Post by thread:[EE]: Advanced Circuits and panelizing

Hi, This is a continuation of the GerbMerge thread, I just wanted to share some of my findings so far. To give you some background on the project: I have three PCB designs, each board is 3x4 inches, double sided. I would strongly prefer to have the boards by December 21, 2005 (in 12 days). Some people suggested Olimex, citing low cost and free panelizing as the main advantage. However, the dimensions are 6.3" x 3.9" -- enough space for only one 3x4 board. Moreover, since they are in Bulgaria, I'll pay ~$25 for Global Express and still won't get the boards until after Christmas. Having had previous experience with them, I must also add that while the quality is acceptable, Olimex's boards are no match for Advanced Circuit's. So today I called Advanced Circuits, and here's what I found out: - If I submit a panelized design, there will be an extra charge of $50. - They can also panelize the boards for me, for a flat fee of $50. - Maximum size is 60 sq. in., they said they can do 4 x 15" (5 boards). The girl in tech support said they can do other dimensions as well, as long as the area is rectangular and doesn't exceed the maximum size. Of course -- no internal routing, no scoring, no mouse bites, no slots or overlapping drill hits. Assuming I submit the files tomorrow, they'll ship the boards next Friday. It's interesting to note that even if I submitted the files first thing in the morning, or even the night before, that whole day is considered "Day 0", and is not included in the 5-day lead time. Perhaps someone will find the information useful.. Best regards, Vitaliy P.S. AC also offer 24-hour technical support -- a big plus when you're facing a deadline. P.P.S. I am not a compensated endorser for Advanced Circuits.

Another (largely) satisfied AC customer here. One warning, though: last time I used their freedfm.com (which presumably meshes tightly with their production line), it gave me scads of errors because my program (Proteus by Labcenter)(also very highly recommended) didn't generate a '+' in front of each positive value in the drill file. Manually adding the '+'s fixed it. Next time I'll set the origin upper left, so all values are negative... Mike H.

Vitaliy wrote: > Hi, > > This is a continuation of the GerbMerge thread, I just wanted to share > some > of my findings so far. To give you some background on the project: I have > t..... Thanks for the info... jives with my experience, although I did not know they would panelize for you. I used Gerbermerge, with modifications to let me have different spacings in x & y, and got charged the extra $50. Advanced circuits do good work. Cheers, David

> This is a continuation of the GerbMerge thread but did you succees in your gerb-merging? > no internal routing that means: you'll have to cut yourself? Wouter van Ooijen -- ------------------------------------------- Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl consultancy, development, PICmicro products docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu

Wouter van Ooijen wrote: {Quote hidden}>>This is a continuation of the GerbMerge thread >> >> > >but did you succees in your gerb-merging? > > > >>no internal routing >> >> > >that means: you'll have to cut yourself? > >Wouter van Ooijen > >-- ------------------------------------------- >Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl >consultancy, development, PICmicro products >docent Hogeschool van Utrecht: http://www.voti.nl/hvu > > > > This meant I had to cut myself. I used a (borrowed) heavy duty metal shear. I also cut a few on a heavy duty paper shear. The other hightly recommended method is with a wet tile cutter -- the water bath absorbs the dust. They are quite inexpensive. David

"Wouter van Ooijen" wrote: > but did you succees in your gerb-merging? I haven't had much time to play with GerbMerge (I've just finished routing the boards), but I did save your e-mail and will come back to it when the need arises. At this point, the path of least resistance works for me (haven't been getting much sleep lately). >> no internal routing > > that means: you'll have to cut yourself? Yup. But I do not expect this to be a problem, as I've used a paper shear to cut PCBs before. Vitaliy

Vitaliy wrote: > Yup. But I do not expect this to be a problem, as I've used a paper > shear to cut PCBs before. So what is your ultimate cost from Advanced Circuits for fabricating how many panels that will yield how many of your final boards? I'm asking because I'm curious how that will compare to separate low cost prototype services for the 3 boards. ****************************************************************** Embed Inc, Littleton Massachusetts, (978) 742-9014. #1 PIC consultant in 2004 program year. http://www.embedinc.com/products

On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:14:44AM -0500, Olin Lathrop wrote: > Vitaliy wrote: > >Yup. But I do not expect this to be a problem, as I've used a paper > >shear to cut PCBs before. > > So what is your ultimate cost from Advanced Circuits for fabricating how > many panels that will yield how many of your final boards? I'm asking > because I'm curious how that will compare to separate low cost prototype > services for the 3 boards. Well one example would be something I did recently. 72 1.5" x 2" boards with the Bare Bones Proto PCB's. Worked out to a unit price of $2.11 per board. I worked it out, and every other way to do it would have actually cost more, because they charge by the area of the board with one setup fee for the whole run. So if you panelize them yourself you get charged for the kerf, IE the sawcut space and it makes it a little more expensive, and a lot more work. -- spam_OUTpeteTakeThisOuTpetertodd.ca http://www.petertodd.ca

> Vitaliy wrote: >> Yup. But I do not expect this to be a problem, as I've used a paper >> shear to cut PCBs before. > > So what is your ultimate cost from Advanced Circuits for fabricating how > many panels that will yield how many of your final boards? I'm asking > because I'm curious how that will compare to separate low cost prototype > services for the 3 boards. The girl in tech support misinformed me. When I called Sales in the morning, the rep informed me that they will *allow* me to panelize the boards for $50, but they won't panelize anything for me. I'm sure they can, for a separate engineering charge, but I did not bother to ask them how much they'd want for it. I went back and figured out how to use GerbMerge -- it wasn't that difficult once I understood the theory behind it (thanks Wouter!). In the process, I realized that I need 0.125 margins between the boards, which would reduce the number of boards that I can panelize to four instead of five (due to the 60 sq. in. limit), and I was having some minor difficulties with GerbMerge (which I resolved three days later). Of Friday, I was feeling sick, hungry, and cranky from working for 20 straight hours -- so I went ahead and placed three separate orders for each of the boards. To answer your question -- in my particular case, if I panelized the boards (four 3x4" boards per panel), I would have paid $33x3 + $50 = $150 for three panels (12 boards). Since they charge $50 for multiple part numbers, it costs $33x3 + $50 = $150 to build three boards. Best regards, Vitaliy

On 14 Dec 2005 at 11:52, Vitaliy wrote: > I went back and figured out how to use GerbMerge -- it wasn't that difficult > once I understood the theory behind it Hi Vitaliy, In the past when I've put multiple boards into one board, I always cut and pasted the designs together from within the PCB program. Is this not possible with the PCB software you are using, or do you not have the original designs? -Bob