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'[EE]: PCMCIA 802.11b'
2001\11\27@164903 by David VanHorn

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Does anyone know where I could find interface information to enable using
one of these cards with a micro?

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2001\11\27@165820 by Dale Botkin

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On Tue, 27 Nov 2001, David VanHorn wrote:

> Does anyone know where I could find interface information to enable using
> one of these cards with a micro?

I'm looking too, let me know what you find and I'll do the same.  Just to
show you how warped I've become, I found out it will be a major pain in
the whatever to run Cat5 wire to the bedrooms, so I'm thinking a better
intercom system might be VoIP using 802.11b PCMCIA cards...  digitize the
voice, packetize it and some other trivial stuff like button/LED status,
shuttle it around in UDP packets.  OK, so does contemplating this rather
than stringing wire sound TOO lazy, or what?

Dale

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2001\11\27@171019 by David VanHorn

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At 03:56 PM 11/27/01 -0600, Dale Botkin wrote:
>On Tue, 27 Nov 2001, David VanHorn wrote:
>
> > Does anyone know where I could find interface information to enable using
> > one of these cards with a micro?
>
>I'm looking too, let me know what you find and I'll do the same.  Just to
>show you how warped I've become, I found out it will be a major pain in
>the whatever to run Cat5 wire to the bedrooms, so I'm thinking a better
>intercom system might be VoIP using 802.11b PCMCIA cards...  digitize the
>voice, packetize it and some other trivial stuff like button/LED status,
>shuttle it around in UDP packets.  OK, so does contemplating this rather
>than stringing wire sound TOO lazy, or what?

Hmm.. I think you need an experienced installer.
If you have a basement, it's a one-afternoon job.
If you have an attic, it's a messy hot one afternoon job.

You still have to power the ends, afterall.
If the power comes from the AC line, then carrier current looks good to me.
200-300kHz matched to about 2 ohms impedance on the power lines.
Use FM.

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Got a need to read Bar codes?  http://www.barcodechip.com
Bi-directional read of UPC-A, UPC-E, EAN-8, EAN-13, JAN, and Bookland, with
two or five digit supplemental codes, in an 8 pin chip, with NO external parts.

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2001\11\27@171448 by Josh Koffman

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Um Dale...you could use portable radios (walkie talkies) :). You could
even use the PIC to monitor a charging circuit to keep them powered up
all the time :)

Josh
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Dale Botkin wrote:
{Quote hidden}

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2001\11\27@173341 by Dale Botkin

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On Tue, 27 Nov 2001, David VanHorn wrote:

> At 03:56 PM 11/27/01 -0600, Dale Botkin wrote:
> >On Tue, 27 Nov 2001, David VanHorn wrote:
> >
> > > Does anyone know where I could find interface information to enable using
> > > one of these cards with a micro?
> >
> >I'm looking too, let me know what you find and I'll do the same.  Just to
> >show you how warped I've become, I found out it will be a major pain in
> >the whatever to run Cat5 wire to the bedrooms, so I'm thinking a better
> >intercom system might be VoIP using 802.11b PCMCIA cards...  digitize the
> >voice, packetize it and some other trivial stuff like button/LED status,
> >shuttle it around in UDP packets.  OK, so does contemplating this rather
> >than stringing wire sound TOO lazy, or what?
>
> Hmm.. I think you need an experienced installer.

Where's the fun in that??  I'd spend as much on an installer as I would on
hardware.  Those suckers are *expensive*, as are commercial wired
intercoms -- over US$800 for what I need.

> If you have a basement, it's a one-afternoon job.
> If you have an attic, it's a messy hot one afternoon job.

I have both.  The attic is a foot and a half deep in insulation, and the
basement is finished...  flippin' drywall everywhere except where it does
me no good.  Yeah, I can probably eventuallt fish wire up through the
ductwork, but this looks interesting.

> You still have to power the ends, afterall.
> If the power comes from the AC line, then carrier current looks good to me.
> 200-300kHz matched to about 2 ohms impedance on the power lines.
> Use FM.

We've used carrier current intercoms before.  Quite frankly they just
plain suck...  what a waste of plastic.  They don't like to talk between
phases (at least they wouldn't in the last house), but every neighbor with
the same brand of intercom will happily listen in.  We already considered
and rejected those.  Every one I look at also has 2, 3 or 4 channels...
no, I want every intercom in the house on ONE channel so I know for a fact
that when I hit the PAGE button, everyone hears it.  Otherwise half the
kids play with the channels and I end up running up and down stairs again.

I have 90% of a design for a really nice wired system to do exactly what
we want (and NOT do what we don't want).  The only real problem is finding
a nice looking flush mount panel for the speaker, two buttons and an LED,
something that looks finished ad professional -- that and the wire.  But
like I said, this looks really interesting.  So far it looks like a CF
802.11b card i just the ticket, but I'm not having any luck finding any
kind of interface information aot them whatsoever.  CF interface specs
yes, but the 802.11 driver stuff no.

<rant>
Why do manufacturers think the interface information for thir products
need to be carefully guarded like the crown flippin' jewels?  What the
heck to they car if I write my own interface code, as long as I buy their
product?  Why should I have to pay 4 or 5 or 6 figure sums to get
information on how to use their hardware?  God fobid I should make their
stuff work on more systems, and do it for free or something.  This totally
mystifies me.  I just simply don't get it.
</rant>

Dale

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2001\11\27@173614 by Dale Botkin

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On Tue, 27 Nov 2001, Josh Koffman wrote:

> Um Dale...you could use portable radios (walkie talkies) :). You could
> even use the PIC to monitor a charging circuit to keep them powered up
> all the time :)

Nope.  Even if I hacked them to do what I want (hands-free answer and
such), they're simplex, easily monitored and anyone on the same frequency
could harrass te whole household.  I need duplex and value my privacy.  We
also want this in about eight rooms...

Dale

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2001\11\27@201952 by Gerhard Fiedler

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At 16:31 11/27/2001 -0600, Dale Botkin wrote:
><rant>
>Why do manufacturers think the interface information for thir products
>need to be carefully guarded like the crown flippin' jewels? ...

It's probably because of the lawyers (once again... :)  If they publish
that stuff and it doesn't do what they publish, somebody might sue them...
and if they want to put an appropriate disclaimer on it, this might cost
more than they ever make through it  :(

ge

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2001\11\27@225200 by Lee Jones

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>>> Does anyone know where I could find interface information
>>> to enable using [an 802.11b LAN card]

> <rant>
> Why do manufacturers think the interface information for thir
> products need to be carefully guarded like the crown flippin'
> jewels?

I haven't looked, but it can't be that hard to come by.  There
are drivers for the Orinoco (ex-Lucent, ex-WaveLAN) and Cisco
802.11b cards in Linux.  You might check to see if the source
for the drivers has been released -- it should be.

                                               Lee Jones

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2001\11\27@235607 by Dale Botkin

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I'll look for those.  I'm interested to see if there is enough commonality
that a driver could be written for several different brands, a la NE2000.
My reading indicates that the CF interface is like PCMCIA but simpler,
which is the first little ray of sunshine.  That part looks relatively
easy, and I already have most of a UDP/IP stack.

Dale
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curiosity killed the cat, I say only the cat died nobly."
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On Tue, 27 Nov 2001, Lee Jones wrote:

{Quote hidden}

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2001\11\28@081444 by Dale Botkin

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On Tue, 27 Nov 2001, Lee Jones wrote:

> >>> Does anyone know where I could find interface information
> >>> to enable using [an 802.11b LAN card]
>
> > <rant>
> > Why do manufacturers think the interface information for thir
> > products need to be carefully guarded like the crown flippin'
> > jewels?
>
> I haven't looked, but it can't be that hard to come by.  There
> are drivers for the Orinoco (ex-Lucent, ex-WaveLAN) and Cisco
> 802.11b cards in Linux.  You might check to see if the source
> for the drivers has been released -- it should be.

There are drivers indeed, thanks for pointing that out.  Most of 'em are
written with little or no comments and are difficult to parse, but I did
find datasheets for the Intersil chipset used in a lot fo the PCMCIA and
CF 802.11b cards.  Looks like a really simple hardware interface with a
crushing load of software...  I may look deeper (or may go to Home Depot
and look at some 6' long drill bits).

Dale

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2001\11\28@094826 by Chris Carr

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I need duplex and value my privacy.  We
> also want this in about eight rooms...
>
A GAP compliant DECT system (or 2) sounds like the answer.
Legal and relatively cheap throughout the EU. Don't
know about elsewhere.

Regarding PCCard 802.11b most manufacturers provide a PCI
carrier card so they can be used on "fixed" machines
with PCI slots but no Cardbus Slots

Regards

Chris Carr

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2001\11\28@153811 by David VanHorn

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So, taking back my thread... :)

Does anyone know of a low level description of how to talk to these cards?
Pinout descriptions would be helpful.

At this point, I'm assuming it's some sort of bus with read, write, int etc .
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Got a need to read Bar codes?  http://www.barcodechip.com
Bi-directional read of UPC-A, UPC-E, EAN-8, EAN-13, JAN, and Bookland, with
two or five digit supplemental codes, in an 8 pin chip, with NO external parts.

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2001\11\28@164140 by Amaury Jacquot

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Surlignage Dale Botkin <>:

{Quote hidden}

get the linux source, you will have all the required info in the source (and
the docs there)

Sincerley

Amaury
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2001\11\28@223831 by Brandon Fosdick

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Lee Jones wrote:
>
> >>> Does anyone know where I could find interface information
> >>> to enable using [an 802.11b LAN card]
>
> > <rant>
> > Why do manufacturers think the interface information for thir
> > products need to be carefully guarded like the crown flippin'
> > jewels?
>
> I haven't looked, but it can't be that hard to come by.  There
> are drivers for the Orinoco (ex-Lucent, ex-WaveLAN) and Cisco
> 802.11b cards in Linux.  You might check to see if the source
> for the drivers has been released -- it should be.

All of those cards work in the various BSD's and Linuxen, try looking through
the source code.

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2001\11\29@051906 by Dale Botkin

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Well, since I so thoroughly trashed the thread (sorry!), I'll try to share
what I've learned.

CompactFlash (CF) is a subset of PC Card, and both look very much like
IDE.  In fact, I have read that CF can be attached directly to an IDE bus,
don't know about PC Card, still reading.  It's documented at
http://www.pc-card.com/.  I found a couple of projects interfacing PICs to
CF cards (check Google), none interfacing PICs to PC Card.  In either
case, the *card* interface is the easy part.  The driver for the 802.11b
NIC is the complicated part.  You can look at the Linux drivers for
various PC Card 802.11b cards for an idea of how to talk to them (I'm just
getting started here).  I think you're leaving footprints in unmarked
snow, so to speak.

Dale
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curiosity killed the cat, I say only the cat died nobly."
         - Arnold Edinborough


On Wed, 28 Nov 2001, David VanHorn wrote:

{Quote hidden}

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'[EE]: PCMCIA 802.11b'
2001\12\07@185017 by brandon
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I saw a page where some students connected a 802.11b card to a microcontroller (don't know which one), to transmit water temperature data from a buoy. You may be able to contact him/them.

The site is at
http://wireless.oldcolo.com/biology/progress2000/13-progressreport(07-07-2000).htm

At least you know it can and has been done...

And with using the source code for some linux drivers, that still wouldnt give you pin-outs and how to interface to the actual pcmia connection. Did you try contacting someone at one of the card developers...you might be able to get some info, or at least pointed in the right direction.

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