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'[OT]:: Another reason not to buy a Dell'
2007\04\16@015809 by Russell McMahon

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I post the warning below the "==========="  with the standard '"Caveat
Emptor" (and very much so in this case) but do check it's true for
yourself' warning.

For all I know this is just one far flung outpost of Dell reduced to
Lemming like Customer Service madness, but quite possibly not. Dell NZ
is, after all, just a plane ride or an email away from Dell HQ:

I lkk frward t a lt f interesting emails frm Rss in future. N dubt he
will in due curse learn t wrk arund his laptp's prblems and type wrds
that are cmprehensible r dn't cntain the letter "". S lk n the
brightside Rss - yur messages will frm nw n be mre cmpact and mre
concise and less redundant - so even Dell's strange plicies can have
their gd side. You shld hwever prbably wrk hard t avid using wrds like
lk, gbbledygk, mn, lt, spf, or the nmatapaic 'tttt' if yu want t cnvey
yr mesages unambigiusly.


If yu wan  al cmpacn yu culd lk a al diabling h ' ', ' ', ' '  and ' '
ky.



   gad


               ull McMahn

===========================================

>From a friend (who has told me how good Dell are every time I've told
him why he shouldn't buy them :-) ).
FWIW - I do have an ollld working Dell here amongst the various PCs.
Goes OK. Runs 24/7 and has given good service. The day it dies it's
dead.
_________

Russell,

Another reason not to buy a Dell  - not that you need one.

Dell "policy" is that they will now not sell spare parts.  This
obviously
represents some kind of change in policy since in the past we have
been able
to purchase a replacement power supply for our venereable Dell
Optiplex L60.

The only solution to Ross's problem with the dead "o" key on his
relatively
recent Dell 9300 laptop is apparently for him to renew the warranty
through
Dell  - and the person who told him that didn't know how long he would
have
to renew it for nor how much that would cost.

So much for customer service.

Please feel free to publish far and wide (though please cull my
contact
details)  - the only way to get companies with such a cavalier
attitude to
their customer's needs to listen is to expose their
consumer-unfriendly
practices.

Regards,

Ken


2007\04\16@095543 by Gerhard Fiedler

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Russell McMahon wrote:

> The only solution to Ross's problem with the dead "o" key on his
> relatively recent Dell 9300 laptop is apparently for him to renew the
> warranty through Dell  - and the person who told him that didn't know
> how long he would have to renew it for nor how much that would cost.

They (you) have a point. But I wouldn't buy a notebook (Dell or other)
without service contract -- for exactly this reason. It's easy to harp on
Dell, but what notebook manufacturer guarantees you that you can buy
replacement parts in 5 years for the notebook you buy tomorrow? And what
notebook manufacturer has a reasonably international next-day service
warranty for the time you need/want it?

Gerhard

2007\04\16@103740 by Matt Pobursky

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On Mon, 16 Apr 2007 10:55:25 -0300, Gerhard Fiedler wrote:
> Russell McMahon wrote:
>
>> The only solution to Ross's problem with the dead "o" key on his
>> relatively recent Dell 9300 laptop is apparently for him to renew the
>> warranty through Dell  - and the person who told him that didn't know
>> how long he would have to renew it for nor how much that would cost.
>>
>
> They (you) have a point. But I wouldn't buy a notebook (Dell or other)
> without service contract -- for exactly this reason. It's easy to harp on
> Dell, but what notebook manufacturer guarantees you that you can buy
> replacement parts in 5 years for the notebook you buy tomorrow? And what
> notebook manufacturer has a reasonably international next-day service
> warranty for the time you need/want it?

I've never had good luck with service contracts. Every time I've gotten one
either the unit has not failed or fails just after the contract expires...
;-)

Another alternative would be to search ebay for the same model laptop parts
unit or even the specific parts you're looking for (assuming you can
isolate what's wrong).

I've had very good luck keeping a Laserjet 4MV (and several other Laserjet
printers) alive this way. I picked up a reconditioned LJ4MV for about $250
and another $50 for a 500 sheet feeder about 2 years ago. I got a 2nd LJ4MV
as a "parts unit" and the repair manuals for all HP Laserjets on CDROM for
$5. So far, I've replaced the toner fuser assembly from the spares and that
saved me about $100. I expect to be using this printer for some time, it's
built like a tank.

Ebay can be a great source of replacement parts for computers and computer
equipment.

Matt Pobursky
Maximum Performance Systems


2007\04\16@120028 by Dwayne Reid

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Dell is actually a darned reasonable company to deal with.  Their
service / help phone lines are not wonderful but are at least as good
as any others that I've had to deal with lately.  Their parts
replacement program for machines that are under service contract is
simply stellar: the very few times I've needed parts, they've been
here in 2 days or so.

For machines that are outside of service contract, look for spare
parts on eBay.  I have been able to keep my trusty Inspiron 7500
laptops (2 of them) operational with no problem.  These laptops were
pretty decent when they were new in 1999 and are still quite usable
today (PIII 750).

Point is: I can still get hinges, keyboards, processor modules,
etc.  Even batteries are still available - both Dell and
generic.  That's almost 7 years after their manufacture date.

A good friend has an Acer that he can't get ANY parts for.  It has a
defective keyboard and neither he nor I have been able to find
suitable parts.  Not the manufacturer, not eBay, not anywhere.

To be sure, the fact that Dell parts are easily available on eBay is
something that Dell can't take credit for.  But I'll tell you this:
so long as I can continue to find parts for Dell computers and
laptops easily, I'll continue to purchase the machines and continue
to recommend their purchase to friends and businesses.

dwayne

At 10:26 PM 4/15/2007, Russell McMahon wrote:
>I post the warning below the "==========="  with the standard '"Caveat
>Emptor" (and very much so in this case) but do check it's true for
>yourself' warning.


--
Dwayne Reid   <spam_OUTdwaynerTakeThisOuTspamplanet.eon.net>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd    Edmonton, AB, CANADA
(780) 489-3199 voice          (780) 487-6397 fax

Celebrating 22 years of Engineering Innovation (1984 - 2006)
 .-.   .-.   .-.   .-.   .-.   .-.   .-.   .-.   .-.   .-
    `-'   `-'   `-'   `-'   `-'   `-'   `-'   `-'   `-'
Do NOT send unsolicited commercial email to this email address.
This message neither grants consent to receive unsolicited
commercial email nor is intended to solicit commercial email.

2007\04\16@123226 by Mike Harrison

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On Mon, 16 Apr 2007 10:00:16 -0600, you wrote:

{Quote hidden}

This is a numbers game - for any product that sells by the zillion there will inevitably be a
business for someone supplying spares, batteries etc., whether scavanged, remanufactured, cloned or
whatever, regardless of any policy of the original manufacturer.

A nice offshoot of this is that very cheap components are available, with reasonably long lifetimes
for re-purposing, e.g. nice little Nokia colour LCDs, Digital camera Li.Ion battery packs, violet
laser diodes from PS3 laser assemblies etc....

You just need to keep an eye on quality ( although I've had 3rd party batteries perform better than
the originals), especially when safety issues are concerned,
e.g. see : http://www.electricstuff.co.uk/acadapter.html


2007\04\16@185418 by Gerhard Fiedler

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Matt Pobursky wrote:

>> They (you) have a point. But I wouldn't buy a notebook (Dell or other)
>> without service contract

> I've never had good luck with service contracts. Every time I've gotten
> one either the unit has not failed or fails just after the contract
> expires... ;-)

I think the thing is that 1) you should not worry about contracts that you
have but never used -- just think how bad it would have been if you had
needed it without having it --, and 2) you should have the contract as long
as you need it -- so that it just can't expire before you don't need it
anymore.

Like Dwayne, I've had generally good experiences with Dell service
contracts. With what they consider customer servicable parts (harddisks,
probably also keyboards even though that never happened to me), they
shipped the parts quickly and I shipped the defect parts back. Just the way
I like it. I also had a complete system exchange this way.

So, Russell... question still stands: If Dell service and parts
availability is bad, which company do you recommend for service and parts
availability? It doesn't help me if I don't buy Dell, but don't buy any
other either... :)

Gerhard

2007\04\16@221407 by Russell McMahon

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From: "Gerhard Fiedler" <.....listsKILLspamspam@spam@connectionbrazil.com>
> So, Russell... question still stands: If Dell service and parts
> availability is bad, which company do you recommend for service and
> parts
> availability? It doesn't help me if I don't buy Dell, but don't buy
> any
> other either... :)

I wasn't going to pass on my friend's subsequent comment but, seeing
you asked :-)

_____________

Ken said:

   Gerhard misses the point  - if something can be repaired (i.e. the
manufacturer has the spares) but refuses to sell them to customers of
its
products but rather insists that a warranty be purchased they should
say so
up front when the item is purchased  - that way the customer has the
necessary information to make an informed choice as to whether to
purchase  - or to find some other manufacturer with a more enlightened
customer support policy.

Dell have every right to behave like this  - but customers should have
the
knowledge that they do.

_________________

And I say:

In my case I was thinking more of desktops.
I tend to buy no-name brand "clones" that have motherboards, RAM,
drives etc that I can buy replacements for from dozens or even
hundreds of stores locally. I'd avoid any desktop that I know needed
special drives or motherboard or video card or RAM. The exception is
if the RAM is available from a third party supplier at a not too
excessive premium. I have seen "name brand" PCs that were uneconomical
to upgrade or maintain due to the horrendous cost of a replacement
hard disk at a fraction of going size when any clone could have had a
standard drive fitted at say 10% of the cost for 5 x the size of
drive.

For laptops I tend to buy on price-capability mix. I have an Acer
(screen dead)(haven't tried to replace as price exceeds PC value with
recent market trends), 3 x Thinkpads (unbeatable $ deal), 1 x HP. For
friends recently I have bought Asus and Acers. I have  a gaggle of
older Toshibas that just happened and 2 x Toshiba Librettos that are
niche-useful enough * to still justify running a Pentium 75 :-).

For any laptop I expect to be able to obtain RAM and drives when/if
required.
I accept that the motherboard and eg keyboard and *internal* power
supply and case components are custom and I am at their mercy. As with
Dell.

* One of these days I want to try VNC from a Libretto to a modern
motherboard and HDD living in a small black box. Should give the
Libretto a new lease of life for eg in car use. Tiny but almost
useable keyboard, nice TFT display with a miniscule footprint. Add
WiFi and ... :-).




           Russell


2007\04\17@031807 by Anand Gadiyar

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Russell,

On 4/17/07, Russell McMahon <apptechspamKILLspamparadise.net.nz> wrote:
> For laptops I tend to buy on price-capability mix. I have an Acer
> (screen dead)(haven't tried to replace as price exceeds PC value with
> recent market trends)

Just an idea. You might already have thought of it. That screen dead
Acer might still be  useful if you hook it up to an external monitor.

Regards,
Anand

2007\04\17@033458 by Robert Rolf

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Anand Gadiyar wrote:

{Quote hidden}

And it may just be the backlight circuitry.
Both lamps and inverters are available from 3rd party suppliers.
Google for 'LCD backlight replacement'

Robert

2007\04\17@071838 by Gerhard Fiedler

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Russell McMahon wrote:

> From: "Gerhard Fiedler" <EraseMElistsspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTconnectionbrazil.com>
>> So, Russell... question still stands: If Dell service and parts
>> availability is bad, which company do you recommend for service and
>> parts availability? It doesn't help me if I don't buy Dell, but don't
>> buy any other either... :)


> [Ken] Dell have every right to behave like this  - but customers should
> have the knowledge that they do.

I can understand Ken, but to me this sounds more like a position of
principle rather than an answer to my question. What manufacturer
guarantees (or has a long enough track record of) a longer availability for
spares -- that was the question (one of them, anyway).

"Dell not selling spares anymore" is not a good argument; a better one
would be "Dell not selling anymore X years after selling the notebook, but
manufacturer Y guarantees selling parts for Z years (and stands up to it)".
So far it's only been about the first part, and you haven't really said
that any other manufacturer is better in this respect -- not even as a
response to an explicit question. Which I take as "I don't really know".
Which to me takes a lot off the edge of the argument, to the point of
making it none at all.

/Every/ manufacturer will, at some point, stop selling parts. It's just a
question of 1) when that will happen and 2) whether there will be enough
3rd party sellers. You haven't compared Dell to any other company, just
claimed that Dell sucks. Well, they all suck (because we all want to buy
cheap :) -- but which one sucks less than Dell, based on actual data rather
than emotional preference (which is fine, but not a good basis for a
discussion about factual service quality)?


> In my case I was thinking more of desktops.

I agree with you on this one. But IMO notebooks is a different market: less
standardized parts. I was (and am) talking exclusively about notebooks, and
so was the original complaint (Inspiron 9300).


> I have an Acer [...], 3 x Thinkpads, 1 x HP. For friends recently I have
> bought Asus and Acers.

Dwayne says there are no parts available for Acers, much less than for
Dell. Thinkpads are not available anymore (at least not from the same
company, which largely invalidates any past service experiences); how's the
availability of spares for these? I'm not sure I'd trust HP anymore than
Dell. Don't know anything about Asus.

Does any of these have a guarantee of spare parts availability? Or a
sufficiently good track record? Reasonable (and working) service contracts?
When I buy a notebook, it's usually so I can work while OOO. If something
breaks, I don't want to have to search and buy on eBay while on the road...
So as long as I need the notebook, I have a service contract. It should be
valid in all the places I go. Dell provides this for a reasonable price,
and I factor this cost into the purchase price -- it's just what a notebook
costs me. From what I heard, IBM had also a reputation for good service,
but they don't do this anymore.

Who else has? Any of the above?

(I'm rather certain that any company that sells service contracts for their
notebooks stops selling spares at some point even though they still have
some in stock. Think about it. They have to fulfill their service
contracts. They will eventually stop production of parts for a 5 year old
notebook model. So they will have a limited stock of spares -- and at some
point they will reserve the remainder for their service contracts, which
they are required to fulfill, rather than selling on the free market. So I
just think that you're barking up the wrong tree or no tree at all;
especially without any example of a company who does it better.)


> For any laptop I expect to be able to obtain RAM and drives when/if
> required.

All standard in the Dells I have.

> I accept that the motherboard and eg keyboard and *internal* power supply
> and case components are custom and I am at their mercy. As with Dell.

With what notebooks the mobo or powersupply is not custom? Ever tried to
fit an Acer mobo into a Thinkpad? :)


I'm not saying that Dell is good. I'd just like a factual answer which
other company is better with the issue you are complaining about: spare
parts for notebooks. So far none came up -- which seems to say that Dell
isn't worse than anyone else, maybe even better.

Gerhard

2007\04\17@075717 by Alan B. Pearce

face picon face
>"Dell not selling spares anymore" is not a good argument;

Humph, reminds me of when Ian R Little, the NZ agents for Nikon cameras
refused to sell my father some spares for a camera he was repairing. They
wanted the camera sent to them.

At that time my father was doing all the repairs for the NZ agents for Zeiss
Ikon, and they wanted some spares for one of their models. Somehow an
arrangement was made to sell the Nikon parts ...

Doesn't quite fit the Dell scenario, but where there is a will, there is a
way ...

2007\04\17@082040 by Russell McMahon

face
flavicon
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I've passed the query on, but

>> I accept that the motherboard and eg keyboard and *internal* power
>> supply
>> and case components are custom and I am at their mercy. As with
>> Dell.

> With what notebooks the mobo or powersupply is not custom? Ever
> tried to
> fit an Acer mobo into a Thinkpad? :)

That's what I was saying - I accept that each is unique (or if not in
some cases, I'll never now it :-).)


       Russell


2007\04\23@223349 by Forrest W Christian

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Just a quick check of the dell website indicates that the example shown
is not true, since I was able to very easily find a replacement keyboard
for the laptop in question.

Start at
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/DellPartsFamily.aspx?c=us&cs=19&l=en&RPU=1&s=dhs

-forrest

Russell McMahon wrote:

{Quote hidden}

2007\04\24@040332 by Alan B. Pearce

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>Just a quick check of the dell website indicates that the example
>shown is not true, since I was able to very easily find a
>replacement keyboard for the laptop in question.
>
>Start at
> http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/DellPartsFamily.aspx?c=us&cs=19&l=en&RPU=1&s=dhs

Err, yes, but that is not Dell in NZ ...

2007\04\24@080619 by Gerhard Fiedler

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Alan B. Pearce wrote:

> Err, yes, but that is not Dell in NZ ...

So? Even Russell seems to buy a lot of his stuff from vendors not in NZ.

Basically, Russell seemed to really only want to stir the pot, vent
something or whatever. He didn't really come forward with a lot of hard
data, like notebook vendors who do sell parts after a few years (not for
NZ, not for anywhere else :).

What he seemed to have wanted to say (according to his later explanations
in this thread) is "another reason not to buy a notebook" or "another
reason not to buy a Dell desktop" (even though the example cited in the OP
was about a Dell notebook -- adding to the general confusion that is not so
rare when emotional issues are treated as objective facts) or something the
like.

Gerhard

2007\04\24@092706 by Russell McMahon

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>> Err, yes, but that is not Dell in NZ ...

> So? Even Russell seems to buy a lot of his stuff from vendors not in
> NZ.

> Basically, Russell seemed to really only want to stir the pot, vent
> something or whatever.

I'll bite :-).

The subject line and the original message were, I think I said (but
may not have made clear enough), originated by a friend who has bought
Dell's for many years and told me how marvellous they are every time I
point out my perceived deficiencies with their fine products or
practices.

So, what I forwarded was the conclusion from a wedded Dell aficionado.
I thought it was worth passing on a comment about Dell practices which
came from a man who was a long time Dell supporter. ("Ask the man who
rides one ...").

> He didn't really come forward with a lot of hard
> data, like notebook vendors who do sell parts after a few years (not
> for
> NZ, not for anywhere else :).

True.
I was passing on someone else's comment and it's not the reason I try
to avoid buying Dell's, just another to add to my list.
I dislike Dell primarily for:

- their fine print $100 "delivery fee" from Malaysia when ordered in
NZ (as if everyone else doesn't have to deliver their parts or PCs
across the world (akin to the airlines' "petrol tax" separate from
their fares)).

- their highly exponential price/feature curve with marginally or
really inadequately specified products being offered at attractive
prices but with upgrade to eg hard disks costing vastly more than the
differential should. (Would you like tyres with your car, sir?)

- The "fact" that they advertise specials on eg TV which may well
exist but which are hard to find subsequently so that the unwary may
end up buying something else. They are too smooth and polished to be
accused of crude "bait and switch" but the end effect looks remarkably
the same.

- the fact that they use *any* non standard connectors or parts in any
of their products "just because they can". They're far far from
reaching the level of mastery of this art that IBM reached decades ago
but I'd like to help encourage them not to do so in the only manner
available to me. (I once looked inside an IBM Model 80 server going
"cheap" in a surplus house. I concluded that there was no parts in it
whatsoever that I could utilise in a "normal" PC system. Not RAM, hard
drive, floppy, power supply, video, fans or anything else. Customised
to utter perfection.  A good trick if you can do it, but not with my
$s if I can help it.

{Quote hidden}

As above.
As it happens, I now DO have a Dell notebook on the premises :-). A
friends father in law threw it out and my friend thought that I may be
able to pass it on to somebody deserving.

I never intended to make any comment about reasons not to buy
notebooks. As a generic beast I think the pros and cons are for most
people clear enough. As I think I noted, I have bought 5 new laptops
personally in relatively recent years for me or my family and have a
gaggle of others which have arrived on my doorstep in various ways.
They certainly have their place and I'm happy to accept the tradeoffs
involved. So far, rather to my surprise, with the exception of the
dead Acer display that I mentioned, I've not had cause to try to buy
anything liable to be unobtainable for any of them. [[FWIW (not much)
I probably have 20 or 30 laptops on the premises - most old and many
dead.]]



       Russell







2007\04\24@133848 by Dwayne Reid

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Thought I drop a few parting comments before this thread dies:

1) I'm fond of Dell machines - both laptop and desktop.  One of the
reasons is their superb support program.  Yeah - you've got to pay
for it up front.  Still better than not having it at all.

My real reason for liking Dell's support program so much is that I
rarely have to get involved on those few occasions when a friend or
colleague who purchased a Dell machine on my recommendation has
problems - they and Dell support seem to be able to sort out the
problem easily.


2) I've becoming quite fond of HP laptops.  I recommended a couple of
machines to friends last fall (sudden need arose - no time available
to wait for Dell machines to be built and shipped).

Things I liked about the particular 17" widescreen models we
picked:  2 hard drives, 2 PC slots (1 PCMCIA, the other is the new
Express card slot), great battery life, replacement keyboard readily available.

I had to work on one of those machines recently - friend exercised
bad judgement when clicking on a particular link.  Was easy to pull
the drive go get all of her data off.  Not as easy as a Dell laptop
but darned easy nonetheless.


3)  Also recently spent some time messing with a recent IBM
Thinkcentre desktop machine.  Obviously designed and built for
Corporate use but easy to work on and with.  Nice machine, actually
(M50 series 8189).


4) Have also spent much time recently with my hands inside standard
"white box" machines built from parts gathered from various suppliers
- both machines that I put together as well as machines put together
by others.

Some of these machines had problems that make me wish that the owners
had purchased Dell machines so that Dell support could deal with the
self-inflicted problems instead of me <grin>.


My original opinion still holds: if someone is well-enough off to
afford a Dell machine and accompanying service contract, I fully
recommend that they go that route rather than almost anything else.

I'm open to alternatives but so far, Dell looks like the best bet.  YMMV

dwayne

--
Dwayne Reid   <dwaynerspamspam_OUTplanet.eon.net>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd    Edmonton, AB, CANADA
(780) 489-3199 voice          (780) 487-6397 fax

Celebrating 22 years of Engineering Innovation (1984 - 2006)
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2007\04\24@150801 by Edward King

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This subject seems to have been discussed to death, so Im reluctant to throw
my 2 cents worth in, but its relevant dammit....

I always used to love Dells. I had corporate support contracts of my own and
a lot of my clients were using them too. The build quality was great, the
support and service was great and I had no problem recommending them to
anyone (especially friends and family). My wife, mother inlaw, grandmother
in law and several of my friends and colleagues all had Dell laptops as a
result of my recommendations...

Then something happened in Dell (I dont know what), but everything changed.
Almost overnight the service became terrible, any new machines I and others
received had flaws or very quickly developed problems...

I stuck with them regardless, believing that perhaps it was just a "hiccup",
but 4 machines failed / were delivered with faults one after another and I
began to look around at alternatives. As this was almost christmas a few
years ago, I had already ordered my wife a new Laptop, but was informed just
a week before xmas that the constant delays werent getting any better and
they slapped another 2 month delay on it....

A close friend who had bought a Dell laptop on my recommendation phoned me
to say that it had died, Dell had picked it up, "serviced" it, returned it
in the same condition (it eventually transpired that the motherboard was
dead so how they could have decided it was "ok" is beyond me). Needless to
say, she wasnt impressed.

The very last time I used a Dell was a couple of years ago. A client
insisted that I use one of their laptops (as they werent happy about
contractors using their own machines on company premises).
They phoned Dell and had a brand new laptop waiting for me when I attended
site for the first time, fully configured by their own engineers.

Within 8 hours, the wireless card became erratic.
Within 3 days, the network card failed completely AND half the memory had
disappeared, rendering the thing unbootable (the memory upgrade hadnt been
seated properly, so it had half come out, frying it completely).
Within a month the hard drive failed.
By the middle of the contract (3 months) the screen had hundreds of bad
pixels, various parts were intermittent (including the pc slot, the new
network adaptor, the wireless and even the power button) and it was running
like a 3 legged dog.

Lets be clear, I wasnt using this thing whilst bungee jumping but Id have
expected it to behave better even if I had!

Eventually, I boxed the thing up and despite my clients protests, continued
working using my own machines and the laptop has sat in storage ever since.

I wont be recommending Dell again. Even if they sort their reliability
problems out, it doesnt instil confidence to know that they allowed things
to get that bad in the first place.

Recommended brands now?

IBM thinkpad (man they are tough! most of my clients that formerly used Dell
are now using these), HP, Sony

EK

{Original Message removed}

2007\04\24@152157 by Joshua Shriver

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A friend of mine uses nothing but Sony Vaio's w/ Linux and has never
been happier.
I've also enjoyed Toshiba Satellites the past couple years.

Just my recommendation.
-Josh

> Recommended brands now?
>
> IBM thinkpad (man they are tough! most of my clients that formerly used Dell
> are now using these), HP, Sony
>

2007\04\24@211433 by Gerhard Fiedler

picon face
Russell McMahon wrote:

> The subject line and the original message were, I think I said (but
> may not have made clear enough), originated by a friend ...

You said that, but you made your own comments on it, seemingly based on the
event.

> ... who has bought Dell's for many years and told me how marvellous they
> are every time I point out my perceived deficiencies with their fine
> products or practices.
>
> So, what I forwarded was the conclusion from a wedded Dell aficionado.
> I thought it was worth passing on a comment about Dell practices which
> came from a man who was a long time Dell supporter. ("Ask the man who
> rides one ...").

You didn't say this in all the present clarity, though.

I still wonder whether there is a notebook manufacturer that would handle
such an event (as described in the OP) better. People still mention IBM,
who seems to have had a pretty good service record, but IBM doesn't even
sell notebooks anymore. And whether Lenovo really does it equal to IBM is
not guaranteed...


> I was passing on someone else's comment and it's not the reason I try
> to avoid buying Dell's, just another to add to my list.
> I dislike Dell primarily for:

All more or less good reasons (even though I don't really care much for
advertising practices, since pretty much all advertising is attempted
influencing beyond reason or outright lying and we hardly could buy
anything if we /really/ want to go moral), but none of them has anything to
do with the original issue. And since that was the only one mentioned, that
was the one I was talking about :)

Gerhard

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