Post by thread:[EE]: MAX232 -- TI vs. Maxim.

I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the MAX232 for only $0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI claims that it's a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if this is really a drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that need to be worked around? Cheers, -Neil. -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email spam_OUTlistservTakeThisOuTmitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

Picdude wrote: > I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the MAX232 for only > $0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI claims that it's > a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if this is really a > drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that need to be worked > around? It would be wise to check the data sheets for recommended capacitor values for both manufacturers. ESD protection may be different too. David... -- ___________________________________________ David Duffy Audio Visual Devices P/L U8, 9-11 Trade St, Cleveland 4163 Australia Ph: +61 7 38210362 Fax: +61 7 38210281 New Web: http://www.audiovisualdevices.com.au ___________________________________________ -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email .....listservKILLspam@spam@mitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

Wow! That was fast. Anyway, I actually did look at TI's datasheet, and the caps are the same 1uf as with the Maxim part I've used. I believe Maxim has a smaller-cap version, though I've never used that. Haven't looked at ESD protection.... hmmm... I'll investigate what the implications are of this. Cheers, -Neil. On Tuesday 24 June 2003 04:58, David Duffy scribbled: {Quote hidden}> Picdude wrote: > > I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the MAX232 for > > only $0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI claims > > that it's a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if > > this is really a drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that > > need to be worked around? > > It would be wise to check the data sheets for recommended capacitor > values for both manufacturers. ESD protection may be different too. > David... -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email listservKILLspammitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

>Anyway, I actually did look at TI's datasheet, and the caps are the >same 1uf as with the Maxim part I've used. I believe Maxim has a >smaller-cap version, though I've never used that. Check the MAX202E, it will use 0.1uF caps, and I believe is pin compatible to the MAX232. However I think you will find that the smaller cap parts are more expensive, and the "no-cap" parts even more expensive. Pay to lay out the PCB so it will take 0.1uF or 1uF ceramic caps. If you want to have 3V or 3V and 5V operation check the MAX3232E. The capacitor value varies a bit depending which voltage you want, but they do have a value that allows dual voltage operation if desired. Could be useful for battery powered equipment running off 3 AA cells, with a diode in series with the battery to allow 5V operation off a wall wart. >Haven't looked at ESD protection.... hmmm... I'll investigate >what the implications are of this. All the MAXxxxE parts have 15kV ESD protection. IIRC this is right across the product range, not just the 232 series parts. -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email .....listservKILLspam.....mitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

On 24 Jun 2003 at 11:22, Alan B. Pearce wrote: > >Anyway, I actually did look at TI's datasheet, and the caps are the > >same 1uf as with the Maxim part I've used. I believe Maxim has a > >smaller-cap version, though I've never used that. > > Check the MAX202E, it will use 0.1uF caps, and I believe is pin > compatible to the MAX232. However I think you will find that the > smaller cap parts are more expensive, and the "no-cap" parts even more > expensive. Pay to lay out the PCB so it will take 0.1uF or 1uF ceramic > caps. My favourite part is presently the ST202E. They use 0.1uF caps, have 15kV ESD protection and are pretty cheap. I used ST202ECD which is an SO-16 package and they cost me NZ$1.15ea for 100 (less than US$0.70ea). You can get then in DIP as well, suffix EAN, EBN or ECN. -- Brent Brown, Electronic Design Solutions 16 English Street, Hamilton, New Zealand Ph/fax: +64 7 849 0069 Mobile/txt: 025 334 069 eMail: EraseMEbrent.brownspam_OUTTakeThisOuTclear.net.nz -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email listservspam_OUTmitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

At 10:56 PM 6/24/2003 +1200, you wrote: >My favourite part is presently the ST202E. They use 0.1uF caps, have >15kV ESD protection and are pretty cheap. I used ST202ECD which is an >SO-16 package and they cost me NZ$1.15ea for 100 (less than >US$0.70ea). You can get then in DIP as well, suffix EAN, EBN or ECN. Ditto. You can get them from FAI, or if price isn't that important, Mouser in the USofA. Dunno why Maxim's prices are so much higher. Best regards, Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" @spam@speffKILLspaminterlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email KILLspamlistservKILLspammitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

TI has a justified reputation for rugged, available components, almost always at good prices. Check the datasheet to be sure, but I'd go for it. If the expense of 1uF caps are too much, don't use tantalum, just use aluminum; for this task they'll work fine and are as cheap as 0.1uF caps. BTW, the non-cap versions have caused us noise (radiation) problems when cables were attached to the RS232 outputs, and we had to drop back to the 202 versions instead. Watch those guys closely when getting radiation tests performed. --Bob At 04:52 AM 6/24/2003 -0500, you wrote: {Quote hidden}>I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the MAX232 for only >$0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI claims that it's >a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if this is really a >drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that need to be worked >around? > >Cheers, >-Neil. > >-- >http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! >email RemoveMElistservTakeThisOuTmitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email spamBeGonelistservspamBeGonemitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

Unless you have a particularly unusual requirement, you should be fine with either. I acquired some MAX3221s recently for a design. -marc On 24/6/03 05:52, "Picdude" <TakeThisOuTpicdudeEraseMEspam_OUTNARWANI.ORG> wrote: {Quote hidden}> I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the MAX232 for only > $0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI claims that it's > a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if this is really a > drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that need to be worked > around? > > Cheers, > -Neil. > > -- > http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! > email RemoveMElistservTakeThisOuTmitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body > > -------------------------------------------------- Marc Nicholas Geekythings Inc. C/416.543.4896 UNIX, Database, Security and Networking Consulting -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email listservEraseME.....mitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

At 05:09 AM 6/24/2003 -0700, you wrote: >TI has a justified reputation for rugged, available components, almost >always at good prices. Check the datasheet to be sure, but I'd go for it. > >If the expense of 1uF caps are too much, don't use tantalum, just use >aluminum; for this task they'll work fine and are as cheap as 0.1uF caps. <snip> "Semiconductor" ceramics are getting pretty cheap in that size- 1uF/16V Y5V 0805 (SMT) are only about 11 cents US in small quantity (100 pcs). I prefer the type of chip (202E?) that uses 0.1uF but even those will benefit from having larger caps (see data sheet for details). Best regards, Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" EraseMEspeffinterlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email RemoveMElistservEraseMEEraseMEmitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

On 24/6/03 08:08, "Marc Nicholas" <RemoveMEmarcspam_OUTKILLspamGEEKYTHINGS.COM> wrote: > Unless you have a particularly unusual requirement, you should be fine with > either. > > I acquired some MAX3221s recently for a design. (Because I needed the functionality of the 3221...should have finished my own sentence, but (!coffee(morning)) == bad_things) -------------------------------------------------- Marc Nicholas Geekythings Inc. C/416.543.4896 UNIX, Database, Security and Networking Consulting -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email RemoveMElistservTakeThisOuTspammitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Axtell" <EraseMEcr_axtellspamspamBeGoneYAHOO.COM> To: <RemoveMEPICLISTKILLspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU> Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 5:09 AM Subject: Re: [EE]: MAX232 -- TI vs. Maxim. > BTW, the non-cap versions have caused us noise (radiation) problems when > cables were attached to the RS232 outputs, and we had to drop back to the > 202 versions instead. Watch those guys closely when getting radiation tests > performed. Are you refering to the DS275 by any chance? :( John > > --Bob > > At 04:52 AM 6/24/2003 -0500, you wrote: > >I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the MAX232 for only > >$0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI claims that it's > >a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if this is really a {Quote hidden}> >drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that need to be worked > >around? > > > >Cheers, > >-Neil. > > > >-- > >http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! > >email listservSTOPspamspam_OUTmitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body > > -- > http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! > email spamBeGonelistservSTOPspamEraseMEmitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email KILLspamlistservspamBeGonemitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

On Tue, Jun 24, 2003 at 07:37:50AM -0400, Spehro Pefhany wrote: > At 10:56 PM 6/24/2003 +1200, you wrote: > > >My favourite part is presently the ST202E. They use 0.1uF caps, have > >15kV ESD protection and are pretty cheap. I used ST202ECD which is an > >SO-16 package and they cost me NZ$1.15ea for 100 (less than > >US$0.70ea). You can get then in DIP as well, suffix EAN, EBN or ECN. > > Ditto. You can get them from FAI, or if price isn't that important, > Mouser in the USofA. > > Dunno why Maxim's prices are so much higher. That's easy. Brand name. It's the same answer as to why Intel CPUs are generally 30% higher in price than their corresponding AMD counterparts. I call it the Lexus syndrome. Lexus(es?) are generally $10-15 thousand USD higher than a high end Toyota, but have very nearly the same characteristics and parts. So I figure you're paying the extra money for the Lexus symbol! BAJ -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email EraseMElistservEraseMEmitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

At 11:54 AM 6/24/2003 -0400, you wrote: >That's easy. Brand name. It's the same answer as to why Intel CPUs are >generally 30% higher in price than their corresponding AMD counterparts. Sure, for onesy-twosies. They must also discount aggressively in quantity for factory orders- I've seen the Maxim parts in volume products, and the difference is too large! There are also minor compatibility issues with AMD CPUs, even today. >I call it the Lexus syndrome. Lexus(es?) are generally $10-15 thousand USD >higher than a high end Toyota, but have very nearly the same characteristics >and parts. So I figure you're paying the extra money for the Lexus symbol! Do they offer "Maxim inside" stickers? ;-) I'd worry about lead times.. ;-) Best regards, Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" @spam@speff@spam@spam_OUTinterlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email spamBeGonelistservKILLspammitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

At 04:52 AM 6/24/03 -0500, Picdude wrote: >I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the MAX232 for only >$0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI claims that it's >a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if this is really a >drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that need to be worked >around? No issues that I've seen. I, too, use the TI versions of many parts: max232 and lt1013 come immediately to mind but there are others. The TI parts have met or exceeded the original specs and are much less expensive. Go for it - you should have no problems at all. dwayne -- Dwayne Reid <.....dwaynerspam_OUTplanet.eon.net> Trinity Electronics Systems Ltd Edmonton, AB, CANADA (780) 489-3199 voice (780) 487-6397 fax Celebrating 19 years of Engineering Innovation (1984 - 2003) .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .-. .- `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' `-' Do NOT send unsolicited commercial email to this email address. This message neither grants consent to receive unsolicited commercial email nor is intended to solicit commercial email. -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email TakeThisOuTlistserv.....TakeThisOuTmitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

If you are experimenting/prototyping I'v found the TI samples services to be very usefull. Up to 8 different IC's in each "order" and up to 10 of each typ (or up to 3 for the more unusual types). Maxim has a maximum of 3 types at a time and you can not specify the amount (you get two of each). (I just ckecked, and the RS232 interface line is available as samples from TI.) Jan-Erik. -- http://www.piclist.com#nomail Going offline? Don't AutoReply us! email TakeThisOuTlistservKILLspamspammitvma.mit.edu with SET PICList DIGEST in the body

Folks, Thanks for the responses. Seems like TI is good to go. I've decided to pick up a couple of the TI parts, one Maxim (on reserve, just in case I ever need to compare behaviour), and I'm still looking into the ST202. Cheers, -Neil. On Tuesday 24 June 2003 04:52, Picdude scribbled: > I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the MAX232 for only > $0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI claims that > it's a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if this is > really a drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that need to be > worked around? > > Cheers, > -Neil. -- http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList .....piclist-unsubscribe-requestRemoveMEmitvma.mit.edu>

On Tuesday 24 June 2003 16:07, Jan-erik Söderholm (QAC) scribbled: > If you are experimenting/prototyping I'v found the > TI samples services to be very usefull. Up to 8 > different IC's in each "order" and up to 10 of each > typ (or up to 3 for the more unusual types). Maxim > has a maximum of 3 types at a time and you can not specify > the amount (you get two of each). > > (I just ckecked, and the RS232 interface line is available > as samples from TI.) > > Jan-Erik. TI's sample service is indeed quick & excellent, but they are a pain to deal with, since they hide behind their website. One slight deviation or problem from what they consider to be a *perfect* system/site, and things become a mess..... Forgot my password, and the "Forgot password" system was broken, telling me my email was invalid (though I still receive emails from them at that same address). I could find no web-issues support on their website. No phone to call, so spent about 45 mins tracking someone down thru their investor relations department. Found lots of IT depts in the process, some even responsible for the website, but none could tell me who could fix the problem. I ended up leaving some info on their general comments page (this is the only place that I ever gave any of my contact info). A few days later, I get an email stating my password was reset. Within the next few days, I get other emails from different people stating the password was reset again. And another a week later. I had one email name, and begged them to just stop, since in the middle of all that I had changed my password already. Some time later, I get a call from a lady requesting feedback on the samples, so after giving that info to her, I mentioned that their web support was a pain, and explained why. Well, she decided to pass along my comments, and a few days later, I get another email stating my password was again reset. Arrrggghhh!!! Since then I haven't touched their site, and prefer to pay $0.90 for the parts from Digikey. Cheers, -Neil. -- http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList RemoveMEpiclist-unsubscribe-requestspamBeGonemitvma.mit.edu>

> -----Original Message----- > From: Byron A Jeff [SMTP:spamBeGonebyron@spam@spam_OUTCC.GATECH.EDU] > Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 4:54 PM > To: TakeThisOuTPICLISTspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU > Subject: Re: [EE]: MAX232 -- TI vs. Maxim. > > I call it the Lexus syndrome. Lexus(es?) > Surely Lexi is the plural :-) Mike ======================================================================= This e-mail is intended for the person it is addressed to only. The information contained in it may be confidential and/or protected by law. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, you must not make any use of this information, or copy or show it to any person. Please contact us immediately to tell us that you have received this e-mail, and return the original to us. Any use, forwarding, printing or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. No part of this message can be considered a request for goods or services. ======================================================================= Any questions about Bookham's E-Mail service should be directed to postmasterEraseMEbookham.com. -- http://www.piclist.com hint: To leave the PICList RemoveMEpiclist-unsubscribe-requestEraseMEspam_OUTmitvma.mit.edu>

No, it was a capless Maxim part. The number eludes me now. It was the capless version of Max211CWI, which works fine. They didn't detect the radiation until they attached wires to an RS232 output. I didn't do the radiation test, my client's engineer caught it. My guess is that the frequency is so high that with wires attached, it becomes a tuned antenna. Big surprise, but it made sense. It could have been crushed with an RF choke, but four 7cent caps are cheaper- and the transceiver is cheaper, too. Its possible that Maxim never knew it, because unloaded (no inductance) it's quiet. My clients are mostly involved with law enforcement (governments) and inadvertant emissions can't be allowed. --Bob At 06:32 AM 6/24/2003 -0700, you wrote: >{Original Message removed}

> I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the > MAX232 for only > $0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI > claims that it's > a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if > this is really a > drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that need to > be worked around? I have mixed max232, icl232, hin232, st232 without any problems. Wouter van Ooijen -- ------------------------------------------- Van Ooijen Technische Informatica: http://www.voti.nl consultancy, development, PICmicro products -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

I've used literally hundreds of the TI & ST 232 chips with no problems. Steve Ruse > > I've noticed recently that Digikey has TI's version of the > > MAX232 for only > > $0.90 each, compared with a few $ for Maxim's versions. TI > > claims that it's > > a replacement for the Maxim part, but do any of you know if > > this is really a > > drop-in replacement, or if there are any issues that need to > > be worked around? -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads

At 06:37 PM 6/26/2003 -0400, you wrote: >I've used literally hundreds of the TI & ST 232 chips with no problems. BTW, I recently had an ST3232B die on an adapter cable, probably from plugging in the CMOS-level inputs. That side probably isn't as well protected against ESD-induced latchup. Always a PITA when development stuff goes TU. Of course one should not release anything to the field like that. Best regards, Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" EraseMEspeff@spam@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com -- http://www.piclist.com hint: PICList Posts must start with ONE topic: [PIC]:,[SX]:,[AVR]: ->uP ONLY! [EE]:,[OT]: ->Other [BUY]:,[AD]: ->Ads