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> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: "Oli Glaser" <EraseMEoli.glaserspam_OUTTakeThisOuTtalktalk.net>
> To: "Microcontroller discussion list - Public." <piclistspam_OUTmit.edu>
> Date: Wed, 7 Jul 2010 01:34:34 +0100
>
> Subject: [EE] Datasheet frustration
>
> I'm used to datasheets not giving enough info and getting the odd thing
> wrong, but I was wondering if I'm missing something with this one.
> Basically if you look at the PCB guide at bottom left, I'm wondering how
> they can give exact measurements to the *back* of the panel the XLR socket
> is attached to (I know it doesn't specifically say it it the panel, but I
> have seen other sheets from neutrik where it is labeled)
>
> Doesn't it depend on how thick the panel material is? Surely it would be
> better to give measurements from the front of the panel instead so you
> have
> a fixed point of reference? (as it is always in the same place in relation
> to the socket)
>
> The panel would be just behind the third vertical line from the right in
> the
> top middle diagram, so if that bit is roughly the same width as the front
> protrusion, then it will be 19 - 2.7 = 16.3mm from the back, but it says
> 17.78 on the bottom left diagram, which is not even accounting for panel
> thickness??
>
> If anyone can see where I'm going wrong here, or whether they may have
> messed it up, I would really appreciate it as I can't simply measure a
> real
> one due to there being a 3 week wait on stock, and I have to get the
> boards
> designed now. I know I can just do rough calculations but and get near,
> but
> I would like to be precise if possible.
>

> On 7/07/2010 1:34 PM, Oli Glaser wrote:
>> I'm used to datasheets not giving enough info and getting the odd thing
>> wrong, but I was wondering if I'm missing something with this one.
>> Basically if you look at the PCB guide at bottom left, I'm wondering how
>> they can give exact measurements to the *back* of the panel the XLR
>> socket
>> is attached to (I know it doesn't specifically say it it the panel, but I
>> have seen other sheets from neutrik where it is labeled)
>
> The 2.7mm part is what sticks through the panel.  The 19mm is from the
> rear of the panel to the rear of the connector.
> David...

> On 7/07/2010 2:02 PM, Oli Glaser wrote:
>> I see how it works if only the round part sticks through and the screw
>> part
>> goes behind the panel, but the others don't do it like this (in fact I
>> can't
>> remember seeing an XLR that does it like that) and their datasheet is the
>> same, with measurements taken from rear of panel, and the screw parts on
>> the
>> front.
>>
>
> All the ones we use mount from behind, with the round section protruding
> through the panel hole.  The screws go through the panel from the front
> and screw into the XLR body.
> David...

>> On 7/07/2010 2:02 PM, Oli Glaser wrote:
>>> I see how it works if only the round part sticks through and the screw
>>> part
>>> goes behind the panel, but the others don't do it like this (in fact
>>> I can't
>>> remember seeing an XLR that does it like that) and their datasheet
>>> is the
>>> same, with measurements taken from rear of panel, and the screw
>>> parts on the
>>> front.
>>>
>>
>> All the ones we use mount from behind, with the round section protruding
>> through the panel hole.  The screws go through the panel from the front
>> and screw into the XLR body.
>> David...
>
> Fair enough then - what kind are they? Are they Switchcraft?
> The ones I have used recently certainly don't (unless I'm hugely
> mistaken as I have a couple of pieces of equipment that mount similar
> connectors on the front too) but it's possible this one does -
> although the question is still valid for the one I used before (attached)
> I've attached the relevant bits of the datasheet for the one I have
> used recently which almost certainly is intended to mount on the front
> - it has a release catch which would be hard to push otherwise, and
> has the Neutrik logo stamped on the surround part too.

> On 7/07/2010 2:41 PM, Oli Glaser wrote:
>>> On 7/07/2010 2:02 PM, Oli Glaser wrote:
>>>> I see how it works if only the round part sticks through and the screw
>>>> part
>>>> goes behind the panel, but the others don't do it like this (in fact
>>>> I can't
>>>> remember seeing an XLR that does it like that) and their datasheet
>>>> is the
>>>> same, with measurements taken from rear of panel, and the screw
>>>> parts on the
>>>> front.
>>>>
>>>
>>> All the ones we use mount from behind, with the round section protruding
>>> through the panel hole.  The screws go through the panel from the front
>>> and screw into the XLR body.
>>> David...
>>
>> Fair enough then - what kind are they? Are they Switchcraft?
>> The ones I have used recently certainly don't (unless I'm hugely
>> mistaken as I have a couple of pieces of equipment that mount similar
>> connectors on the front too) but it's possible this one does -
>> although the question is still valid for the one I used before (attached)
>> I've attached the relevant bits of the datasheet for the one I have
>> used recently which almost certainly is intended to mount on the front
>> - it has a release catch which would be hard to push otherwise, and
>> has the Neutrik logo stamped on the surround part too.
>
> The ones we normally use are Neutrik and Alcatel.  One of my guys fitted
> an RJ45 (XLR body) to a plastic box only yesterday with no problem.  I
> would guess the box wall is 2.5mm thick.
>
> I think you'll find that the release push allows for panel thicknesses
> of up to a few mm.  Obviously the thinner the better though.
> David...

> On 7/07/2010 4:53 PM, Oli Glaser wrote:
>> Do you have a couple of part numbers for comparison purposes? I may
>> consider
>> fitting them like this too as an option for other stuff in the future -
>> adds
>> some more choice looks wise.
>>
>> I suppose the question is whether they are "intended" to be mounted on
>> front
>> or back - there is no indication in the datasheets and I mount mine on
>> the
>> front and have seen plenty of others done this way, and you mount yours
>> on
>> the back so I assume others do that also. Would be nice to get an idea of
>> what the measurements/diagrams are intending.
>> If you look at the previous datasheet clip, it says 22.5mm from back of
>> panel to pins, but on the side view it has 21.7 + 2.3 = 24mm from where
>> back
>> of panel would be to same pins? Either way round it doesn't seem to add
>> up,
>> which is what is really bugging me :-)
>>
>
> No idea on the P/N's off the top of my head.
>
> You really do need to get a sample and eyeball it for yourself I think.
>
> If it's out of stock, get another version (diff pins?) maybe?
> David...

> At 09:34 PM 7/6/2010, Oli Glaser wrote:
>
>>I'm used to datasheets not giving enough info and getting the odd thing
>>wrong, but I was wondering if I'm missing something with this one.
>>Basically if you look at the PCB guide at bottom left, I'm wondering how
>>they can give exact measurements to the *back* of the panel the XLR socket
>>is attached to (I know it doesn't specifically say it it the panel, but I
>>have seen other sheets from neutrik where it is labeled)
>
> I use a LOT of Neutrik connectors.
>
> The 3-pin chassis-mount connectors we use are nc3fp-1 & nc3mp.  I
> also use 4, 5, 6, 7 pin versions but nowhere near as many as the
> 3-pin connectors.
>
> The connectors I use are intended to be mounted to either the front
> or the rear of the panel they are mounted in.  They have a circular
> protrusion a little less than 15/16" diameter, which is the same size
> as the connector body.  Obviously, these connectors are NOT
> pcb-mounted.  We mount them in holes punched to 15/16" diameter.
>
> I've looked at the datasheets you provided and, quite frankly, they
> seem pretty clear to me.  I'm not sure what your question is, though.

> On 8/07/2010 7:55 AM, Oli Glaser wrote:
>> I agree the datasheets are clear in all other respects - it was just the
>> measurement from the back of panel etc I was wondering about, as I have
>> tried to explain in my previous posts if you look at them and the
>> attached
>> sheets. I'm just wondering how they can give accurate measurements if
>> they
>> do not know where the back of the panel will be in relation to the pins
>> etc,
>> as it depends on the panel thickness.
>> Obviously this only applies to PCB mounted versions, I use the solder tab
>> versions a lot as well.
>> It's not the biggest deal, and datasheets often leave you with a question
>> or
>> two unanswered which you can usually make an educated guess at. I was
>> just
>> curious more than anything, but it would be nice to have an accurate
>> measurement so I know exactly where the edge of my PCB will be in
>> relation
>> to the panel.
>>
>
> The short answer is that the PCB versions are intended to always mount
> from the rear.
> David...

> At 03:55 PM 7/7/2010, Oli Glaser wrote:
>
>>I agree the datasheets are clear in all other respects - it was just the
>>measurement from the back of panel etc I was wondering about
>
> I guess that is where the confusion comes in.
>
> Because the connector is mounted to the PC board, the connector
> mounts to the INSIDE of the enclosure.  In other words, it is the
> measurement from the BACK of the panel that is important.
>
> The actual panel thickness is irrelevant, so long is it not so thick
> as to impede movement of the female connector's release button.
>
> Does that make any sense?

> At 07:15 PM 7/7/2010, Oli Glaser wrote:
>
>>I was only confused as I thought they were intended to be mounted on the
>>*front* (as all the other solder tab versions tab I have used have been),
>>so
>>then the back of the panel as a reference to the pins etc moves depending
>>on
>>panel thickness.
>
> I guess the best way to look at it is this:  How would you install
> the entire PCB if it had to fit through that 15/16" diameter hole.
>
> Do keep in mind that Neutrik DOES make 2-part connectors where the
> guts of the connector mounts to the PCB but the connector shell
> mounts through the FRONT of the panel.  There is a little screw slot
> in the front middle of the connector guts that allows you to rotate a
> tab that locks the two pieces together.
>
> But - those are actually a pain in the A** to work with.

> At 08:28 PM 7/7/2010, Oli Glaser wrote:
>>Essentially we are using one 4-pin XLR for 48V and 24V power input, and 4,
>>3-pin XLR (2 male, two female) for input/output signals, all PCB mounted.
>
> Hi there.
>
> Not sure if you have already decided upon a pinout for the 4-pin
> connector yet, but you may want to consider that standard 12V & 24V
> camera / lighting battery belts use 4-pin connectors with gnd on pin1
> & V+ on pin4.
>
> Just something to keep in mind.
>
> Question: what are you building?