklejohn
http://www.gooligum.com.au

2008\06\20@134739 by Daniel Dourneau

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Don't blink, that trip is really fast.
Just a pity it leaves you miles from city centre...

At 14:21 19/06/2008, you wrote:
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>

2008\06\20@135026 by Daniel Dourneau

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The Bund (spectacular at night)
Yue Gardens fairly close by
Nanjing Street with the old Peace Hotel

If you had a free day you should do the trip to Suzhou

At 14:21 19/06/2008, you wrote:
{Quote hidden}

>

2008\06\20@164859 by Apptech

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> Don't blink, that trip is really fast.
> Just a pity it leaves you miles from city centre...

My KM 7D blinks for me at 4 frames a second :-)


       R

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