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'[EE]: eprom programmer needed for 2708 eproms'
2001\02\02@201032 by Dwayne Reid

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Good day to all.

Our local science centre / planetarium has had some problems with their
Zeiss Star Projector.  It looks as if they have solved these problems, but
during the course of the testing, it looked as if some of the eproms were
starting to lose bits.  I suggested that one of their priorities was to
read and save images of the eprom contents.

The problem is that it looks as if the eproms are 2708 and I have nothing
that will read them.  Does anyone have an old programmer that they could
loan for a couple of weeks?  A Canadian source would be the easiest, USA
would be OK as well.

Wait a minute - I just dug up an old GTEK programmer that *might* date from
that era but have neither software or documentation for it.  I'm heading
off to google to see what I can find out about it.  In the meantime, any
suggestions gratefully accepted.

dwayne

PS - the following is the info I have from techs at the site.  Does 'U55C'
look like a good cross to 2708?

At 03:10 PM 2/2/01 -0700, spam_OUTesscTakeThisOuTspamplanet.eon.net wrote:
{Quote hidden}

Dwayne Reid   <.....dwaynerKILLspamspam@spam@planet.eon.net>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd    Edmonton, AB, CANADA
(780) 489-3199 voice          (780) 487-6397 fax

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2001\02\02@220838 by Fansler, David

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I have five  2708's I will donate to the cause if so desired.  I worked
during graduate school at the Morehead Planetarium in Chapel Hill, NC where
they have a Zeiss Model VI projector - thus a soft spot for their
predicament.


David V. Fansler
Network Administrator
TriPath Imaging, Inc. (formerly AutoCyte, Inc.)
1-800-426-2176 ext 261
Now Showing http://www.dv-fansler.com
Ann Fansler (December 1, 1956 - September 23, 2000)

{Original Message removed}

2001\02\03@093314 by mike

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On Fri, 2 Feb 2001 18:05:32 -0700, you wrote:

Easiest way to read them may be to make up a little adapter board to
supply the wacky supply voltages, and read them on a conventional
programmer. You should be able to bodge a modern eprom into the old
sockets without too much hacking - just keep those silly voltages away
from it!

{Quote hidden}

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2001\02\03@100047 by Peter L. Peres

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You can make a temporary adapter to a 2716-pinout socket (2 stacked
sockets) and use the programmer you have to read them out. You will need a
small auxiliary PSU for -5V and +12V. Always connect -5V first and
disconnect last. The read out image will repeat itself twice in the object
file. You will need to fix that later.

hope this helps,

Peter

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2001\02\03@105109 by Spehro Pefhany
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At 02:36 PM 2/3/01 +0000, you wrote:
>On Fri, 2 Feb 2001 18:05:32 -0700, you wrote:
>
>Easiest way to read them may be to make up a little adapter board to
>supply the wacky supply voltages, and read them on a conventional
>programmer. You should be able to bodge a modern eprom into the old
>sockets without too much hacking - just keep those silly voltages away
>from it!

The supplies need sequencing, be sure to get ahold of a data sheet.

It might be just as easy if you are going to that trouble to hack up
a programmer entirely from scratch. IIRC, the 2708 just takes 50ms
pulses for each byte. Dead easy. A parallel port on an old PC will
have all the logic required (use an HC4040 to generate the addresses),
and also the supply voltages (but check sequencing, it's probably
ok in that case).

The programming voltage Vpp is something relatively high, but a bench
supply could take care of that, with a suitable electronic switch.

Best regards,



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2001\02\04@170145 by Tony Nixon

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Dwayne Reid wrote:
{Quote hidden}

Maybe 'The Engine' could be used to read obsolete devices like this.

http://www.picnpoke.com/engine.html

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Tony

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2001\02\05@094853 by Alan B. Pearce

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A 2708 does not program with single program pulses like a 2716 and later devices
use. It requires a repeating loop to program each address sequentially for 1mS
right through the whole device and then loop through the whole device at least
50 times.

This is necessary as the internal structure of the device gives a lot of cross
talk between cells during programming. If you program it with a single 50mS
pulse to one address and then move on you will find the contents of previously
programmed cells will change as you program later cells.

If you get really stuck I may be able to find an early Intel data book I could
scan. I do not think I threw it out when I moved half way round the world.

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2001\02\05@135640 by Dwayne Reid

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Many thanks for the suggestions, Follks.  Many of you responded with
exactly the same idea and I think that it is exactly what I'll do.

At 07:07 PM 2/2/01 -0700, Robert Rolf wrote:
>Hi Dwayne,
>
>Some weeks ago I told David to call me back if my suggestions didn't
>work for him (make up a socket to read 2708 as a 2716).

Thanks again!

dwayne



Dwayne Reid   <RemoveMEdwaynerTakeThisOuTspamplanet.eon.net>
Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd    Edmonton, AB, CANADA
(780) 489-3199 voice          (780) 487-6397 fax

Celebrating 17 years of Engineering Innovation (1984 - 2001)

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Do NOT send unsolicited commercial email to this email address.
This message neither grants consent to receive unsolicited
commercial email nor is intended to solicit commercial email.

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2001\02\05@175215 by Chris Carr

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Reading a 2708 is not a problem surely. I can understand having
problems writing to a 2708 with modern programmers.

So, why not forget transferring the program to a 2708 and transfer it to
the low addresses of a 2716, 2732, 2764, 27128, 27256........ and convert
the pinout using a board from Aries (if one exists) or wirewrap your own.

On the other hand, if you are going to do that why stay with EPROM,
you could substitute EEPROM or Flash.

Regards
Chris

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2001\02\06@044950 by Alan B. Pearce

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>Some weeks ago I told David to call me back if my suggestions didn't
>work for him (make up a socket to read 2708 as a 2716).

If doing this then you should be able to make the programmer read it as a 2508
which was the single supply 1k version of the 2716. Intel could not call it a
2708 as that number was already used for the triple supply device you are
dealing with. Reading as a 2508 will mean that you will not read the contents of
the EPROM twice in the read cycle.

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