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'[EE]: Maxstream Xbee Zigbee radios'
2006\01\06@205253 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
Got a few in the mail today...they're curious little critters and I'm
excited to play, although I hear the firmward isn't top-notch just yet.

Who else has got some? And who else hates the weird 2mm pin pitch? ;-)

-marc

2006\01\06@230959 by Shawn Wilton

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How much were those?


On 1/6/06, Marc Nicholas <spam_OUTgeekythingTakeThisOuTspamgmail.com> wrote:
>
> Got a few in the mail today...they're curious little critters and I'm
> excited to play, although I hear the firmward isn't top-notch just yet.
>
> Who else has got some? And who else hates the weird 2mm pin pitch? ;-)
>
> -marc
> -

2006\01\06@234611 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
$19.

-marc


On 1/6/06, Shawn Wilton <.....black9KILLspamspam@spam@gmail.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

2006\01\07@205052 by Timothy Weber

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I've looked at XBee, but my app needs something that will support ZigBee
in a mesh configuration, and they don't support that yet.  Neither does
Microchip's stack.  Has anyone seen a ZigBee implementation, in the wild
and available for purchase, that does support mesh?

Marc Nicholas wrote:
> Got a few in the mail today...they're curious little critters and I'm
> excited to play, although I hear the firmward isn't top-notch just yet.
>
> Who else has got some? And who else hates the weird 2mm pin pitch? ;-)
>
> -marc

--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\08@104054 by Marc Nicholas

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Funnily enough, I wrote Maxstream's tech support last night about the mesh
configuration and self-healing...I'll let the y'all know what their response
is.

-marc


On 1/7/06, Timothy Weber <.....twKILLspamspam.....timothyweber.org> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\01\08@121834 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Great, thanks!  My impression was that they didn't support it at all,
but if it's coming, that'd be good to know.

Marc Nicholas wrote:
> Funnily enough, I wrote Maxstream's tech support last night about the mesh
> configuration and self-healing...I'll let the y'all know what their response
> is.

--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\08@122531 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
"Self-routing/Self-healing mesh networking (downloadable firmware version
coming soon)"
That's from the manual....it'll be interesting to see when/if they release
that firmware ;-)

-marc


On 1/8/06, Timothy Weber <EraseMEtwspam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTtimothyweber.org> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\01\08@150121 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Marc Nicholas wrote:
> "Self-routing/Self-healing mesh networking (downloadable firmware version
> coming soon)"
> That's from the manual....it'll be interesting to see when/if they release
> that firmware ;-)

Cool, I missed that.  And yes - we'll see what "soon" means!

ZigBee without mesh makes me say "Oh good, nice to see a standard."

ZigBee with mesh makes me say "Wow, this is new!"
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\08@150810 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
I've been using Sparkfun's BlueSMiRF up until now...they're relatively
cheap/easy for point-to-point for one of my robot platforms, but if you're
planning on deploying a small army of microbots....

-marc


On 1/8/06, Timothy Weber <twspamspam_OUTtimothyweber.org> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\01\08@210407 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Marc Nicholas wrote:
> I've been using Sparkfun's BlueSMiRF up until now...they're relatively
> cheap/easy for point-to-point for one of my robot platforms, but if
you're
> planning on deploying a small army of microbots....

You've discovered my evil plot!

No, actually it's for a farm irrigation system, where some nodes need to
be a long way from home, nodes communicate bidirectionally with home,
and the faraway nodes would require too much battery power to reach home
in one hop - but it's OK and even required to sprinkle nodes around in
between.

Point-to-point or point-to-multipoint would be fine for one-way
communication, because home could relatively high-powered.  But so far,
this application looks like the mesh network poster child to me.

Good to hear about BlueSMiRF, though - they look good for point-to-point
applications.
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\08@232432 by Charles Craft

picon face
Ember has  mesh

http://www.ember.com/company/press/press-111505.html


-----Original Message-----
{Quote hidden}

>-

2006\01\09@041851 by Joe McCauley

picon face
These units are excellent! I'm working with then at the moment too. The pin
pitch is no big deal if soldering them directly on a pcb. If prototyping
you'll probably need sockets though & these are not as common as 0.1 inch.
I'm using M22-6111022 from HARWIN.

What version firmware are they shipping with now? (mine were 1.06 last
October) They have released 2 beta updates since then, but I've not seen any
updates on their website.

The support people told me back in November that mesh would be out by the
end of the year. That deadline may have slipped.

Joe


> {Original Message removed}

2006\01\09@092613 by alan smith

picon face
I've been using some, and so far haven't had any issues with the firmware.  2mm pitch isn't that wierd for me, but I've been using those types of headers for a while

Marc Nicholas <RemoveMEgeekythingTakeThisOuTspamgmail.com> wrote:  Got a few in the mail today...they're curious little critters and I'm
excited to play, although I hear the firmward isn't top-notch just yet.

Who else has got some? And who else hates the weird 2mm pin pitch? ;-)

-marc

2006\01\09@111634 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Charles Craft wrote:
> Ember has  mesh
>
> http://www.ember.com/company/press/press-111505.html

I hadn't seen them before.  Looks quite nice!  Have you (or anyone else)
used them?  From their web site, I don't see how you can buy anything
besides their dev kits ($5,000 - $14,000).
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\09@123002 by Charles Craft

picon face
Ember is for the big boys (OK, bigger than a few dozen home automation nodes around my house).

http://www.zigbee.org/en/products/

Found a link in Microchip Zigbee section:

http://www.microchip.com/stellent/idcplg?IdcService=SS_GET_PAGE&nodeId=2112

To these:

http://www.flexipanel.com/PICZee/

Includes the PIC and has lots of I/O left over:

15 I/O lines, including:
8-channel 10-bit A/D
Serial UART
2 interrupts





{Original Message removed}

2006\01\09@211148 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
Bit of an update:

- Maxstream have no timeline on the AES encryption
- Full Zigbee stack is due Q1 2006
- They added me to the beta testers list
- Got a tech support reponse < 1 business day

So, I need to finish my break-out boards and get playing ;-)

-marc

On 1/9/06, Charles Craft <spamBeGonechuckseaspamBeGonespammindspring.com> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> {Original Message removed}

2006\01\09@212403 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Marc Nicholas wrote:
> Bit of an update:
>
> - Maxstream have no timeline on the AES encryption

Not a show-stopper for me, but I'll hope they get it in within a year or
two.

> - Full Zigbee stack is due Q1 2006

Huzzah!  I get the best feel from their web site - combination of clear
info, a product niche that fits, cheap, and easy to buy.

> - They added me to the beta testers list
> - Got a tech support reponse < 1 business day

Also good to hear!

> So, I need to finish my break-out boards and get playing ;-)

I'll be right behind you.  I have to decide whether I want to wait for
the mesh support before I start testing, though - range and power usage
in mesh configuration is my biggest open question.  OTOH, there are a
million other details too that I can work on, and having functioning
nodes would help.

Thanks for trailblazing!
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\09@213533 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
If anyone wants some break-out boards, I need to get the design finished,
build a prototype, and then I'll do a small/cheap run. Let me know in
advance!

They'll have solder joints for enabling local CMOS power/RS-232 level
conversion with minimal components.

-marc

On 1/9/06, Timothy Weber <TakeThisOuTtwEraseMEspamspam_OUTtimothyweber.org> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\01\10@094859 by alan smith

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Also read a blurb that SiLABs has a zigbee solution, with mesh capability.


                       
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2006\01\10@110155 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Marc Nicholas wrote:
> If anyone wants some break-out boards, I need to get the design finished,
> build a prototype, and then I'll do a small/cheap run. Let me know in
> advance!

I'd be interested.  I'm ordering the MaxStream dev kit right now; that
might get me going until I need to make my own boards anyhow, but do
keep us posted on what you've got.
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\10@133015 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
Why would you buy their "dev kit", out of interest? It's really just a
collection of adapters (USB, serial, null, etc) and a few assorted XBees....

-marc

On 1/10/06, Timothy Weber <RemoveMEtwspamTakeThisOuTtimothyweber.org> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\01\10@143817 by Howard Winter

face
flavicon
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Marc,

On Mon, 9 Jan 2006 21:35:33 -0500, Marc Nicholas wrote:

> If anyone wants some break-out boards, I need to get the design finished,
> build a prototype, and then I'll do a small/cheap run. Let me know in
> advance!

Would these boards also work with the Microchip Zigbee daughterboards?  I'm not familiar with the Maxstream
product, so I don't know how similar they are.

Cheers,


Howard Winter
St.Albans, England


2006\01\10@144639 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Marc Nicholas wrote:
> Why would you buy their "dev kit", out of interest? It's really just a
> collection of adapters (USB, serial, null, etc) and a few assorted XBees....

Because I want to test working ranges and power usage in a number of
configurations for proof-of-concept... and because there is money
available for parts right now but not for my time (funding situation is
complex!) and I want to get started.  So this will save some time.
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\10@184635 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
Timothy,

Well, time is definitely money ;-) I was just worried you thought you'd be
able to get access to something "special" with the dev kit, which is not the
case.

-marc


On 1/10/06, Timothy Weber <twEraseMEspam.....timothyweber.org> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\01\10@210330 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Marc Nicholas wrote:
> Timothy,
>
> Well, time is definitely money ;-) I was just worried you thought you'd be
> able to get access to something "special" with the dev kit, which is not the
> case.

Thanks for the thought!  I did read through the docs, and while I'm
excited at the prospect of playing with new technology, I *think* I'm
not expecting any magic.  :)  (I mean, other than the magic of writing
out a serial stream and receiving it 100m away.)

Cheers.
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\11@084255 by alan smith

picon face
The dev kits are basically a motherboard for the Xbee radios, provides a easy method to get RS232 into the module.  It also has the abilty to reset the module back to factory values I think...and a DIP switch for some other parameters and of course a power supply to take the 9V down to 3.3V.  So building a board that has the connector, a DC source and a RS232 transiever on it (I ask Maxim about once a quarter for samples of the capacitor-less version) and you have pretty much the same thing.  On board the Xbee is a freescale micro I believe, and the zigbee radio chip (don't recall who's they are using...believe its the same one the is on the Mchip dev system) and you can use AT like commands to talk to the chip, setting up the addressing, power, etc for it.  The nice thing about the Xbee is that its all built into the module.....just interface with  3.3V TTL (NOT 5V for the Xbee products) straight from the micro UART and your done.  Of course if you need to talk to the PIC o!
ver RS232
you need to use a chip either with dual UARTS or mux the data stream.  
 
 Once you have two of them built up, setting the MY addressing to open broadcasts, its just a simple wireless interface and can send data back and forth....pretty slick.
 
 

                       
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2006\01\11@112836 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
alan smith wrote:

> The nice thing about the Xbee is that its all built into the module.....just interface with  3.3V TTL (NOT 5V for the Xbee products) straight from the micro UART and your done.

Thanks for the summary - sounds like you've been using them.

I think this is the gist of it: the XBee is all-in-one, and it's small
and reasonably cheap ($19).  You could make the same thing with
Microchip's free ZigBee stack, a PIC18F, and one of the third-party
radios like Chipcon's, and you'd get increased flexibility (e.g.,
updating the firmware, more control over antenna type & placement), but
at the cost of time and attention paid to the low-level details.

This seems to be the way the market's segmented at the moment:
all-in-ones vs. micro + radio + balun etc.
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\11@113612 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
"and you'd get increased flexibility (e.g., updating the firmware, more
control over antenna type & placement)"

- Xbees are firmware updateable...
- Xbees can have external antennas, onboard chip antennas or an onboard whip

-marc

On 1/11/06, Timothy Weber <EraseMEtwspamtimothyweber.org> wrote:
{Quote hidden}

> -

2006\01\11@143600 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Marc Nicholas wrote:
> "and you'd get increased flexibility (e.g., updating the firmware, more
> control over antenna type & placement)"
>
> - Xbees are firmware updateable...

Oh!  Didn't know that.  Great!

> - Xbees can have external antennas, onboard chip antennas or an onboard whip

Yup, three choices are good - and probably good enough for me.  I'm just
saying if you really know and care about the RF minutiae, you would have
more control over it with the separate micro + radio + glue approach.  I
don't plan to care that much, though you never know what'll happen.  :)
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\23@101011 by Kyle.Plog (sent by Nabble.com)

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face

Have you successfully updated the firmware in your xbees?  I have a few Xbee pros that i can't get to update.
--
View this message in context: www.nabble.com/-EE-%3A-Maxstream-Xbee-Zigbee-radios-t867537.html#a2536365
Sent from the MicroControllers - PIC forum at Nabble.com.

2006\01\23@115542 by Timothy Weber

face picon face
Kyle.Plog (sent by Nabble.com) wrote:
> Have you successfully updated the firmware in your xbees?  I have a
few Xbee pros that i can't get to update.

I haven't tried it yet.  Where are you getting the firmware update?
--
Timothy J. Weber
http://timothyweber.org

2006\01\23@122137 by Marc Nicholas

picon face
They haven't sent me anything, either...

-marc


On 1/23/06, Timothy Weber <RemoveMEtwEraseMEspamEraseMEtimothyweber.org> wrote:
>
> Kyle.Plog (sent by Nabble.com) wrote:
> > Have you successfully updated the firmware in your xbees?  I have a
> few Xbee pros that i can't get to update.
>
> I haven't tried it yet.  Where are you getting the firmware update?
> --
> Timothy J. Weber
> http://timothyweber.org
> -

2006\01\24@052634 by Joe McCauley

picon face
What version of firmware do you have in the radio & what version are you
upgrading to? I have upgraded to 1.07C OK a couple of months ago. They sent
me 107D, but I have not tried this. (If it aint broke don't fix it.) Mesh
networking still not available yet.

Joe

> {Original Message removed}

2006\01\24@084137 by alan smith

picon face
If you get on http://www.maxstream.net, they have "live" chat with the tech folks, not sure what hours they run that, but I assume at least during normal 8-5 mtn time.  Course if your in a different side of the world, might be a lil tough...

Joe McCauley <RemoveMEjoe.mccauleyspam_OUTspamKILLspamtcd.ie> wrote:  What version of firmware do you have in the radio & what version are you
upgrading to? I have upgraded to 1.07C OK a couple of months ago. They sent
me 107D, but I have not tried this. (If it aint broke don't fix it.) Mesh
networking still not available yet.

Joe

> {Original Message removed}

2006\01\24@111242 by Kyle.Plog (sent by Nabble.com)

flavicon
face

I have 106 in the radio right now, trying to go to 107E (received from tech support at maxstream).  I think my problem has less to do with their software and more to do with my hardware, being as I can't even load the 106 firmware.
--
View this message in context: www.nabble.com/-EE-%3A-Maxstream-Xbee-Zigbee-radios-t867537.html#a2558572
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