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'[EE]: Component ID Help!'
2002\11\02@224738 by Josh Koffman

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Hi all. So, in my PIC&Ethernet quest, I have aquired a bunch of NE2000
cards based on the RTL8019AS chip. Some of them clearly have no
connection to the +12V pin on the ISA bus - a bonus as then all I need
is +5V. I do have a few cards that the +12V line is connected to though.
However, they go to a component that I can't identify. I tried chipdir
and a google search, and although there were some matches, there was no
ID of what it might be. The closest thing was a product table for
transformers. Question is, why would a transformer need +12? Anyway, the
part number seems to be CFUS0509-C. It's a 24 pin wide DIP, and it's a
big tall block, not an IC.

Any ideas? I know that figuring out what it is won't let me magically
run the card on +5V, but it would make me feel better knowing why I
can't :)

Thanks,

Josh
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2002\11\02@225141 by Rick C.

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Sounds like a 5 to 9 volt switching supply.
Rick

Josh Koffman wrote:

{Quote hidden}

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2002\11\02@230351 by Dwayne Reid

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At 11:14 PM 11/2/02 -0600, Josh Koffman wrote:
>Hi all. So, in my PIC&Ethernet quest, I have aquired a bunch of NE2000
>cards based on the RTL8019AS chip. Some of them clearly have no
>connection to the +12V pin on the ISA bus - a bonus as then all I need
>is +5V. I do have a few cards that the +12V line is connected to though.
>However, they go to a component that I can't identify. I tried chipdir
>and a google search, and although there were some matches, there was no
>ID of what it might be. The closest thing was a product table for
>transformers. Question is, why would a transformer need +12? Anyway, the
>part number seems to be CFUS0509-C. It's a 24 pin wide DIP, and it's a
>big tall block, not an IC.

Sounds like the dc-dc convertor used on a lot of cards.  Apply 12V to the
appropriate pins on the edge connector and measure the output - I *think*
that its 5V out.

dwayne

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2002\11\02@232149 by William Chops Westfield

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    in my PIC&Ethernet quest, I have aquired a bunch of NE2000
   cards based on the RTL8019AS chip.  Some of them clearly have no
   connection to the +12V pin on the ISA bus - a bonus as then all I need
   is +5V. I do have a few cards that the +12V line is connected to though.
   However, they go to a component that I can't identify. I tried chipdir
   and a google search, and although there were some matches, there was no
   ID of what it might be. The closest thing was a product table for
   transformers. Question is, why would a transformer need +12? Anyway, the
   part number seems to be CFUS0509-C. It's a 24 pin wide DIP, and it's a
   big tall block, not an IC.

This is very likely to be an isolated 5V to 9V DC/DC converter.  I believe
that cards with an AUI (15 pin) connector will require 12V to power the
transceiver at the other end of the AUI cable (the requirement for 12V is
part of the AUI specification.)  Cards with "thinnet" connectors (10base2:
BNC connectors) use the 5V/9V converter to power the section of the circuit
that actually connects to the coax (and need to be at least somewhat
isolated from the PC's power supply.)  A card that does ONLY twisted pair
shouldn't need 12V OR the DC/DC converter.

You might look for some thinnet schematics/appnotes to confirm this; check
for vendors who actually make the tranceiver internals.

BillW

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2002\11\03@002427 by Peter L. Peres

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The mystery part is likely a dc/dc block converter that produces the
negative etc floating voltages for the line drivers.

Peter

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2002\11\03@011932 by Josh Koffman

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William Chops Westfield wrote:
Well, thank you all for the quick help! Armed with the possibility that
it might be putting out 9V, I checked out the specs on another chip on
the board, a MTD392. Turns out that the MTD392 is the coax transceiver,
and it specs out -9V as its input. So, the question is, what else on the
card might need 12V? Other than AUI I mean. I gather the manufacturer
wouldn't have put extra traces on the card for no reason. And, if I
don't plan on using coax, can I just forget about the 12V supply? I
guess the only real way to find out is to build my circuit with only 5V,
get it working on the card I have that I know doesn't use 12V, then try
it with one of these other cards. Bleh. I wish there was an easier way.
I suppose I could cut the trace on the board, then toss it into a PC.
Any other ideas?

Thanks!

Josh
--
A common mistake that people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools.
       -Douglas Adams


> This is very likely to be an isolated 5V to 9V DC/DC converter.  I believe
> that cards with an AUI (15 pin) connector will require 12V to power the
> transceiver at the other end of the AUI cable (the requirement for 12V is
> part of the AUI specification.)  Cards with "thinnet" connectors (10base2:
> BNC connectors) use the 5V/9V converter to power the section of the circuit
> that actually connects to the coax (and need to be at least somewhat
> isolated from the PC's power supply.)  A card that does ONLY twisted pair
> shouldn't need 12V OR the DC/DC converter.

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2002\11\03@013007 by Josh Koffman

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Also, if anyone has the pinout for the CFUS0509-C I could identify and
trace the output. I forgot to ask before.

BTW, BillW didn't write the last email from me...was a quoting mistake
on my part :)

Josh
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completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools.
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2002\11\03@021741 by William Chops Westfield

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   I gather the manufacturer wouldn't have put extra traces on the card
   for no reason.

A lot of the inexpensive ethernet cards I've seen have "clever" PCB designs
that allow the same PCB to be used for different transceiever options
depending one which components are populated (ie if FULLY populated, they
do AUI, 10base2, and 10baseT all on one card.)  They might also allow for
the 9V converter to be run from either 5V or 12V inputs, depending on
availability/etc.


   And, if I don't plan on using coax, can I just forget about the 12V
   supply?

I *think* so.  I've not actually designed a PC ethernet card...


   I guess the only real way to find out is to build my circuit
   with only 5V, get it working on the card I have that I know doesn't
   use 12V, then try it with one of these other cards.

Well, you COULD find the actual datasheet(s) for all the components...

BillW

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2002\11\03@023236 by Josh Koffman

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Comments within...

William Chops Westfield wrote:
> A lot of the inexpensive ethernet cards I've seen have "clever" PCB designs
> that allow the same PCB to be used for different transceiever options
> depending one which components are populated (ie if FULLY populated, they
> do AUI, 10base2, and 10baseT all on one card.)  They might also allow for
> the 9V converter to be run from either 5V or 12V inputs, depending on
> availability/etc.

That might make sense. This card has external connectors for 10base2 and
10baseT. AUI is brought out to a 16 pin IDC header on the card. I do
have another card with a 12V - 9V converter. While the converter that's
on this one is large, it doesn't have all the pins. In fact, it is
lacking most of them. I could understand if there was another converter
that plopped in instead of the 5V-9V.

>
>     And, if I don't plan on using coax, can I just forget about the 12V
>     supply?
>
> I *think* so.  I've not actually designed a PC ethernet card...

Interesting...

>     I guess the only real way to find out is to build my circuit
>     with only 5V, get it working on the card I have that I know doesn't
>     use 12V, then try it with one of these other cards.
>
> Well, you COULD find the actual datasheet(s) for all the components...

Well, I have done websearches on the remaining components. Some I
couldn't find datasheets on, but I think I have identified at least
their types. In addition to the RTL8019AS chip and the convertor, there
is the MTD392 coax driver and two things I believe I have identified as
transformers. Oh, and a 93LC46 for configuration info. So...nothing I
can figure out that needs 12V...

Thanks,

Josh
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completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools.
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2002\11\03@063143 by Mike Harrison

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This is an isolated DC-DC converter, used to produce the -9V supply
for  BNC and AUI (D15) connections. the part number implies that it's
a 5V to 9V converter (this is almost universal), so I doubt it's
running from 12V (unless through a 5v regulator)

On Sat, 2 Nov 2002 23:14:38 -0600, you wrote:

{Quote hidden}

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