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'[EE] Eagle - slotted pads'
2007\03\13@061723 by Jinx

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Drawing up a few library parts and got stumped by the simplest

Attached is what I need for a DC connector, a common component

All the pad examples I can find are for those with a circular hole, but
this I think needs routing. Is that correct ?

If so, then are routing commands portable with the component or will
they have to be on the laid board ?

If this is done with a drill bit, how would I command the holes to be
joined ?

TIA

=====================================
There is no try - only do or don't do


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2007\03\13@063739 by Vasile Surducan

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This is difficult in Eagle. At least in my version is impossilble.
But can be easily solved with Pads or other Mentor tool

On 3/13/07, Jinx <spam_OUTjoecolquittTakeThisOuTspamclear.net.nz> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

from DRC, distances, drill/hole set to zero or so but only if you're
drilling manually

>
> TIA
>
> =====================================
> There is no try - only do or don't do
>
> -

2007\03\13@065413 by Jinx

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> This is difficult in Eagle. At least in my version is impossilble.
> But can be easily solved with Pads or other Mentor tool

Hmmm. I did have a couple of jobs that had DIN9 connectors,
the ones with the barbed tangs, and told the manufacturer to
make 3x1mm slots for those. He did it, but I don't know how.
Whether they were drilled or routed, no idea. He uses Eagle
(or at least can manipulate Eagle files), although the final Gerbers
may have come out of another program. I'm sure slots are a
common operation for a board house - solder tabs, keying for
switches, ventilation, isolation etc

2007\03\13@084424 by M. Adam Davis

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On 3/13/07, Jinx <.....joecolquittKILLspamspam@spam@clear.net.nz> wrote:
> All the pad examples I can find are for those with a circular hole, but
> this I think needs routing. Is that correct ?

You don't need slotted holes for it, but it will take a lot of solder
and a lot of heat to properly solder it if you don't use slots.  Could
have process issues if this item is going to be manufactured - talk to
your assembly house.

> If so, then are routing commands portable with the component or will
> they have to be on the laid board ?

I don't know enough about Eagle to determine this...

> If this is done with a drill bit, how would I command the holes to be
> joined ?

See this conversation:
http://forum.sparkfun.com/viewtopic.php?t=5983

Keep in mind that many board houses charge more for or do not allow
interior plated routing, and especially stepped drilling (mouse bite
routing) like this - if it's a slot it needs to be routed.  If you use
multiple drill passes you raise the risk of breaking the bits.  Talk
to your board house.

Alternately, do the reverse.  Specify it as a single plated hole in
Eagle (and thus the gerbers), and then send special instructions to
the board house that it instead be a plated slot with specific
dimensions.  Make sure you have a clear fab drawing of the entire PCB
with the called-out locations of board edges and the slot dimensions
and orientation so it's absolutely clear.

Either way, I'd start by talking about it with the board house to find
out your options and the possible extra charges, before you do a lot
of work in Eagle.  It may be cheaper to specify it on a drawing than
it would be to have them convert a mouse-bite slot in the gerber into
a real routed slot.

-Adam

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2007\03\13@090033 by Jinx

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> You don't need slotted holes for it, but it will take a lot of solder
> and a lot of heat to properly solder it if you don't use slots

That's the problem with this part - one pin is 3 x 0.5mm, the other is
2.5 x 0.5mm and they're only 6.5mm apart. Round holes takes too
much copper away. Copper I'd rather keep for mechanical strength.
And, as you say, a lot much solder to fill the hole. One option is to
bend the pins flat to the board. This will grip better in the solder and
also add strength to the joint

> Could have process issues if this item is going to be manufactured -
> talk to your assembly house

As I mentioned to Vasile, a previous job was slotted successfully
on a written instruction, not by my Gerber content. Looks like I'll
have to do it that way this time too

2007\03\13@122011 by PicDude

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I was once told by a PCB house that they use the router bit (not the drill
bits) for internal slots, so in that case it would have to be specified with
the milling layer (which I use to define the outer shape to the board house).  
And of course the router bit diameter would have to be smaller than the width
of the slot.

But internal slots added considerably to the cost of each board.  So for
something similar I've used a few holes very close to each other, and
surrounded by a  rectangular pad (that covers all the holes).  When I got the
board, I punched it though (the PCB "filler" between the adjacent holes) with
a knife.

-Neil.


On Tuesday 13 March 2007 05:14, Jinx wrote:
{Quote hidden}

2007\03\13@125534 by alan smith

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I believe...would have to go back to my notes...but Eagle doesn't support a slot hole, at least from a symbol point of view.  I had the same issue, some relays that needed a slot, ended up just doing a larger size hole instead.

PicDude <picdude2spamKILLspamavn-tech.com> wrote:  I was once told by a PCB house that they use the router bit (not the drill
bits) for internal slots, so in that case it would have to be specified with
the milling layer (which I use to define the outer shape to the board house).
And of course the router bit diameter would have to be smaller than the width
of the slot.

But internal slots added considerably to the cost of each board. So for
something similar I've used a few holes very close to each other, and
surrounded by a rectangular pad (that covers all the holes). When I got the
board, I punched it though (the PCB "filler" between the adjacent holes) with
a knife.

-Neil.


On Tuesday 13 March 2007 05:14, Jinx wrote:
{Quote hidden}

2007\03\13@221351 by Jinx

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> I have one board using a similar connector with 2.5mm round plated
> holes and manufactured in eagle. It eats indeed a lot of solder, but
> who care ?
>
> Vasile

Hi Vasile. Well, if there's a better way to do it rather than feed in solder
I rather do it that way. I've had to do this with DIN plugs that have
expanding star ground anchors, and although there's heaps of solder, a
lot of it doesn't actually contribute to the joint or connection. Feeding in
solder does take time. Not a lot of time granted, but if you put this tab
into
a round hole, 80% of the hole is still hole. A quick solder results in just
a
weak miniscus joint. And I don't trust solder to mechanically hold a socket.
I've done many repairs on products in which the DC socket has come
away from the board, pulling pads and tracks with it. After fixing the
tracks
I always put a wire over the socket to hold it down, and it stays fixed. If
this were anything but a DC socket, because they get a lot of waggling
and pulling, I'd probably go with a round hole like you suggest

So, options are -

get proper slotted pads + a wire across the socket body to anchor
it - preferred

round holes, a lot of solder + wire - second choice

change to a PCB mount DC socket with roundish pins - flimsy

2007\03\14@015037 by Vasile Surducan

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On 3/13/07, Jinx <.....joecolquittKILLspamspam.....clear.net.nz> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

For say 100 pcs or more I'll vote for the above suggestion.

>
> round holes, a lot of solder + wire - second choice

For a few boards will be ok.

>
> change to a PCB mount DC socket with roundish pins - flimsy

Change the Eagle with a better CAD instead ?

>
> -

2007\03\14@021444 by Jinx

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> > get proper slotted pads + a wire across the socket body to
> > anchor it - preferred
>
> For say 100 pcs or more I'll vote for the above suggestion.

Initial run is likely to be 100+. Boards are small and easily panelled

> Change the Eagle with a better CAD instead ?

I have learning access to Altium (Protel). Tried it a little but more
comfortable with Eagle at the moment

2007\03\14@045540 by William Chops Westfield

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>> Change the Eagle with a better CAD instead ?
>>
I don't really think that will help that much.  EAGLE does have a
milling layer, but however you look at it you quickly run into an
issue of communicating the idea to the board shop, which is likely
to be the sticky point anyway.  You need a shop that has a milling
step before through-hole-plating, for instance.   Or there might
be shops that have some other way of doing it.  Either way, you're
going to need to adjust the library part and the gerber files to
match the fabricator...

BillW

2007\03\14@150643 by peter green

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> That's the problem with this part - one pin is 3 x 0.5mm, the other is
> 2.5 x 0.5mm and they're only 6.5mm apart. Round holes takes too
> much copper away. Copper I'd rather keep for mechanical strength.
> And, as you say, a lot much solder to fill the hole.
here at the university of manchester they give every student a microcontroller board with a 3 terminal DC socket that seems to be pretty similar (if not identical to) the one you have mounted in large round holes (hand soldered in house) and i haven't heared of any problems with it.

>One option is to bend the pins flat to the board. This will grip better in the solder and also add strength to the joint

if you mean trying to suface mount it i reckon that will be far worse than 3 large round holes

and if you mean bend after insertion i don't think there will be much tab length left to do it.



2007\03\14@175421 by Jinx

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> if you mean trying to suface mount it i reckon that will be far worse
> than 3 large round holes

Agree. No, this socket would always be through-hole

> and if you mean bend after insertion i don't think there will be much
> tab length left to do it

Actually it's better than that. What's poking out on the copper side
has holes into which you can thread component cut-off wire, adding
a strong 3rd dimension to the physical joint

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